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France, Germany, UK to meet Iran on nuclear deal (Radio France International) (2 Viewers)

Mycroft said:
shrug...

This is exactly how Trump deals with ever foreign nation...friend or foe. This is his stance.
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"Shrug" is exactly what you mean and exactly why this country is impotent at the moment. Thanks for your help.
 
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ElChupacabra said:
By that logic, should we trust North Korea? They've proven they can't be trust worthy, so what is the distinction? If you don't want to make a deal with Iran, then what are you proposing?
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Of course we shouldn't trust NK.

Me? I think we should make life as hard as we can for Iran...until they totally give up their nukes, their missiles, their support of terrorists, and their efforts to destabilise the ME.
 
itsforthekids said:
I hope they enjoy the circle jerk!
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Likely will, as the big prick, Uncle Sam will be at spraying off across his many herds of sheeple. Open wide!!
 
MateoMtnClimber said:
I tried to copy and paste for you, but you really just need to read the whole article. I have thirty more if you need them.

Iran nuclear deal: Key details - BBC News
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You're just not getting the point.

I said Iran got what they wanted up front and then asked "what exactly did Iran give up in this compromise? A pause in some limited aspects of nuclear weapon development is not much of a compromise considering all they got for it, is it?"
Your own link confirmed that.
Now ... where're the many articles that tell us how Iran permanently gave up their nuclear weapon initiatives?
Even if they violate this weak agreement, which they have, any penalty has to be agreed to by ... wait for it ... the UN.
Yeah. Sure.
The UN has been silent about Iran's continued work on ballistic missiles.
 
Mycroft said:
Of course we shouldn't trust NK.

Me? I think we should make life as hard as we can for Iran...until they totally give up their nukes, their missiles, their support of terrorists, and their efforts to destabilise the ME.
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Their nuclear weapons I agree, because they are signatories of the NPT. Missiles enters a different territory because we're challenging a nation's ability to defend itself. I find these situations interesting in that they're not about the actual problem of destabilizing regions, but who gets to do it. This is why hard liners take the stances they do because the message is essentially a "might makes right", so their response is to obtain that might so they're not trifled with. We come off as hypocrites given our history of supporting terrorists in the region. I'd like to find a better way out than putting a foot on Iran's neck that will embolden them even further and isolate the moderates to the point everyone in the country hates the US. That matters because that will be the sentiment that gets voted into power.
 
ElChupacabra said:
Which is pretty daft in my opinion, unless you want to only maintain binary relationships.
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That is exactly what Trump is doing. How could you not know that? Heck, it's not like he's hiding anything.

1. He wants bilateral trade agreements.

2. He deals one on one with ALL world leaders. Which is not to say he has a completely different sheet of music for each of them.

3. He avoids, whenever he can, group think.
 
Mycroft said:
That is exactly what Trump is doing. How could you not know that? Heck, it's not like he's hiding anything.

1. He wants bilateral trade agreements.

2. He deals one on one with ALL world leaders. Which is not to say he has a completely different sheet of music for each of them.

3. He avoids, whenever he can, group think.
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What I mean is having binary relationships is daft (i.e. good guy/bad guy binary thinking)
 
ElChupacabra said:
Their nuclear weapons I agree, because they are signatories of the NPT. Missiles enters a different territory because we're challenging a nation's ability to defend itself. I find these situations interesting in that they're not about the actual problem of destabilizing regions, but who gets to do it. This is why hard liners take the stances they do because the message is essentially a "might makes right", so their response is to obtain that might so they're not trifled with. We come off as hypocrites given our history of supporting terrorists in the region. I'd like to find a better way out than putting a foot on Iran's neck that will embolden them even further and isolate the moderates to the point everyone in the country hates the US. That matters because that will be the sentiment that gets voted into power.
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1. Ballistic missiles are not defensive weapons.

2. Iran has its fingers in every boiling pot in the ME. That is destabilizing.

3. If all they were interested in was defending themselves, they wouldn't be arming every single terrorist group in the region.

