If David Duke were sued, should he only get a white judge?

[Hatuey]

I don't believe the idea is to take it to court. The idea is to appeal to public opinion as well as build a case for ACTUAL bias, should any be found.

Lmao, you really are desperate to tie hispanic to being biased, aren't you?

 

[cpwill]

I agree his campaign seems to be about empty slogans and memes. I wonder how his supporters would explain their support. What policies or ideas of Trump's do they like? His most famous idea is probably building a wall and making Mexico pay for it, but most experts have ruled that impossible.

Well, those experts don't understand that WINNING!

Trump acts as a form of catharsis for those who want to punch the system in the nose, and tells losers that he will make them winners. It's an emotional attachment, not a policy or a logical one. I spent several months trying to point out the policy problems to Trump supporters before I realized that you can't reason someone out of a position they didn't get reasoned into.

 

[AlbqOwl]

Except of course, the whole bit about the judge being a Mexican. You do know he's an American, yes?

I have not called the judge a Mexican in any post or at any time.

 

[Hatuey]

I have not called the judge a Mexican in any post or at any time.

No it is not bigoted within the larger context of why the judge being Mexican was significant. Only those who judge people through the cruel (and dishonest) prism of political correctness and refuse to consider the setting, context, and emphasis would see that as a bigoted statement. He was not saying Mexicans could not be objective. He was saying that the fact this judge was Mexican could throw his objectivity into question as to how fair he could be with somebody like Donald Trump.

Trump I think possibly was just being quintessential Trump when he used 'the judge is a Mexican' ploy just to keep the media stirred up and on him. The fact that the judge is a prestigious member of the San Diego La Raza Lawyers association doing advocacy work for Hispanics, including illegal ones, and the president of that association has officially denounced Trump before this last bru ha ha, the fact that the association is pro illegal immigrant, the fact that it endorsed Barack Obama, and Judge Curiel himself is on record as supporting Hillary--all these are excellent reasons that this judge should recuse himself from presiding over a civil action involving Donald Trump.

Again, the judge is NOT Mexican. This considerably changes your post.

 

[Howler63]

That is pretty unlikely. Remember, most women don't like him, and they make up half the white vote. And a lot of white people of both genders are pretty turned off by his doing stupid **** like this.

All True. His only saving grace is that he's opposing Hillary Clinton.

 

[Howler63]

Lmao, you really are desperate to tie hispanic to being biased, aren't you?

Not at all. Just showing how it could be possible.

 

[Hatuey]

Not at all. Just showing how it could be possible.

Again, it's not possible because:

1. Ethnicity is not enough to justify recusal.
2. Membership in a group you feel is biased against you is not enough to justify recusal.

Seriously, there is no 'legal maneuvering' here. It's appeal to racism while proclaiming that Hispanics are not a race when it suits you.

 

[AlbqOwl]

Again, the judge is NOT Mexican. This considerably changes your post.

No it doesn't. I was commenting on Trump's use of the word. I haven't condoned him referring to the judge as Mexican and I have not done that myself. My argument was to explain why Trump using the word, however inappropriate it was, was not evidence that he was bigoted or racist. Being politically incorrect does not automatically make somebody bigoted or racist.

 

[year2late]

Again, the judge is NOT Mexican. This considerably changes your post.

Exactly.

He was born here (US) to legal immigrants. He has lived as an American citizen for over 6 decades. He lived an exemplary life which included going against Mexican drug cartels which could have ended very bad for him.
He was never Mexican. He is an always has been American. A person aspiring to the office of POTUS should have this concept down pat.

 

[earthworm]

Only two racists here ? or two who are making this thread a joke ..which, IMO , it is ..
no vote ...

 

[Excon]

Donald Trump claims that the fact that the judge in Trump University case is of Mexican descent, he is incapable of being fair to him as a judge. So, if David Duke were sued, should he only get a white judge?

