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Illegal Immigrates rights?

DeMaxx

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I Just read in TIME magazine where they are wanting to give in state tuition to illegal immigrates if they are attending college in the state where they are living!

Am I the only one that is seeing as very wrong? First these are people that are breaking the law being in the country illegally. There are ways to come to this country legally, and people that do so should be afforded every opportunity they can get.

People that come into this country illegally are plain and simply criminals. and should be given no rights as such. The government should be doing a better job of tracking these people down and removing them from the country.

1. They take jobs that people that are in the country legally, and citizens of this country deserve.
2. They use up our resources, gas, food, jobs, housing, and even get government aid that could be used to help citizens of the U.S..
3. It hurts national security not knowing who has entered the country.

It's a growing problem, that one hand is saying we need to help these people, and the other hand is ignoring it hoping it will go away.

Let us think of it this way. Someone that illegally enters the country. There must be a reason for that, or they would have went through proper channels to enter. Is that someone that we really want in our country to begin with? DeMaxx
 

debate_junkie

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I'm trying to remember, but I think wasn't it one of the states Supreme Courts who said it was unconstitutional to bar illegals from having driver's licenses?

Most of my lifetime, our borders are perpetrated. The government of Mexico advocates their own people busting into the US by any means, because then they come up here, work, and send the money back into Mexico's economy! It's sickening.

In 1967, the US Government tried to deport John Lennon on phoney drug charges because he was so outspoken against Vietnam... are we to believe our government has no power to stop this? Congress AND Bush need to get on the ball. 33 years of illegals in this country is ENOUGH for me.

(just checked. I was incorrect on the date... it was 72 when the FBI investigated him... I was 1 year old. What can I say? )
 
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Imudman

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Worrying about mexicans coming here to work is less important than worrying about a porous border through which terrorists can travel. I mean, we should control the borders in any case, but especially now. I find it hard to believe the government isn't doing anything about it. It really blows my mind. It's the one issue that exposes the fact we live in different country than we used to...
 

debate_junkie

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Imudman said:
Worrying about mexicans coming here to work is less important than worrying about a porous border through which terrorists can travel. I mean, we should control the borders in any case, but especially now. I find it hard to believe the government isn't doing anything about it. It really blows my mind. It's the one issue that exposes the fact we live in different country than we used to...

Not necessarily... mexicans and other illegals are commiting crimes on our shores. They're taking money from our economy, and helping another. These are ALL things to worry about, because it is factoring right into each and every one of our every day lives. ALL illegals, regardless of purpose for being here, are and should not be welcomed here with a sign at the border. And if you think people funneling in from Mexico isn't a problem, remember that same border that's wide open, COULD possibly let the next crew of Al Quaida flunkies into our country. It's ALL worriesome to any degree, terroristic or otherwise.
 

Imudman

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debate_junkie said:
Not necessarily... mexicans and other illegals are commiting crimes on our shores. They're taking money from our economy, and helping another. These are ALL things to worry about, because it is factoring right into each and every one of our every day lives. ALL illegals, regardless of purpose for being here, are and should not be welcomed here with a sign at the border. And if you think people funneling in from Mexico isn't a problem, remember that same border that's wide open, COULD possibly let the next crew of Al Quaida flunkies into our country. It's ALL worriesome to any degree, terroristic or otherwise.
If you re-read my post I think you'll find we agree. I only meant that mexicans coming here to work is less of a problem than the possibility of terrorism...
 

Naughty Nurse

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I don't know about the wider issues, but weren't the people who perpetrated 9/11 in the USA legally? Terrorists generally won't want to draw attention to themselves by being in a country illegally.


Illegal immigrants may cause many problems, but probably not related to terrorism.
 

Imudman

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Naughty Nurse said:
I don't know about the wider issues, but weren't the people who perpetrated 9/11 in the USA legally? Terrorists generally won't want to draw attention to themselves by being in a country illegally.


Illegal immigrants may cause many problems, but probably not related to terrorism.
Yes, 99.9% of illegal immigrants are not terrorists. It's that very small number that can come in along with the rest that worries me. Let's see, you're in England so you're probably unaware there are at least 10 million people here illegaly at any given time. Some say as many as 30 million. My guess is somewhere in the middle. That's a lot of people to keep track of. So many, in fact, that it's impossible. It's what makes me so worried that terrorists could be sneaking in right alongside the others...
 

