If you don't press charges on a Domestic Violence complaint . . .

[X Factor]

I love it when you have them on the 911 recording screaming bloody murder about how he is beating the **** out of her and please hurry because he is going to kill her and you get there and take crimes scene photos of her with busted lips and black eyes and then when it gets to court she tries to deny that he ever touched her.

A lot of court's are trying to make it easier to prosecute cases with evidence like you describe but there is this tension between trying to protect people who won't protect themselves and a Defendant's Constitutional right to confont his accusers.

 

[X Factor]

W

Many of these people are rightfully more scared of the defendant than they are of a perjury charge. I know of at least two cases in New England where charges were dropped after the victim refused to testify against the defendant in the manner the DA wanted.

Are you implying the DA is trying get victims to lie or is it more likely that the DA is trying to get her to testify to what really happened?

 

[Tigger]

Are you implying the DA is trying get victims to lie or is it more likely that the DA is trying to get her to testify to what really happened?

I'm suggesting that there are different viewpoints on what constitutes abuse. Not everyone has the same panty-waisted view of how a home should be run that the Law does.

 

[X Factor]

I'm suggesting that there are different viewpoints on what constitutes abuse. Not everyone has the same panty-waisted view of how a home should be run that the Law does.

Yeah, imagine all those panty-waists believing that assaulting a woman should be illegal and punishable. To me, it's those that would assault a woman in the first place that are the panty-waists. They're the guys who probably cower in the corner the first time a man looks at them angrily. There's no courage in beating someone who's physically weaker.

 

[Tigger]

The problem is that we no longer recognize the difference between Discopline and Abuse. Regards of whether we are talking about children or women, there is (or should be) a level of discipline allowed to maintain order in the home. Without it you get what we have in Society today..... anarchy.

 

[X Factor]

The problem is that we no longer recognize the difference between Discopline and Abuse. Regards of whether we are talking about children or women, there is (or should be) a level of discipline allowed to maintain order in the home. Without it you get what we have in Society today..... anarchy.

Do you even realize what you're saying when you say stuff like that? You're essentially saying that women are basically the same as children. Unless you're willing to submit yourself to physical discipline as well, you're indicating that your partner (God help her) is something less than you are.

 

[Bodi]

I called the police on my wife who went insane with rage and attacked me in front of my daughters... she knows judo so she is not some sissy little chick. Anyway, the police show up and hear my story. She had left by then so they go give her a warning. I said that I didn't want to press charges and then they told me that they most likely wouldn't of arrested even if I wanted to. They concluded that I had "engineered the event" that sent her into a rage. My car wouldn't start in the downpour and she had to come get girls. So, not only were the cops sexist and not going to get her in trouble but they turned me, the victim, into the bully and her the attacking bully, into the victim!!

I am going to make a police complaint about that one.

Then when we were in court a couple years later the Judge did the same thing. For men, the system is VERY sexist. Men are treated like criminals before the situation is even understood by the police and Courts. I always respected cops and Judges until those experiences. Now I don't trust any of them. Bunch of sexist ****s.

 

[Ari]

The problem is that we no longer recognize the difference between Discopline and Abuse. Regards of whether we are talking about children or women, there is (or should be) a level of discipline allowed to maintain order in the home. Without it you get what we have in Society today..... anarchy.

If you have a problem with someone you talk to them. You don't physically assault them. Tell me how there's anarchy in the US?

 

[SMTA]

Do you even realize what you're saying when you say stuff like that? You're essentially saying that women are basically the same as children. Unless you're willing to submit yourself to physical discipline as well, you're indicating that your partner (God help her) is something less than you are.

Yup - just like chattel.

 

[Captain Adverse]

I called the police on my wife who went insane with rage and attacked me in front of my daughters... she knows judo so she is not some sissy little chick. Anyway, the police show up and hear my story. She had left by then so they go give her a warning. I said that I didn't want to press charges and then they told me that they most likely wouldn't of arrested even if I wanted to. They concluded that I had "engineered the event" that sent her into a rage. My car wouldn't start in the downpour and she had to come get girls. So, not only were the cops sexist and not going to get her in trouble but they turned me, the victim, into the bully and her the attacking bully, into the victim!!

I am going to make a police complaint about that one.

Then when we were in court a couple years later the Judge did the same thing. For men, the system is VERY sexist. Men are treated like criminals before the situation is even understood by the police and Courts. I always respected cops and Judges until those experiences. Now I don't trust any of them. Bunch of sexist ****s.

