Homicide Rates Higher in States with More Guns at Home

[TurtleDude]

Gee, I read so many tragic stories of children killed while playing with guns that their father forgot to lock up, or that they thought the gun was empty, or in a fit of rage a man killed his wife and children, or vice versa.

The common thread to those tragedys is that they occured in gun-safety approved homes, happened in homes where the parents were stout NRA members, happened in homes where the parents were upright, outstanding, church going citizens with no criminal backgrounds.

The common thread being that they just all had easy access to guns, that's all!

another myth-accidental deaths of children involving firearms continue to DECREASE even though the number of privately owned guns continues to increase

You are making crap up as usual-most of those happen in homes where people are irresponsible or even criminal.

 

[ModerateDem]

Well then why not put a big sign out in your front yard announcing that there are no guns in your house and never will be.

Good Idea. We should put a sign in the front yard of the gun owner next door also that says "Beware:Gun inside!" And see which one gets robbed first.

 

[TurtleDude]

Good Idea. We should put a sign in the front yard of the gun owner next door also that says "Beware:Gun inside!" And see which one gets robbed first.

depends on what the robber wants
based on what polls of robbers says-it would be kid rocks' home

besides this is a stupid comment of yours. Gun owners aren't trying to limit the rights of cowards

 

[KidRocks]

another myth-accidental deaths of children involving firearms continue to DECREASE even though the number of privately owned guns continues to increase

You are making crap up as usual-most of those happen in homes where people are irresponsible or even criminal.

The hell they do, they happen in all types of homes.

Gun-safety, responsibility and training does not guarantee, nor will it ever guarantee that tragedy will not strike in a home where guns are kept, remember that. Let us pray that tragedy never visits your home.

 

[TurtleDude]

The hell they do, they happen in all types of homes.

Gun-safety, responsibility and training does not guarantee, nor will it ever guarantee that tragedy will not strike in a home where guns are kept, remember that. Let us pray that tragedy never visits your home.

If you want a guarantee buy a toaster. Chris Reeve's widow died of lung cancer and she never smoked. Yet if you don't want lung cancer, not smoking is the best way to prevent it. training your kids in gun safety might not prevent them from being in a tragedy with a gun just as well trained drivers sometimes die in traffic wrecks but on the whole, if you play the odds-being afraid of guns is going to cause you more problems than those of us who are well trained

I note you aren't giving us even a facade of evidence to s upport your nonsense

 

[KidRocks]

Good Idea. We should put a sign in the front yard of the gun owner next door also that says "Beware:Gun inside!" And see which one gets robbed first.

Yes, and according to statistics, tragedy will visit the house with the sign "Beware:Gun inside!" first.

In the home with the sign, "Beware:Gun inside!", chances are greater that some child inside that home will die of accidental gunshot or that that childs father, in a fit of rage, jealousy or passion will shoot and kill his wife and maybe that child too.

That's a fact Jack!

 

[TurtleDude]

Yes, and according to statistics, tragedy will visit the house with the sign "Beware:Gun inside!" first.

In the home with the sign, "Beware:Gun inside!", chances are greater that some child inside that home will die of accidental gunshot or that that childs father, in a fit of rage, jealousy or passion will shoot and kill his wife and maybe that child too.

That's a fact Jack!

and that is because those statistics have been cooked to EXCLUDE defense of self or family where the perp isn't shot.

your study also (Kellerman) was a bit dishonest. For example, if your ex comes to your gun free house with a weapon and shoots you-that was counted as a House with a weapon in it for the statistics.

Justice Department studies also show that victims who violently respond to an attack by a criminal are less likely to get hurt than those who do not resist and dozens of studies have shown that guns are used thousands upon thousands of times a year-up to 2 million-to stop crimes. that the mopes don't get wounded or killed in most cases doesn't diminish that fact

 

[Stace]

Yes, and according to statistics, tragedy will visit the house with the sign "Beware:Gun inside!" first.

In the home with the sign, "Beware:Gun inside!", chances are greater that some child inside that home will die of accidental gunshot or that that childs father, in a fit of rage, jealousy or passion will shoot and kill his wife and maybe that child too.

That's a fact Jack!

:roll: Even if I didn't like guns, seeing as how my husband is a cop, I have no choice but to be around them.

I was never really exposed to them when I was younger. I shot my brother's BB gun a few times, but that's about it. He had a 30-30 that he kept in his closet. He was never irresponsible with it, and I didn't even have to be told to leave it alone. No accidents ever happened within our home. There was the time that one of his buddies shot him in the ankle with the BB gun, but that kid was a moron and they were in the woods. :lol:

So the first time I ever really shot a weapon worth a hoot was in the military. I learned to have a healthy amount of respect for guns and what they can do. I'm not afraid of them. I keep a pistol of my own in my nightstand drawer. When my son gets older, yeah, we'll be putting the guns up where he can't reach them, until he's old enough to be trusted not to play with them. But until he's old enough to be trusted, gun safety will still be drilled into his head. He will learn to respect guns just as his father and I do.