False comparison.
Trump is not saying it is just because of his decent/heritage.
It is because of the prevalent ideology among those of that heritage.

It is an appearance issue.

And Trump is correct to address what he sees.

Former attorney general: Trump right to question judge’s fairness

Former Attorney General Alberto Gonzales says Donald Trump is right to challenge the fairness a judge overseeing lawsuits against him.

[...]

“These circumstances, while not necessarily conclusive, at least raise a legitimate question to be considered,” said Gonzales, who was attorney general for former President George W. Bush.​

Former attorney general: Trump right to question judge’s fairness | TheHill​

^
^
^
A textbook example of Cognitive Dissonance

I would say your reply is a text book example of a person who has no clue as to what they speak.
Where is the mental stress or discomfort?

"The judge, who happens to be, we believe, Mexican..."

That statement in and of itself is a bigoted statement.

Wrong.

He is calling a man that was born in America a "Mexican" simply due to the man being of Hispanic decent.

That is Trump referring to his heritage.

He started his whole campaign by making a bigoted insinuation about illegal Hispanic immigrants by imply that most of them are rapists and drug dealers.

Do you deny that all illegals are law breakers? Do you deny many of them are rapist and drug dealers?
It's not bigotry to point it out.

He has tweeted incendiary lies about Blacks such as "81% of whites are killed by blacks" - the number is actually 15%.

Oy vey. He re-tweeted a graphic that basically had numbers switched around.
Mountain out of a mole hill.

You could literally fill up pages worth of bigoted and racist things that Trump has said

Wrong.
You could post some things that you spun to believe they were, that is all.

---

I guess where I take issue with Trump is that the judge is not a Mexican citizen he is America. Born and raised. The guy is in his 60s. At what point can we call him American ?

What a ridiculous argument.
He didn't say he was a Mexican citizen did he?

And as an aside, as a child of immigrants he could very well be a Mexican citizen.

---

The Judge has made some questionable decisions regarding this case.
Because of these questionable decisions Trump believes the Judge is biased.
The only thing he could possibly be biased against him for is for his recent political stances, some of which directly have a relation to the Judges heritage.


The Judge is a member of the LA Raza Lawyers Association.

This Association are activists who support illegals which Trump is against.​

This Judge is a member of the Hispanic National Bar Association

This Association put out a National Press Briefing being against Trump's business interests. That is being against Trump.

​

:::::::::::::::::::::::::

​

Former attorney general: Trump right to question judge’s fairness

Former Attorney General Alberto Gonzales says Donald Trump is right to challenge the fairness a judge overseeing lawsuits against him.

[...]

“These circumstances, while not necessarily conclusive, at least raise a legitimate question to be considered,” said Gonzales, who was attorney general for former President George W. Bush.​

Former attorney general: Trump right to question judge’s fairness | TheHill​

 

[Hatuey]

No it doesn't.

Except of course that the validity of Trump's criticism hinge entirely on the guy being a Mexican. He is not. Are you going to correct your erroneous post? Or are we spending 20 pages while you try to justify defending somebody who was wrong from the beginning by repeating the same racist nonsense they have?

I was commenting on Trump's use of the word. I haven't condoned him referring to the judge as Mexican and I have not done that myself. My argument was to explain why Trump using the word, however inappropriate it was, was not evidence that he was bigoted or racist. Being politically incorrect does not automatically make somebody bigoted or racist.

Lmao, politically incorrect has now replaced factually incorrect while trying to point to a person's ethnicity as a hindrance to them performing their job correctly. Your arguments are broken records.

 

[AlbqOwl]

Except of course that the validity of Trump's criticism hinge entirely on the guy being a Mexican. He is not. Are you going to correct your erroneous post? Or are we spending 20 pages while you try to justify defending somebody who was wrong from the beginning by repeating the same racist nonsense they have?

Lmao, politically incorrect has now replaced factually incorrect while trying to point to a person's ethnicity as a hindrance to them performing their job correctly. Your arguments are broken records.