I've noticed that as well. For some reason people think women cannot be brutal too. Here's a couple of short vids of female domestic abuse:





My sister was a construction worker, a heavy machine operator, and she used to punch the hell out of her ex-husband when she got mad (hence the "ex"). He never fought back, but that didn't matter to her. Some women seem to think thay have a free pass to abuse men physically, and expect the men to take the blame if it gets out of hand.

The system assumes it's the man's fault as the "stronger sex." Fortunately some cops know better and try to assess the situation when they arrive, but not always.

 

[polgara]

Yup - just like chattel.

:lamo

That will bring the feminists out!

 

[calamity]

. . . you should be fined $500 first offense. $1000 second offense. Etc.

These are some of the most dangerous calls a LEO can respond to. What's with, "Help me!! Help me!! Help me!!!" And then cops arresting the aggressor and the victim not pressing charges?

We charge people for ambulance service . . . why not a fine (a charge) when some stupid wifey lets her husband bat her around, waste officers' time and then not follow through?

Plenty of stories where someone will help the victim of domestic violence and end up being attacked by the victim and the abuser as a result. Even cops have had this happen to them on calls. More than once.

 

[Bodi]

I've noticed that as well. For some reason people think women cannot be brutal too. Here's a couple of short vids of female domestic abuse:





My sister was a construction worker, a heavy machine operator, and she used to punch the hell out of her ex-husband when she got mad (hence the "ex"). He never fought back, but that didn't matter to her. Some women seem to think thay have a free pass to abuse men physically, and expect the men to take the blame if it gets out of hand.

The system assumes it's the man's fault as the "stronger sex." Fortunately some cops know better and try to assess the situation when they arrive, but not always.

Mine wasn't that bad but she did throw punches at my face which I blocked but she did connect with a side kick to my knee... that one hurt. It is the system that it is the man's fault that is BS. IT is changing but not fast enough.

 

[year2late]

. . . you should be fined $500 first offense. $1000 second offense. Etc.

These are some of the most dangerous calls a LEO can respond to. What's with, "Help me!! Help me!! Help me!!!" And then cops arresting the aggressor and the victim not pressing charges?

We charge people for ambulance service . . . why not a fine (a charge) when some stupid wifey lets her husband bat her around, waste officers' time and then not follow through?

It is a very complex problem. The suggestion really ignores the cycle of abuse .If the abused women presses charges and he is jailed - if there is not enough evidence - when he gets out (and he will) do you think he will all of a sudden improve his behavior and say "jeeezzzz honey I didn't realize how out of hand I got, so sorry" or do you think he will be more pissed than usual and wait for the ideal time to retaliate?

For the battered woman, if she feels she is in a tight spot, she may chose not to shake the boat and risk more harm .

They are not refusing to press charges out of convienience issues, they are frequently refusing because the understand the reality is that the rat bastard will get out and she may be in even more danger than usual.

Not saying what is right or wrong, just saying a battered woman may live in a survival mode we may not comprehend.

I had coworker that feared her husband. Normally he was just emotionally/verbally abusive. Occasionally he was physically abusive. She would come to work with bumps and bruises from "falls" He controlled the family assets to the extreme. She gradually was able to squirrel away household items and cash. He was never abusive to their son ..nor was he abusive in front of him (that she knew about). But when their son was 18 (and off to college) she "went to work" one day and actually was on a vacation to move far away. She had to wait through 10 years of verbal, emotional followed by physical abuse to feel safe and financially secure enough to leave.

We can judge all we want and act like she should have turned him in from the git go - but we were not the ones without resources and with a child.

It is all so complex, not sure that fining thevictim is the way to go.

 

[Tigger]

Do you even realize what you're saying when you say stuff like that? You're essentially saying that women are basically the same as children. Unless you're willing to submit yourself to physical discipline as well, you're indicating that your partner (God help her) is something less than you are.

I realize exactly what I'm saying. I'm indicating that there is a natural order to things in the world. Not everyone is the same, nor should we be, because we were never intended to be that way. Some people are designed to lead and others to follow. That's basic nature, physiology and psychology; pure and simple. Our problem as a society is that we've forgotten that fact of life.

If you have a problem with someone you talk to them. You don't physically assault them. Tell me how there's anarchy in the US?

You don't utilize corporal punishment as a first resort, but if it's not in the tool chest, then you've removed a major option in your ability to lead and to ensure things operate properly in society. We have compelte and total moral anarchy in the United States and have for the last 40-50 years. Considering that morality is the foundation of a society, much moreso than even the rule of law, our society is in anarchy here in the USA.

 

[Ari]

I realize exactly what I'm saying. I'm indicating that there is a natural order to things in the world. Not everyone is the same, nor should we be, because we were never intended to be that way. Some people are designed to lead and others to follow. That's basic nature, physiology and psychology; pure and simple. Our problem as a society is that we've forgotten that fact of life.