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when will everyone wake up and realize that a system that hands out but does not take it will only fail! anyone else living in California knows this im sure. i just want to know how it got to the point that we're spending tax money on undocumented, non tax payers. not only does it waste our money, but it encourages illegal immigration and robs legal tax payers who need tuition programs or welfare. absolutely ridiculous. i already know someones going to come at me with the classic "well for every 1 million we spend on illegals, they produce 2 million in agriculture". not true anymore. the state of california is spending more money than were making by allowing illegals to work our ag. Vicente Fox needs to cowboy up and be a ******* leader to these people. how about helping your country instead of encouraging illegal immigration to the one one thats keeping you afloat? this man doesnt understand that when our economy takes a hit, theres does ten fold, and going off the way things are heading, were going to be hurting soon.

this is honestly something that drives me up a wall.
 
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ludahai

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Naughty Nurse said:
I don't know about the wider issues, but weren't the people who perpetrated 9/11 in the USA legally? Terrorists generally won't want to draw attention to themselves by being in a country illegally.
Being in the U.S. illegally doesn't draw much attention in most cases anyway.
 

ShamMol

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Does anyone else realzie that they do the jobs that we would never want to do? Honestly, they are the busboys, they are the cherry pickers (bad expression, you know what I mean). Or do you think Americans would want to do this for minimum wage.
 

stsburns

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We should protect the borders, and only give free passes to the ones with green cards. :mrgreen:
 

DeMaxx

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ShamMol said:
Does anyone else realzie that they do the jobs that we would never want to do? Honestly, they are the busboys, they are the cherry pickers (bad expression, you know what I mean). Or do you think Americans would want to do this for minimum wage.

That isn't true!They are taking jobs from alot of different area's. And yes Americans were doing this before the illegal immigrates. and will be doing them after they are gone. DeMaxx
 

ShamMol

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Illegal immigrants form the backbone of the economy in California, the fifth largest economy in the world. Imagine waht would happen if they just suddenly were all deported. Yeah, probably our entire US economy might go into recession.
 

Trismegistus

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This is a subject that challenges even the most thoughtful individuals. I believe the crux of any feasable solution resides in the term "illeagal" immigrants. This qualifier suggests that there is a "legal" variety of immigrant to be considered as well. The established lawful process by which an immigrant enters our country may not be perfect. However, it is still the accepted legal process. How could it be perfect? The sheer numbers of immigrants seeking to enter the US is staggering. Those that adhere to the law and persevere are rightly afforded the priveledge they seek. Meanwhile, countless others scoff at the system and enter regardless; thus cheapening the sacrifice and hard work of their legal counterparts. Are those illeagal immigrants desperate and suffering? Yes. However, so are our own people.
It is important to note that Mexico derives much of it's general income from illeagal immigrants working here. This is a fact. That means that those dollars no longer are circulated within our own country. On the surface, this may seem petty. Consider, though, the long term effects. I hear, from many of my friends, that the answer is more public money and involvement. Well, all public money begins as private money. Again, our own people are left with less of their piece of the American dream in order to subsidize the needs of those who have no legal basis for consuming those resources. I know plenty of Americans who find no loss of dignity in manual labor. The assertion that Americans are not hard working or not suffering is troubling. Indeed, many Americans would delight at the opportunity, but they require more wage and are usually overlooked, by employers, in favor of lower maintainence illeagal immigrants. Too late, the problem exists. What now? Well, I feel we should start by allowing no more illeagal immigrants in to the country.....period. It will take much more thought and comprimise to solve the problem of existing illeagal immigrants, however.
Let's enforce the existing laws first before we go any further.
 

DeMaxx

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ShamMol said:
Illegal immigrants form the backbone of the economy in California, the fifth largest economy in the world. Imagine waht would happen if they just suddenly were all deported. Yeah, probably our entire US economy might go into recession.

Even though California's is one of the largest in the world. Here is some other information you may find interesting about what illegal imigration is bringing to California.

Washington, D.C.—December 6, 2004) California, which has the nation's largest illegal immigrant population, is saddled with enormous costs for providing basic human services to this fast growing poor segment of the population. A new study, The Costs of Illegal Immigration to Californians examines the costs of education, health care and incarceration of illegal aliens, and concludes that the costs to Californians is $10.5 billion per year.
"California's addiction to 'cheap' illegal alien labor is bankrupting the state and posing enormous burdens on the state's shrinking middle class tax base," stated Dan Stein, President of FAIR. "Most Californians, who have seen their taxes increase while public services deteriorate, already know the impact that mass illegal immigration is having on their communities, but even they may be shocked when they learn just how much of a drain illegal immigration has become."
The illegal imigrates are doing more harm rather than good. Remember there is legal ways to come to this country. You are defending criminals. That are here illegally and by being here as so are being taken advantage of by being paid in many cases below minimum wage. Not to even mention of the money that is taken out of the U.S. economy and sent back to these aliens home country. DeMaxx
 

SoCalDiver

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I can't understand why this is even a debate. These are illegal (not undocumented) immigrants plain and simple. If we are to exist as a country of laws then we must enforce those laws. I would like nothing more than to see more immigrants (legal) coming into this wonderful country of ours. They are and have been the backbone of our society from the very beginning. With this said, we have to seal the borders and keep illegals out. They are draining our resources in countless ways. Not the least of with is our education system, emergency medical services (which they use as a first line care), jails/prisons, and police/security.