I have no fear of something "tragic" happening in my home. I'm not ignorant enough to think that it won't happen simply because I teach my son gun safety; I am intelligent enough to know that that education greatly reduces the odds of something stupid happening. And I highly doubt my husband is going to go berserk and shoot us all.

And if he does? Well, I guess that's just what was meant to happen to us. :2razz:

 

[Caine]

Yes, and according to statistics, tragedy will visit the house with the sign "Beware:Gun inside!" first.

In the home with the sign, "Beware:Gun inside!", chances are greater that some child inside that home will die of accidental gunshot or that that childs father, in a fit of rage, jealousy or passion will shoot and kill his wife and maybe that child too.

That's a fact Jack!

Provide me with a comprehensive statistical analysis that takes the general lifestyle of the families within these homes into account and maybe I'll believe you.

 

[Stace]

And besides, why's it got to be the husband/father that goes crazy? Mothers and wives go psycho and shoot people, too, ya know. :rofl

 

[FreeThinker]

No one is going to break into our house because we have 3 dogs that bite ferociously, they, in essence, are our "guns"!

I was going to link pictures of my favorite "guns", (which of course are nothing but dogs) but I forgot the HTML tags.

Do your dogs dodge bullets then?

What about people allergic to dogs? Are they going to be the ones to wait 10 minutes for the police when someone is in their house?

Your idea that a few dogs and a police officer on a coffee break 5 miles from your house are going to save you from someone that decides to break into your house is beyond unrealistic.

 

[Caine]

Do your dogs dodge bullets then?

What about people allergic to dogs? Are they going to be the ones to wait 10 minutes for the police when someone is in their house?

Your idea that a few dogs and a police officer on a coffee break 5 miles from your house are going to save you from someone that decides to break into your house is beyond unrealistic.

5 miles?
hehe...... if Im on one end of my response area, and I get a call on the opposite end.... it could take me up to 10 mins... Running Blue Lights and Sirens to get there..
Now imagine if it isn't a priority....

 

[KidRocks]

Do your dogs dodge bullets then?

What about people allergic to dogs? Are they going to be the ones to wait 10 minutes for the police when someone is in their house?

Your idea that a few dogs and a police officer on a coffee break 5 miles from your house are going to save you from someone that decides to break into your house is beyond unrealistic.

Dogs are not foolproof either, I never claimed that.

But I will say that you too are being unrealistic if you think that possessing a few guns in the house will guarantee that robbers will not be successful in breaking and entering your home with or without you being home to successfully thwart them. Chances are that they will shoot you first before you even go for your gun.

 

[TurtleDude]

Do your dogs dodge bullets then?

What about people allergic to dogs? Are they going to be the ones to wait 10 minutes for the police when someone is in their house?

Your idea that a few dogs and a police officer on a coffee break 5 miles from your house are going to save you from someone that decides to break into your house is beyond unrealistic.

there are two ways to look at this

1) the mope hears the dogs. Why go into that house when there are easier targets. the mope might not know that the homeowner is afraid of guns and has no ability to fight back if the mope takes out the dogs.

2) the mope has already targeted kidrocks and wants to do him

sucks to be kidrocks in that case

 

[TurtleDude]

Dogs are not foolproof either, I never claimed that.

But I will say that you too are being unrealistic if you think that possessing a few guns in the house will guarantee that robbers will not be successful in breaking and entering your home with or without you being home to successfully thwart them. Chances are that they will shoot you first before you even go for your gun.

your posts get more and more unrealistic. Chances are if that were the case, we would have statistics proving it. We dont even though sarah brady would give her remaining healthy lung tissue for such proof

 

[FreeThinker]

Dogs are not foolproof either, I never claimed that.

But I will say that you too are being unrealistic if you think that possessing a few guns in the house will guarantee that robbers will not be successful in breaking and entering your home with or without you being home to successfully thwart them. Chances are that they will shoot you first before you even go for your gun.

I'm a light sleeper and I keep my .380 next to a full clip on the dresser with the bedroom door locked. When a door or a window to my house gets opened there is an audible beep that wakes me up.

For someone to break into my house and get to me before I was armed and ready they would need to know the layout of my house and be able to get in without waking me up.

As far as someone breaking in when I'm not home I don't care. It's just stuff. My safety is what I care about.