You don't utilize corporal punishment as a first resort, but if it's not in the tool chest, then you've removed a major option in your ability to lead and to ensure things operate properly in society. We have compelte and total moral anarchy in the United States and have for the last 40-50 years. Considering that morality is the foundation of a society, much moreso than even the rule of law, our society is in anarchy here in the USA.

Physical punished is proven to be ineffective on kids. I hope you're not trying it on your spouse. Moral anarchy? You have some catching up with the times to do.

 

[Tigger]

Physical punished is proven to be ineffective on kids. I hope you're not trying it on your spouse. Moral anarchy? You have some catching up with the times to do.

I can speak from PERSONAL experience that physical punishment of children is incredibly effective. In fact it was the ONLY form of discipline that worked on me at all.

My fiance and I have long since agreed on how proper discipline and order are and will continue to be maintained in our home.

I'm more than with the times. The proper times that is. You know, the 11th - 19th centuries.

 

[MaggieD]

I can speak from PERSONAL experience that physical punishment of children is incredibly effective. In fact it was the ONLY form of discipline that worked on me at all.

*Chuckles softly*

But it didn't work on you, Tigger. You are the case and point against it.

 

[CRUE CAB]

. . . you should be fined $500 first offense. $1000 second offense. Etc.

These are some of the most dangerous calls a LEO can respond to. What's with, "Help me!! Help me!! Help me!!!" And then cops arresting the aggressor and the victim not pressing charges?

We charge people for ambulance service . . . why not a fine (a charge) when some stupid wifey lets her husband bat her around, waste officers' time and then not follow through?

And how do you enforce said fine?

 

[Aunt Spiker]

. . . you should be fined $500 first offense. $1000 second offense. Etc.

These are some of the most dangerous calls a LEO can respond to. What's with, "Help me!! Help me!! Help me!!!" And then cops arresting the aggressor and the victim not pressing charges?

We charge people for ambulance service . . . why not a fine (a charge) when some stupid wifey lets her husband bat her around, waste officers' time and then not follow through?

Well - for me that would have meant I used HIS money to pay for a fee for not putting HIM in jail (though putting him in jail would have ended the income) . . . I was a stay at home mom back then.

Honestly - if someone's poor, that shouldn't factor into whether they pick up the phone and dial 911.

OR - what if they didn't even call up the cops. All too often someone ELSE outside of the situation does this (like a neighbor, etc). Someone else not in the equation shouldn't have the power to put you in debt because your sister / husband / wife flipped out and had a horrid day - and took it out on you.

 

[MaggieD]

And how do you enforce said fine?

How does a town enforce a charge for an ambulance? How does a fire department enforce a charge for an out-of-area fire call?

In my mind, once coppers have arrived and the "victim" says, "Yes, I will press charges," at that point, things go into rather time-consuming automatic mode. The suspect is hauled away to jail, reports are generated, he's booked, he's thrown in jail until his bail hearing. To have that same victim then say, "Never mind," is a waste of officers' time and public resources.

Edit: I'd do something similar with restraining orders, by the way. One of the most abusive uses of our judicial system by the general public.

 

[OscarB63]

Physical punished is proven to be ineffective on kids. I hope you're not trying it on your spouse. Moral anarchy? You have some catching up with the times to do.

don't know...physical punishment proved to be very effective on my kids (and on damn near every member of my platoon in basic training)

 

[OscarB63]

Do you even realize what you're saying when you say stuff like that? You're essentially saying that women are basically the same as children. Unless you're willing to submit yourself to physical discipline as well, you're indicating that your partner (God help her) is something less than you are.

exactly... your spouse is supposed to be your PARTNER...not your subordinate, slave or servant.

 

[Dapper Andy]

I don't disagree with that. There should be something for people who habitually do this. I just think that fines will have the reverse of what's intended.

It might make sense for police departments to keep caseworkers on staff to attempt to compel these victims to testify.

 

[Tigger]

*Chuckles softly* But it didn't work on you, Tigger. You are the case and point against it.

It worked VERY WERLL on me, Maggie.

First off, I would likely have been a serious criminal without it. I have two parking tickets as the only two run-ins with the law I've ever had, and while one of them was completely legit, the other was a crock of ****. Not even a speeding ticket beyond that. Never even been questioned, nevermind arrested for anything.

Secondly, it instilled the proper social dynamic and morality/values into me. It also reminded me that one must be willing to accept the consequences if/when they choose to step outside the prescribed lines of society.