Just look at California as a prime example (I happen to live here so I have a good perspective on this). Our schools are failing our children because so many children of illegals are using up our precious classrooms. Not to mention I heard we are actually giving illegals in state tuitions! Huh? Does anyone else see the problem with this? Am I to believe that because someone is here illegally they get to pay less tuition than say someone coming from Nevada... this is just crazy. Now, take our hospitals... the illegals already have. Hospital emergency rooms are closing down because they can't afford to stay open because so many illegals are using them as a primary care facility. This madness has to stop... it is not worth all the cheap produce in the world.
 

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does anyone take into account the cultural implications of illegal immigration? what do you care more about, California's economy or the desecration of its culture? i live here, i grew up right in the middle of the wine country living in a wine business family. i know what illegals do for our economy, but i also know how what they can destroy. they dont come here to be american's, they come and separate themselves. they refuse to learn english, do not educate themselves and, per-capital, lead the pack in crimal deviance.
 
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ShamMol said:
Illegal immigrants form the backbone of the economy in California, the fifth largest economy in the world. Imagine waht would happen if they just suddenly were all deported. Yeah, probably our entire US economy might go into recession.
:funny
It's true that they do jobs we would never do for wages we would never work for but they still need to become a real citizen. Kick all the illegals outta here. Strengthen border security, or like in Arizona we will do it ourselves.
 

FiremanRyan

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ShamMol said:
Does anyone else realzie that they do the jobs that we would never want to do? Honestly, they are the busboys, they are the cherry pickers (bad expression, you know what I mean). Or do you think Americans would want to do this for minimum wage.
i hate this argument. why do we let this justify it?

and i can guarantee that there are enough Americans to do those jobs. deport every illegal and you'd still have enough poor Mexicans and people on welfare that could work the fields and wash the dishes. the problem is that they are legal and employers would have to pay them minimum wage and keep documentation, while the illegals work under the table for sub-minimum wage money.
 

Lilith

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ShamMol said:
Does anyone else realzie that they do the jobs that we would never want to do? Honestly, they are the busboys, they are the cherry pickers (bad expression, you know what I mean). Or do you think Americans would want to do this for minimum wage.
That's Bush's line. There are plenty willing to do the jobs. Plenty of legal immigrants, if not we spoiled Americans.
 

SoCalDiver

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ShamMol said:
Illegal immigrants form the backbone of the economy in California, the fifth largest economy in the world. Imagine waht would happen if they just suddenly were all deported. Yeah, probably our entire US economy might go into recession.
The above quote has got to be the most inane, irresponsible, and just plain stupid argument for illegal immigration. I wish these kool-aid liberals would at least come up with an argument that makes sense. Do you seriously believe Americans would not do those jobs? We are the most resourceful people on the planet. We will pick our own produce. The money we save in taxes will more than make up for the slight increase in produce. So, please stop making excuses for these criminals and let us have our America back.
 

Stherngntlmn

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$30 BILLION per year is being sent to mexico by hispanic people who are in this country legally and illegally. That's $30 BILLION/yr that will never be spent on an American business, and never be put into an American payroll check again.

There's no telling how many have diseases that the US has erraticated with vaccines, such as polio, TB, leprosy, or dengue. Do you really want US children being exposed to horrible diseases like that just so some guy can illegally enter the country to get a job picking fruit?

The increase in immigration flow from our southern borders is most definately not only a political concern, but an economic and public health and safety concern as well.


http://www.fairus.org/media/media.cfm?id=2435&c=34
http://rense.com/general63/illee.htm
 

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Stherngntlmn said:
There's no telling how many have diseases that the US has erraticated with vaccines, such as polio, TB, leprosy, or dengue. Do you really want US children being exposed to horrible diseases like that just so some guy can illegally enter the country to get a job picking fruit?
As far as I know there are no vaccines for leprosy or dengue. I do sooo look forward to being proved wrong.
 

DeMaxx

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Naughty Nurse said:
As far as I know there are no vaccines for leprosy or dengue. I do sooo look forward to being proved wrong.
Actually I'd had never heard of the Leprosy or the Dengue problem. So I did some net reserch. Stherngntlmn was right heres what I found.

World net daily

Apparently it is a problem there was hundreds of web pages and articles on this subject. I think your easily proven wrong.
 
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