 

[Stace]

I'm a light sleeper and I keep my .380 next to a full clip on the dresser with the bedroom door locked. When a door or a window to my house gets opened there is an audible beep that wakes me up.

For someone to break into my house and get to me before I was armed and ready they would need to know the layout of my house and be able to get in without waking me up.

As far as someone breaking in when I'm not home I don't care. It's just stuff. My safety is what I care about.

Amen to all that....especially if you have renter's or homeowner's insurance. :mrgreen:

Though I'd be ticked if we lost our computer, because every picture ever taken of our son is stored on here. I really need to get off my butt and get those onto a CD. Sure, I've got a few prints, but they're not even a drop in a bucket to all of the pictures I've taken!

 

[KidRocks]

I'm a light sleeper and I keep my .380 next to a full clip on the dresser with the bedroom door locked. When a door or a window to my house gets opened there is an audible beep that wakes me up.

For someone to break into my house and get to me before I was armed and ready they would need to know the layout of my house and be able to get in without waking me up.

As far as someone breaking in when I'm not home I don't care. It's just stuff. My safety is what I care about.

I sincerly hope you live alone, I wouldn't want to wake you up with bad news. :roll:

 

[TurtleDude]

Amen to all that....especially if you have renter's or homeowner's insurance. :mrgreen:

Though I'd be ticked if we lost our computer, because every picture ever taken of our son is stored on here. I really need to get off my butt and get those onto a CD. Sure, I've got a few prints, but they're not even a drop in a bucket to all of the pictures I've taken!

You have the turtle's permission to shoot anyone trying to steal your computer:mrgreen:

 

[FreeThinker]

If I can find the USB cable for my digital camera I'll take a pic if it when I get home. It's a POS pocket pistol but it still packs a punch.

 

[ModerateDem]

depends on what the robber wants
based on what polls of robbers says-it would be kid rocks' home

besides this is a stupid comment of yours. Gun owners aren't trying to limit the rights of cowards

:doh perhaps you missed the humor I was trying to hit at. Oh well!:roll:

 

[ModerateDem]

Yes, and according to statistics, tragedy will visit the house with the sign "Beware:Gun inside!" first.

In the home with the sign, "Beware:Gun inside!", chances are greater that some child inside that home will die of accidental gunshot or that that childs father, in a fit of rage, jealousy or passion will shoot and kill his wife and maybe that child too.

That's a fact Jack!

if those statistics were true I should have been dead years ago. Besides anyone who has had a statistics class in college would know that any Statistical numbers can be used to prove anything at any time.

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

Just an observation:

Absolutely agree; my household is gun-free also and I wouldn't have it any other way.

great-put a sign on your front door or front lawn proclaiming that fact. I am tired of people like you bashing my rights while gaining some protection from those of us who realize that personal safety is an individual responsibility

Its funny that almost everyone who deals with criminals on a constant basis has guns-judges, prosecutors and cops. EVEN RON KUBY has a gun. I know-he helped me get my NY carry permit many many years ago

I said some hoplohobes. I didn't say 1069. Read a bit better-you seem to think I was attacking you specifically rather than using your comments as a springboard. I do believe that those who are against people owning guns for self defense should have the balls to put such signs up.

You addressed her, specifically, in your response post. This is why I don't, usually, venture into gun debates. I do not want a gun in my house. I do not have a problem with you having a gun in your house (as long as those there use it safely). For this set of comments, I get attacked for trying to elimintate a gun owner's rights. No where do my previous comments claim that. Telling someone, like me, to put a sign on my door saying I don't have a gun for self defense, is an obnoxious and overgeneralized attempt to pigeon-hole anyone who doesn't want a gun as someone against your rights to have one.

I do not want a gun. You want a gun. I do not have a problem with you wanting and having a gun, Why do you have a problem with me not wanting or having one?

 

[RightinNYC]

Guns are used to kill two out of every three homicide victims in the United States, and new research shows that easy-access guns in the home make a difference. Homicide rates are highest in states where more households have guns, the national survey concludes.

This is the most pathetic claim of causation that I've ever heard. Think about this for a second.

Even assuming that all the data isn't cooked, here are the two facts:

1) In certain states, there is a higher homicide rate.
2) Those states often share a correlation with an increased percentage of gun ownership.


Now, looking at those two facts, this idiotic researcher drew the conclusion that 2 -> 1.

What about the more obvious conclusion? If someone lives in a crappy area that is unsafe and prone to homicides, they are far more likely to buy a gun for self-protection.

I guess this guy must have slept through the correlation =/= causation day of stats.

 

[FreeThinker]

The data was cooked: the researcher factored in gun suicide as gun crimes and left Washington D.C., the highest crime rate area in the nation, out of the survey.

The "researcher" in this little survey has been known for activism. He's biased.