4. Nobody...now that Saddam is gone...is threatening Iran. Their actions are their own choice.
 
ElChupacabra said:
What I mean is having binary relationships is daft (i.e. good guy/bad guy binary thinking)
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I don't know what you mean by "good guy/bad guy". From what I know about Trump, he is willing to work with and make deals with anyone.

However, there are some who are just plain bad apples and they have to be dealt with. Trump won't hesitate to deal with them.
 
MateoMtnClimber said:
If you would like to return to reality and support your assertions with credible sources I will be happy to engage with you. For now, your partisan vomitus offers me (and you) no value.
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lol.... you are demanding proof while Iran runs amok through the middle east. Peel off your partisan skin before you demand value from anyone on here.


Value? LOL

You don't have a clue as to who runs Iran, and what crazy bastards they really are.

There is a reason why the middle east is forming a coalition against Iran, but this escapes ****ing idiot liberals.
 
Mycroft said:
Of course we shouldn't trust NK.

Me? I think we should make life as hard as we can for Iran...until they totally give up their nukes, their missiles, their support of terrorists, and their efforts to destabilise the ME.
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So different than North Korea. Why is that?
 
Mycroft said:
Shrug...

I quoted you. You denied. I call that walking back.

But...whatever you say...
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I told you that neither you nor the incompetent WH can articulate a Trump doctrine, which was your claim. Then you internet-shrugged several times. I didn't walk back anything. You simply can't defend your own brain dead assertions. Oh, well.
 
bubbabgone said:
You're just not getting the point.

I said Iran got what they wanted up front and then asked "what exactly did Iran give up in this compromise? A pause in some limited aspects of nuclear weapon development is not much of a compromise considering all they got for it, is it?"
Your own link confirmed that.
Now ... where're the many articles that tell us how Iran permanently gave up their nuclear weapon initiatives?
Even if they violate this weak agreement, which they have, any penalty has to be agreed to by ... wait for it ... the UN.
Yeah. Sure.
The UN has been silent about Iran's continued work on ballistic missiles.
Click to expand...

Uh huh. So please tell me how the president's temper tantrum this week deterred Iran from building the nuclear weapons that everyone in the world except you and some equally clueless right wing partisans in the US and Israel says they're not building anyway.
 
RetiredUSN said:
lol.... you are demanding proof while Iran runs amok through the middle east. Peel off your partisan skin before you demand value from anyone on here.


Value? LOL

You don't have a clue as to who runs Iran, and what crazy bastards they really are.

There is a reason why the middle east is forming a coalition against Iran, but this escapes ****ing idiot liberals.
Click to expand...

So, you still have nothing except a string of insults and unsubstantiated far right psychosis. You go with that.
 
Mycroft said:
shrug...

If they continue to support Iran, they might find themselves between a rock and a hard place.

Oh well...their choice.
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I think this is where Trump wanted to manipulate them.
 
The foreign ministers of Britain, France, and Germany are preparing to meet with Iranian officials on Monday to determine how the agreement can be preserved without the United States’ cooperation. The fundamental challenge is finding a way to ensure that Iran still derives enough economic benefits from the agreement to override its interest in pursuing a nuclear weapon. European politicians are ready to take radical measures to realize that objective — but European businesses might not be.

EU leaders have discussed providing firms that do business with Iran special financing from the European Investment Bank, and passing legislation that protects European firms from American sanctions — modeled after a “blocking regulation” from 1996 that deflected sanctions against European companies that violated America’s Cuba embargo.

But even if Europe goes forward with such confrontational measures, its corporations might still see little profit in jeopardizing their access to the American market: Most companies have much less to gain by embracing Tehran than to lose by alienating Washington; America’s banking system is more valuable than Iran’s oil fields.

Europe may be ready to treat Trump as adversary. But it’s not clear whether it has the resources to defy his will.
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Can Europe Save the Iran Nuclear Deal?

It looks to me like Trump has the power to impose his will upon Europe here, not just for the reasons given but because Europe has very little military by their own choice, until they decide otherwise they are the lessor partners in the USA/Europe relationship. If they did not understand this before now they surely will get educated now.

Trump will do the teaching.
 
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