I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt when they explain what they meant by the use of a word or phrase. I allow Obama that benefit. I allow Hillary that benefit. And I will allow Donald Trump that benefit.

I am 100% opposed to the mostly leftwing tactic of taking one word or one phrase out of its full context and obvious meaning, despite how much explanation accompies it, and focus on that as evidence that a person is a bigot or racist or has committed some other unforgivable sin. Yes, Trump was 'wrong' to use the term Mexican to define Judge Curiel in that particular context, but I also leave open the possibility that it did it deliberately just to create another media storm and suck up all the attention as evidenced by people on message boards like this who are obsessed with him. It's working well for him so far.

But is calling a son of Mexican born parents "Mexican" any more wrong that calling the son of Irish born parents or just Irish descendants an "Irishman" or use any country you like? If black people who have never lived in Africa can be African-Americans, if there are similar Asian-Americans, then Curiel.by that definition is a Mexican-American. Trump just left off the American part.

 

[Hatuey]

I tend to give people the benefit of the doubt when they explain what they meant by the use of a word or phrase.

Trump used the word 'a Mexican'. So did you. Do you care to correct it? Or are we going to bull**** some more? I guess I'll have to dig through that diatribe.

Yes, Trump was 'wrong' to use the term Mexican to define Judge Curiel

Why is 'wrong' in quotation marks? He was a racist who ignored the fact that this person is a law abiding American citizen.

I also leave open the possibility that it did it deliberately just to create another media storm and suck up all the attention as evidenced by people on message boards like this who are obsessed with him. It's working well for him so far.

Clinton beats him on the overwhelming majority of polls and her growth is strengthening after a short drop.

 

[AlbqOwl]

Trump used the word 'a Mexican'. So did you. Do you care to correct it? Or are we going to bull**** some more? I guess I'll have to dig through that diatribe.



Why is 'wrong' in quotation marks? He was a racist who ignored the fact that this person is a law abiding American citizen.



Clinton beats him on the overwhelming majority of polls and her growth is strengthening after a short drop.

Curiel is the son of Mexican born parents. So if a person who has never even been to Africa, much less was born there, can be an African-American, an American born person of Asian heritage can be an Asian American, why cannot Curiel be a Mexican-American using the same standard? And if an American citizen of Irish descent can be called Irish without raising an eyebrow, and an American citizen of Italian descent can be called Italian without raising an eyebrow, why cannot an American citizen of Mexican descent be called Mexican without creating all kinds of apoplexy among the politically correct? My Mexican descended relatives, all U.S. citizens, all call themselves Mexican from time to time. That is why the 'wrong' was in quotes because there is definitely a gray area there as to whether he was technically wrong using modern every day vernacular.

Again I have not used the term Mexican to describe anybody in this thread. I have been debating Trump's use of the word.

 

[EvaPeron]

A judge, shall disqualify himself in any proceeding in which his impartiality might reasonably be questioned. That's the law.

This judge is a member of San Diego La Raza Lawyers Association - a foundation that is 100% associated with: advancing the cause of equality, empowerment and justice - specifically with the Hispanic heritage. The National Chapter states on their website:

LATINOS ARE VITAL TO AMERICA’S FUTURE
Every day Latinos work to make America stronger. They energize the economy and strive to make better lives for themselves, their families, and their communities. Our mission is to improve their opportunities for success in achieving the American Dream.

Since 1968, the National Council of La Raza has remained a trusted, nonpartisan voice for Latinos. This is the community we serve through our research, policy analysis, and state and national advocacy efforts, as well as in our programs work in communities nationwide.

We partner with Affiliates across the country to serve millions of Latinos in the areas of civic engagement, civil rights and immigration, education, workforce and the economy, health, and housing. We believe in fighting for our community and for an America where economic, political, and social advancement is a reality for all Latinos.

Donald Trump is the lead GOP candidate for the Presidency. If there was ever a conflict of interest with regards to this case - here it is. A judge who is a member of this organization on the local level, who supports the beliefs that it is their job to fight for an America where economic, political and social advancement is a reality for all Latinos, then clearly there is a conflict or a conflict could exist when Donald Trump says he wants to return to their homelands all illegal immigrants and he wants to build a wall.

All common sense would dictate that this judge should recuse himself. Why, in the name of a fair legal system, would we not? If there is any doubt air on the side of caution.

 

[Hatuey]

Curiel is the son of Mexican born parents. So if a person who has never even been to Africa, much less was born there, can be an African-American, an American born Asian can be an Asian American, why cannot Curiel be a Mexican-American using the same standard?

Sure, it makes him Mexican-American. It doesn't make him a Mexican. That you are having trouble with this is really amazing.

Again I have not used the term Mexican to describe anybody in this thread. I have been debating Trump's use of the word.

You just called the judge a Mexican in the first sentence of a post I quoted.

Lmao. Here you are arguing in favor of the exact opposite:

And how far do you take it? What about the black people I know who refuse to be called "African Americans" because they want to be just plain Americans? There was a time I hated being called 'missy' or 'sweetie' or 'little lady' or some such in the work place, but were those terms slurs? Of course not. And to make a federal case out of it would have said a whole lot more about my feelings of insecurity and lack of common sense than it would have said about well-intentioned people who used the terms.

In short, political correctness has become a gimmick for you. It's politically correctness to use terms like Mexican-American, it's also politically correctness to try and describe people born to foreigners in the US as Americans. As I stated earlier, what we are seeing here is you trying to define what is a race and when. Nobody is fooled by it.

 

[AlbqOwl]

Sure, it makes him Mexican-American. It doesn't make him a Mexican. That you are having trouble with this is really amazing.



You just called the judge a Mexican in the first sentence of a post I quoted.

Lmao. Here you are arguing in favor of the exact opposite:



In short, political correctness has become a gimmick for you. It's politically correctness to use terms like Mexican-American, it's also politically correctness to try and describe people born to foreigners in the US as Americans. As I stated earlier, what we are seeing here is you trying to define what is a race and when. Nobody is fooled by it.

I have not called anyone a Mexican in this thread. I know you really really want to believe I did, but I have not. I did leave out a word in one post that could leave that impression and edited to correct it. But I have made my argument. You have failed to rebut it. You want to make it about me. It isn't. If you don't see the difference between my old post you quoted and what I am arguing here, I have to believe it is hopeless having an intelligent debate with you. I never expect anybody to agree with me. But I do expect them to make an honest effort to understand what I am arguing. And I do expect them to do their honest best to not misrepresent what I have said or put words in my mouth that I did not say or intend.

But thanks for trying in your own way and have a nice day.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

Except of course that the validity of Trump's criticism hinge entirely on the guy being a Mexican. He is not. Are you going to correct your erroneous post? Or are we spending 20 pages while you try to justify defending somebody who was wrong from the beginning by repeating the same racist nonsense they have?



Lmao, politically incorrect has now replaced factually incorrect while trying to point to a person's ethnicity as a hindrance to them performing their job correctly. Your arguments are broken records.

Trumps defenders now call "PC" what everyone used to call common decency.

 

[Tanngrisnir]

A judge, shall disqualify himself in any proceeding in which his impartiality might reasonably be questioned. That's the law.

This judge is a member of San Diego La Raza Lawyers Association - a foundation that is 100% associated with: advancing the cause of equality, empowerment and justice - specifically with the Hispanic heritage. The National Chapter states on their website:

LATINOS ARE VITAL TO AMERICA’S FUTURE
Every day Latinos work to make America stronger. They energize the economy and strive to make better lives for themselves, their families, and their communities. Our mission is to improve their opportunities for success in achieving the American Dream.

Since 1968, the National Council of La Raza has remained a trusted, nonpartisan voice for Latinos. This is the community we serve through our research, policy analysis, and state and national advocacy efforts, as well as in our programs work in communities nationwide.

