• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

How can this possibly be constitutional?

Uncensored2008 said:
Exactly what I said. That a lot of people view the Gay/Trans posters that plaster public schools down to kindergarten as "satanic."
Click to expand...
To be sure, a state law mandating the placement of these posters in every classroom would also be wrong. It would not be quite as wrong as placing Ten Commandments posters, because religion is specifically recognized as a fundamental right in special need of protection.

Parents have a right to see gay/trans posters as satanic if they want to. They have a right to disagree. What they should not have a right to do is to completely censor all mention of gay/trans from the school, because the school needs to have harmonious order to function, and harmonious order requires that kids who understand they are gay or straight or whatever can work and play beside one another without conflict. It also requires that kids should be able to express their various beliefs without conflict, except the permissible conflict of intellectual argument that should pervade a free society.

We must look deep into ourselves and one another to find a way to not merely uphold the rights of all people, but to respect them. Each single person must be able, at the same time, to understand:
  1. that anti-gay discrimination (or worse) is deeply hurtful, fundamentally useless, has broken families apart and snuffed out many good lives entirely, and stains the honor of the faith they may be seeking to uphold.
  2. that HIV was in the United States population before Stonewall, and that half a million people died because of attitudes that pleasure is simply good and doesn't require any prudent moral consideration.
Such attitudes can be reconciled by understanding that "sexual sin" is not something magic, but has the same mundane nature as beating someone over the head. If you are risking someone's life while you say you love them, if you're breaking hearts and causing misery, if you're leaving children without support, then these are mundane, not supernatural acts. Such sins can be sharply reduced by mundane measures, such as wearing a rubber, though the sacrament of marriage offers a far deeper religious dimension. The two sides do not have to go to war, but would learn and grow and do right by their children through a sincere peace.
 
Uncensored2008 said:
Exactly what I said. That a lot of people view the Gay/Trans posters that plaster public schools down to kindergarten as "satanic."
Click to expand...
Yes, we know a lot of people are irrational or downright delusional, especially those who see "satanic" in things. But what public schools have these so called posters? Can you provide an example of such a poster?
 
As we slide more towards theocracy, we slide downhill.
 
roguenuke said:
Being a Christian doesn't give you any right to determine who else is one, what constitutes one.
Click to expand...

13 “Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. 14 But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.
15 “Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17 Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them. "Not everyone who says to me 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven. On that day many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many deeds of power in your name?' Then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; go away from me, you evildoers’" (Matthew 7:13-23).
 
LittleNipper said:
13 “Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. 14 But small is the gate and narrow the road that leads to life, and only a few find it.
15 “Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep’s clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves. 16 By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? 17 Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. 18 A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them. "Not everyone who says to me 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father in heaven. On that day many will say to me, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many deeds of power in your name?' Then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; go away from me, you evildoers’" (Matthew 7:13-23).
Click to expand...
Doesn't mean jack. Interpretation, translation, edition, version all go into play not to mention simply seeing the book as a possible guide, written by men but Jesus's teachings as the key would still make a person a Christian.
 
weaver2 said:
Have you been in elementary schools and seen trans and gay posters plastered all over the school. Tell us about your experience.
Click to expand...

Two weeks ago in my grandson's kindergarten room. The gay rainbow is everywhere in public schools. It was all exposed during COVID. Defend it or don't - lying no longer works.
 
bythoughts said:
I'm a little late to this party, but I urge everyone to look up the Ten Commandments. One thing to notice is that there are differences in the numbering used by different traditions. They are backing Protestant, not Catholic numbering - making it clear where the state stands in that ancient and well-known schism. But it gets worse: they EDITED the Commandments. Heavily. For brevity, convenience, and to emphasize their own way of thinking. Many say that it should say "commit murder" instead of "kill", for example.

Now, what would the Jewish tradition say about this, at least as translated by Christians?

All told, I think this law should disturb the religious people more than the atheists.
Click to expand...
I'm agnostic and it doesn't bother me at all. But I'm not a leftist bent on micromanaging others.
 
Uncensored2008 said:
Yes, we call them "democrats."



All of them.



ROFL

Do you really think you can get the cat back into the bag?
Click to expand...
Ok, so you have nothing of value to offer. Duly noted.
 
Uncensored2008 said:
I'm agnostic and it doesn't bother me at all. But I'm not a leftist bent on micromanaging others.
Click to expand...
This response confuses me. My expectation is that people with strong, specific religious beliefs would be most perturbed by "dumbed-down" commandments, so you're not inconsistent with this pattern.

Telling teachers what they have to post in their classroom sounds like micromanagement to me. Broad management would be something like "teachers are encouraged to talk about religion and associated philosophical issues".
 
Uncensored2008 said:
Two weeks ago in my grandson's kindergarten room. The gay rainbow is everywhere in public schools. It was all exposed during COVID. Defend it or don't - lying no longer works.
Click to expand...
How about a description of the posters and the wording on them. Little children are much given to drawing rainbows (long before the rainbow was co-opted by the LGBT movement). Were you seeing these drawings or were you seeing commercial posters. Descriptions are needed here to validate your experience. Repeating that gay and trans posters are everywhere and proving it by saying your grandson's kindergarten had pictures of rainbows isn't supporting your claim.
 
LittleNipper said:
You are not a Christian and shouldn't be making any determination as to what constitutes one.
Click to expand...

