I Had to Respond to an EMail

[armycowboy]

*shrug*

And everyone is a vet who served with distinction and honor.

lol

Son, I pay more in taxes than multiples of your salary which means I pay a disproportionate amout of your bloated government salary only to see you whine and disparage our leadership. And let's be real honest. Your job at aafes is not very important and in no way will you running away sobbing have any impact on anyone.

That's a very good point, because every vet I know knows the difference between DeCA and AAFES. Except for you.

 

[armycowboy]

The email came from The Secretary of Defense. You do realize that right?

The email was "signed" by the SecDef, it didn't come from his email.

 

[VySky]

After all these years, do you really believe I care what you think?

Nope. And your fantasy of telling your boss to **** off is something I beleive didn't happen.

 

[armycowboy]

Nope. And your fantasy of telling your boss to **** off is something I beleive didn't happen.

That's wonderful.

 

[VySky]

The email was "signed" by the SecDef, it didn't come from his email.

lol... Had you rather have an email come from SecDef and not be signed by him?

As a former DoD employee in Weapons Test for 33 years, 13 of that as a Branch Manager, it would have been unwise for you to answer the email in that fashion.

But everyone knows I have no issue with one forming his own level of accceptable risk.

 

[Fearandloathing]

A book I used to give all new managers is titled The First 90 Days by Michael Watkins.

New managers are very gung ho and want to make changes early on.

Doing so before understanding their department, it's people and culture, and the company can result in errors that damage the new manager's reputation. Especially if a decision has to be reversed (as Doge has had to do repeatedly).

So Watkins' advice is to spend the first 90 days gaining an understanding of the environment and building good relationships with the immediate team and company resource departments.

Elon could benefit from this book. Not only is he trying to fix stuff that might not be broken, he's ****ing up stuff that's probably not broken.

I have little post-secondary education.

I've always ended up in middle management.

Early on I discovered that management above me was afraid of me, and those below ere who would make or break me. In computers I insisted on being the low man for the first month. I intended it as a show of solidarity, that I was prepared to get my hands dirty.

What happened was this. I took 'over flow' calls which was everyone whether they had an assigned rep of or not. I soon discovered only a few near the top were getting the full message on sales and promotions. So while in 'the pit' I made sure everyone knew everything and ended up top salesman my first month.

The system is so stupid however, they don't appoint managers to manage they appoint the top salesman reducing his effective selling time with minor administrative duties.

So I quit and went to the competition and became top salesman in one month simply by calling the customers of my old employer and informing them of specials...often just bs about last night's hockey game which often became an order.

Don't promote salesmen, hire managers who can't sell.

 

[Citizen]

Why do so many people apparently find it "demeaning" to report on what they did? Pretty much every desk job I've ever had I've had to report on every minute I was at work. 30 minutes doing this, 1.5 hours doing that, etc... I've only ever worked in the private sector.

Everybody does....That is the point here. You not seeing the problem with this is troubling. Do you think supervisors don't make the employees accountable? If that is the case, then fire the supervisors. It is really stupid to think Hegseth or Musk can mirco manage an entire department of every government agency

 

[Allan]

Don't promote salesmen, hire managers who can't sell.

Interesting because Tom Peters (In Search of Excellence) always said to promote salespeople to the top. The reasoning is that they are the most customer focused people and that's who you want leading the organization.

The worst CEOs in his opinion were accountant types.

 

[armycowboy]

Interesting because Tim Peters (In Search of Excellence) always said to promote salespeople to the top. The reasoning is that they are the most customer focused people and that's who you want leading the organization.

The worst CEOs in his opinion were accountant types.

The problem with promoting sales people to management positions is that just because someone can sell, doesn't mean they can lead. In fact top salesmen usually have sales come easy to them and often have a hard time relating to and training people who don't have the natural gift they do.

It's a similar phenomenon in sport, where the greatest stars often make terrible mangers/coaches.

 

[Allan]

The problem with promoting sales people to management positions is that just because someone can sell, doesn't mean they can lead.

They're good with people though and that's very important when leading.

 

[armycowboy]

They're good with people though and that's very important when leading.

They're good at influencing people. That's a part of leadship, for sure, but only a part. If they're willing to learn the rest, they can be good. But just expecting a good salesman to be a good manager is setting yourself up for failure.

 

[ElChupacabra]

The email came from The Secretary of Defense. You do realize that right?

I do. Except this is in the same vein as the Musk nonsense as well, and he's made that request.

 

[Fearandloathing]

Interesting because Tom Peters (In Search of Excellence) always said to promote salespeople to the top. The reasoning is that they are the most customer focused people and that's who you want leading the organization.

The worst CEOs in his opinion were accountant types.

I read that book.

Did nothing for me.

Managers are there to take care of oddball shit, stuff that goes wrong. They need patience, a level head and security of position.

That is not commissioned sales.

I hired managers and the most aggressive dogs I could for sales. I directed managers to manage and sales people to sell. When there was an issue and the customer demanded to speak to the sales manager, I stepped in instead - Vice president of operations.

Theory is great, we all have lots and lost of theories on how to be successful. But I took my read from a man I knew when I was a reporter, the most wealthy Canada Jimmy Pattison a self made zillionaire who started out selling Pontiacs. He was named chairman of Expo 86 when they ran into trouble which is where I got to know him. One of the first personal things he said to me was "you need to be in sales....the customers need you."

I'd never sold anything for profit in my life. I took his advice and retired not many years later. Nothing in my success came in a book or a learning tape. Everything came from knowing people better, determining their needs and helping them reach them.

The most important thing he told me was "stop talking".

 

[Fearandloathing]

They're good at influencing people. That's a part of leadship, for sure, but only a part. If they're willing to learn the rest, they can be good. But just expecting a good salesman to be a good manager is setting yourself up for failure.

It usually backfires because salesmen are self involved, self motivated with little or no currency for other's feelings. Managers need a soft core to understand what best drives the salesman because it isn't always money. A Manager sees the sales force as a unit working together here it is really a competition between pretend friends

 

[VySky]

I do. Except this is in the same vein as the Musk nonsense as well, and he's made that request.

So what? SecDef is the head of DoD. The boss asked some questions. Most performers would love to blow their horn. I don’t understand the outrage.

 

[VySky]

I wonder what the leaderships guidance was for @armycowboy and his associates relative to SecDefs data call?

 

[dobieg]

That's a very good point, because every vet I know knows the difference between DeCA and AAFES. Except for you.

Gosh you're right. They're soooo different and you're such an important DoD employee. Whatever will they do without you stocking shelves and answering the phone?


Disaster!!

 

[multivita-man]

The problem with promoting sales people to management positions is that just because someone can sell, doesn't mean they can lead. In fact top salesmen usually have sales come easy to them and often have a hard time relating to and training people who don't have the natural gift they do.

And sometimes they're just great bullshitters, which actually works pretty well in sales but quite awfully when trying to lead people across teams or even multiple people on the same team.

Telling ain't training.

 

[armycowboy]

Gosh you're right. They're soooo different and you're such an important DoD employee. Whatever will they do without you stocking shelves and answering the phone?


Disaster!!

Lol. Yes, they are very different. One uses GS and contractors and the other uses non-appropriated funds. But by all means continue your adhoms, interesting that's all you have.

 

[multivita-man]

I wonder what the leaderships guidance was for @armycowboy and his associates relative to SecDefs data call?

And shame it is, if priest take thought for keep,
A shitten shepherd, looking after clean sheep.
A trully good example a priest should give,
Is his own chastity, how his flock should live.

Geoffrey Chaucer, Canterbury Tales

 

[VySky]

And shame it is, if priest take thought for keep,
A shitten shepherd, looking after clean sheep.
A trully good example a priest should give,
Is his own chastity, how his flock should live.

Geoffrey Chaucer, Canterbury Tales

Mkay I guess. lol..

 

[Cosmo]

You obviously feel that a worker is subservient to their boss.

...AKA subordinate.

That's absolute bullshit. If a boss treats good workers like crap, they leave and get jobs elsewhere and then the boss's business sufferes.

I've owned my own business after I retired from the Army. I always treated my subordinates

You had subordinates? HOW DARE YOU?!

with respect and expected the same from them. It's a partnership, the people who work for you aren't your slaves.

 

[Cosmo]

Exactly.

Your post couldn’t be more wrong. My final job for the company I retired from, a Top 100 company in the Fortune 500 since that list was originated in 1955, was as a litigation administrator. In other words, I directed our local legal counsel across the country where there were usually two to ten firms per state depending on the size of the state. Each month, I reviewed the billing statements per attorney and firm for each legal matter currently being litigated. Then I paid the firms.

What you apparently don’t know, is that there was a legal working agreement between my employer and each law firm. That included each attorney’s and paralegal’s hourly rate. It had nothing to do with paying the law firm what I thought their work was worth. It was contracted as such, and the hourly rate was plainly spelled out on the attorney’s billing statement each month, as well.

I knew the approximate legal costs up front from each type of matter I was about to retain an attorney to handle. If I wanted massive headaches and negative feedback to my superiors way up the executive ladder, I could question the billable hours submitted by the law firms with little to no basis. There is also a level of professional trust at work here.

Law firms getting the business from my employer usually spanned years and decades. It was work volume and a feather in their cap to be able to say they represented my employer. I had a business relationship with every one of these attorneys- some damn good ones, too. It got so that if I called one of them for counsel on a prospective matter or something they weren’t currently working on, the billing meter on their end wasn’t running. If it was something they were eventually going to be retained for, they would eventually get paid. It also had to be a billable matter- in other words, they would have to formally be asked to take a matter and conduct a conflicts check.

So yeah, they had “special legal privileges” to bill clients by the hour or fraction of hours. The original signed working agreement gave them that.

Just about any industry can have those. They're called engagement letters. Again, you haven't posted anything that would make time tracking and project management absurd.

 

[Cosmo]

Do Republicans not understand the difference between a scalpel and a chainsaw? I guess not.

Most civil servants were hired

...aka appointed, not elected. So no need for Democrats to fill any more buckets with tears over "unelected" Elon Musk.

based on having qualifications for their job, and after working competently for years at those jobs, were promoted to their supervisory position.

 

[Cosmo]

Musk isn't their boss. What skills or knowledge do the Doge team have to understand and evaluate the importance of the accomplishments listed? How do they use the information in a meaningful way?

Trump is their boss, and he can delegate as he pleases. No need to be a rocket scientist to shitcan a worker too stupid to reply adequately to a simple email.