We partner with Affiliates across the country to serve millions of Latinos in the areas of civic engagement, civil rights and immigration, education, workforce and the economy, health, and housing. We believe in fighting for our community and for an America where economic, political, and social advancement is a reality for all Latinos.

Donald Trump is the lead GOP candidate for the Presidency. If there was ever a conflict of interest with regards to this case - here it is. A judge who is a member of this organization on the local level, who supports the beliefs that it is their job to fight for an America where economic, political and social advancement is a reality for all Latinos, then clearly there is a conflict or a conflict could exist when Donald Trump says he wants to return to their homelands all illegal immigrants and he wants to build a wall.

All common sense would dictate that this judge should recuse himself. Why, in the name of a fair legal system, would we not? If there is any doubt air on the side of caution.

* facepalm *

This may set a record on one thread for how many times the same false claim is posted as valid.

The SDLRLA is NOT the National Council of La Raza.

Please, stop.

 

[Hatuey]

I have not called anyone a Mexican in this thread. I know you really really want to believe I did, but I have not. I did leave out a word in one post that could leave that impression and edited to correct it. But I have made my argument. You have failed to rebut it. You want to make it about me. It isn't. If you don't see the difference between my old post you quoted and what I am arguing here, I have to believe it is hopeless having an intelligent debate with you.

Umm, you are arguing that there is too much political correctness when people ask to be called Hyphenated-American, and too much political correctness when people born in the US to legal residents are referred to as Americans instead of their parent's nationality.

Again, you are trying to define when something is racist and when it isn't. You referred to the judge as a Mexican when trying to justify Trump's words, for you to deny it is pretty silly.

 

[AlbqOwl]

Umm, you are arguing that there is too much political correctness when people ask to be called Hyphenated-American, and too much political correctness when people born in the US to legal residents are referred to as Americans instead of their parent's nationality.

Again, you are trying to define when something is racist and when it isn't. You referred to the judge as a Mexican when trying to justify Trump's words, for you to deny it is pretty silly.

And you aren't trying to define when something is racist? I have at least made an argument. All you have done is misrepresent or failed to understand what I have posted. Again have a nice day.

 

[Hatuey]

And you aren't trying to define when something is racist?

Nope, I'm stating it is racist because of the implications of it. You are stating it isn't out of political expediency. Again, I'll direct you to your own purposely schizophrenic understanding of what is and isn't politically correct:

- It's political correctness run amok to refer to an American using a hyphenated denonym (i.e. African American).
- It's political correctness run amok to refer to an American using the American denonym alone.

When isn't it political correctness run amok?

I have at least made an argument. All you have done is misrepresent or failed to understand what I have posted. Again have a nice day.

Lmao, you refuse to correct your error. That's on you.

 

[AlbqOwl]

Nope, I'm stating it is racist because of the implications of it. You are stating it isn't out of political expediency. Again, I'll direct you to your own purposely schizophrenic understanding of what is and isn't politically correct:

- It's political correctness run amok to refer to an American using a hyphenated denonym (i.e. African American).
- It's political correctness run amok to refer to an American using the American denonym alone.

When isn't it political correctness run amok?



Lmao, you refuse to correct your error. That's on you.

If you are incapable of representing my argument honestly, and if you are not interested in rebutting or discussing the topic, please find something else to do. Personal insults that you cannot support with anything are so boring.

 

[Gimmesometruth]

If there was ever a conflict of interest with regards to this case - here it is. A judge who is a member of this organization on the local level, who supports the beliefs that it is their job to fight for an America where economic, political and social advancement is a reality for all Latinos, then clearly there is a conflict or a conflict could exist when Donald Trump says he wants to return to their homelands all illegal immigrants and he wants to build a wall.

Remind me again, what part of the Trump University fraud allegations.....have to do with US Hispanic socioeconomic issues?