I am not the one who is doing it, you and your fellow Christians are. I am willing to take so Eo word they they consider themselves a Christian even if what they believe doesn’t line up with any other Christian’s beliefs. Frankly everyone can keep claiming to be a Christian but when they say their way is the one true way I will always question that. That is because they are claiming something entirely subjective has some objectively verifiable facts. There are zero objectively true religious beliefs in the world. But whoever wants to claim they believe something I can only take their word for it.
 
devildavid said:
I am not the one who is doing it, you and your fellow Christians are. I am willing to take so Eo word they they consider themselves a Christian even if what they believe doesn’t line up with any other Christian’s beliefs. Frankly everyone can keep claiming to be a Christian but when they say their way is the one true way I will always question that. That is because they are claiming something entirely subjective has some objectively verifiable facts. There are zero objectively true religious beliefs in the world. But whoever wants to claim they believe something I can only take their word for it.
Click to expand...
You don't apply that to Evolutionist vs Creationist "scientists" I bet... And it is not between one Christian vs another. It's about what one person says the Bible says vs. what the Bible says.
 
LittleNipper said:
You don't apply that to Evolutionist vs Creationist "scientists" I bet... And it is not between one Christian vs another. It's about what one person says the Bible says vs. what the Bible says.
Click to expand...

There is no such thing as creationist science. So any scientist that is a creationist simply is a scientist with a religious belief. There are plenty of scientists with religious beliefs. It doesn’t change science one bit.
 
LittleNipper said:
You don't apply that to Evolutionist vs Creationist "scientists" I bet... And it is not between one Christian vs another. It's about what one person says the Bible says vs. what the Bible says.
Click to expand...
Creationism isn't science.
 
Ganondagan said:
It's a good reason to abolish public education. Let's encourage home schooling and religious schools. Get government the hell out of our lives.
Click to expand...
Why not just advocate for anarchy while we're at it? 🙄
 
tonyeveland said:
1. America WAS founded on christian principles. That is an historic fact, not an opinion or legislative issue.

2. Your statement about a "Christocracy" is your fabrication. Nothing and nobody has ever said anything like that. You made that up.

3. Why shouldn't the 10 C be displayed on the wall of the SC or any government building? What is your Constitutional reference to support that?

4. "Public money should not be used to support any religion". Why not? It doesn't violate the Constitution. And where are you on public money supporting abortion and sex changes?

I think you are driven by your biases, not principle, evidence, etc. If I'm wrong about this, give me some principles, evidence, etc.
Click to expand...

American culture and traditions were absolutely based on Christian values. Leftists Christianity haters have a point if they talk about the American government, but are absolutley and pathetically wrong in thinking the American polity never was, or is not now, based on Christianity.
 
Ganondagan said:
American culture and traditions were absolutely based on Christian values. Leftists Christianity haters have a point if they talk about the American government, but are absolutley and pathetically wrong in thinking the American polity ever was, or is now, not based on Christianity.
Click to expand...
The Founding fathers didn't think it was either.
 
Gordy327 said:
The Founding fathers didn't think it was either.
Click to expand...

Quotes of the Founding Fathers on Religion​

www.learnreligions.com

Hear the Founding Fathers Speak on Faith, Jesus, and the Bible

Listen to the founding fathers' quotes on religion. Catch a glimpse of the strong spiritual convictions of the men who formed our nation's foundation.
www.learnreligions.com www.learnreligions.com

John Adams:
"The general principles, on which the Fathers achieved independence, were the only Principles in which that beautiful Assembly of young Gentlemen could Unite, and these Principles only could be intended by them in their address, or by me in my answer. And what were these general Principles? I answer, the general Principles of Christianity, in which all these Sects were United: And the general Principles of English and American Liberty...

"Now I will avow, that I then believe, and now believe, that those general Principles of Christianity, are as eternal and immutable, as the Existence and Attributes of God; and that those Principles of Liberty, are as unalterable as human Nature and our terrestrial, mundane System."

George Washington:
"While we are zealously performing the duties of good citizens and soldiers, we certainly ought not to be inattentive to the higher duties of religion. To the distinguished character of Patriot, it should be our highest glory to add the more distinguished character of Christian."

John Hancock:
"Resistance to tyranny becomes the Christian and social duty of each individual. ... Continue steadfast and, with a proper sense of your dependence on God, nobly defend those rights which heaven gave, and no man ought to take from us."

Patrick Henry:​

"It cannot be emphasized too strongly or too often that this great nation was founded, not by religionists, but by Christians; not on religions, but on the gospel of Jesus Christ. For this very reason peoples of other faiths have been afforded asylum, prosperity, and freedom of worship here."​

 
Last edited:
Loulit01 said:

The legal battle over Louisiana law requiring schools to display Ten Commandments​

It's pretty specific. It says the Ten Commandments need to be displayed in large, easily readable font. The law also says posters displaying the commandments have to include a context statement, the exact wording of which was included in the law passed by Louisiana's Republican-controlled legislature. It's several paragraphs but, in short, says the Ten Commandments, quote, "were a prominent part of American public education for almost three centuries," though I should say some historians argue that isn't true.

The U.S. Supreme Court struck down a similar law to Louisiana's in 1980. In that ruling, the court said requiring schools in Kentucky to post the Ten Commandments, quote, "had no secular legislative purpose," was plainly religious and therefore unconstitutional. Now, Louisiana's attorney general argues the state's law is different and constitutional. She says it passes a history and tradition test and that it's about teaching morals. Opponents aren't buying that, though. They say this case is about getting something that's already been decided back to the Supreme Court, which now has a conservative supermajority.

Let's explain the 7th Commandment to 3rd Graders.
Click to expand...
There is no requirement for secularism.
 
Ganondagan said:
It's a good reason to abolish public education. Let's encourage home schooling and religious schools. Get government the hell out of our lives.
Click to expand...

How are working families supposed to home school. ReLigious schools are to few in number to achieve widespread education of the populace. Going this route guarantees a less educated society. We are the government so let’s get our lives into the government instead of viewing it as something separate from who we are.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom