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Fox News: Obamacare Numbers Are 'Phony' (1 Viewer)

ObamacareFail said:
I don't have a problem with a common sense level of regulation of the healthcare industry by the government. A virtual takeover of the healthcare system as has happened with obamacare is what I am against. And I have never had a problem with taxpayer funded healthcare for our military veterans. I could have signed up as far back as 1975. I didn't because VA healthcare has limitations compared to private healthcare. I like choices. With the passage of obamacare, private healthcare is now nothing more then government healthcare administered by private healthcare insurance providers.
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Good news! Contrary to things you may have heard on some wack-a-doo media outlets fraudulently branding themselves as news organizations, government did not take over the healthcare system. Aetna, UnitedHealthcare, Kaiser, HCA, Exempla, Centura and others are all alive, well and delivering better bottom lines than ever. Those nasty capitalists that we all know and love are continuing their brand of exploitation of the healthcare consumer with very minimal interference from the government. Now, thanks to mandates, they are all FORCED to take on more customers.

Sorry, this notion that our healthcare system was taken over is the biggest batch of malarky ever perpetrated by.... Sorry you had to be a victimized by it.
 
upsideguy said:
Good news! Contrary to things you may have heard on some wack-a-doo media outlets fraudulently branding themselves as news organizations, government did not take over the healthcare system. Aetna, UnitedHealthcare, Kaiser, HCA, Exempla, Centura and others are all alive, well and delivering better bottom lines than ever. Those nasty capitalists that we all know and love are continuing their brand of exploitation of the healthcare consumer with very minimal interference from the government. Now, thanks to mandates, they are all FORCED to take on more customers.

Sorry, this notion that our healthcare system was taken over is the biggest batch of malarky ever perpetrated by.... Sorry you had to be a victimized by it.
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Like the notion or not....that is exactly what has happened. Obamacare is basically government run healthcare administered by private health insurers.
 
ObamacareFail said:
Like the notion or not....that is exactly what has happened. Obamacare is basically government run healthcare administered by private health insurers.
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Besides being wrong, that makes absolutely no sense at all. The fact is that most Americans will only be aware of Obamacare is when they do their taxes.
 
ObamacareFail said:
Like the notion or not....that is exactly what has happened. Obamacare is basically government run healthcare administered by private health insurers.
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Like the notion or not, the government is not running a thing. The "notion" to which you refer is a gross (and I mean gross) over dramatization of what happened designed by certain media organization to incite those that did not know better. Sorry you were suckered into this. The government did not take over a thing... it only added regulations to the definition of what constitutes a health insurance policy; tightened some medicare regulations; and mandated that everyone needed to buy insurance.

Perhaps you think the government has also taken over the airline industry. After all, no a single flight can fly without a flight plan approved by a government employee, nor can a plane even leave the gate area without the express approval of an employee paid by the government.

I suggest you study up on government run healthcare and get back to us. No one likes a Chicken Little.


....actually, let's try this another way. After all, this is DEBATE politics. You have made the assertion that government has taken over the healthcare industry. Prove it! Make your case. Anything less is nothing more than debating impressions, which is not debate but schoolyard shout downs. Show us how the government has taken over healthcare. If you can't make the case, you can't make the statement.... this is debate
 
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pbrauer said:
Besides being wrong, that makes absolutely no sense at all. The fact is that most Americans will only be aware of Obamacare is when they do their taxes.
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You got that right. Unless they go to a doctor.
 
Then what happens? If I went to my doctor today how wuold it be differnet?
Grant said:
You got that right. Unless they go to a doctor.
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mak2 said:
Then what happens? If I went to my doctor today how wuold it be differnet?
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It seems that many doctors are boycotting Obamacare or leaving altogether for private practice. But if you are one of those who, "If you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor. If you like your health care plan, you can keep your health care plan" then good for you.
 
Which ones? How many? Where at?
Grant said:
It seems that many doctors are boycotting Obamacare or leaving altogether for private practice. But if you are one of those who, "If you like your doctor, you can keep your doctor. If you like your health care plan, you can keep your health care plan" then good for you.
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I think your soruces are a bit biased and have been firmly discredited in several threads. I know for a fact nurse vacancies are not soaring, in fact they are making modest gains, not as much as nurses would like. Not all are getting jobs out of school.
Grant said:
Oh, c'mon! You can do the research as well as I. Just Google!

Doctor, Nurse Vacancies Soar Amid Obamacare Rollout - Forbes

Vast Majority of Doctors Boycotting Obamacare...in California - Katie Pavlich

Report: 83 percent of doctors have considered quitting over Obamacare | The Daily Caller

Why not inform yourself?
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mak2 said:
Please describe what "real" healthcare reform looks like.
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Eliminate the artificial ceiling on medical school enrollment and allow individual programs to set limits based upon building and faculty capacity. Allow for a board of health professionals to determine merit of a malpractice case before sending it to court, further tort reform. Remand health standards to the state level and allow them to set legal regulations and standards.

Allow the government to create a last resort system of insurance for those who have pre-existing conditions known as a high risk pool. This insurer of last resort would have to follow all private insurance regulations such as cash on hand requirements, funding would have to be accounted for, no funds could be moved from that program to others, reinvestment, and all applicable accounting practices regulated on the private market. This would be a premium based service and some tax payer money if necessary could make up the difference.

Change the patent structure on drugs slightly to allow for generics to enter the market earlier, even if they increase slightly, allow for licensing of such to the patenting company.
 
mak2 said:
I think your soruces are a bit biased and have been firmly discredited in several threads. I know for a fact nurse vacancies are not soaring, in fact they are making modest gains, not as much as nurses would like. Not all are getting jobs out of school.
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Perhaps they are biased but they are quoting people in the profession and there are many other sources saying much the same thing. You can research yourself until you find one which you feel is 'unbiased' but, meanwhile, you have not mentioned any sources whatsoever to support your 'facts'.
 
Quoting people in the profession is far different than conducting studies.
Grant said:
Perhaps they are biased but they are quoting people in the profession and there are many other sources saying much the same thing. You can research yourself until you find one which you feel is 'unbiased' but, meanwhile, you have not mentioned any sources whatsoever to support your 'facts'.
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imagep said:
humbolt said:
I certainly agree that our economic growth is slow, too slow, but it's not stagnant. Our slow growth has been approved and validated by the American voter during the last presidential election. George Bush set a low bar for our economy when he left office with a declining GDP and hundreds of thousands of job losses per month. Baring an unexpected and unlikely recession during the next six months, Obama will get to point to 67 consecutive months of GDP growth and 63 consecutive months of job growth.
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That isn't stagnant? 0.1% growth in Q1 2014 which should have been negative, but the healthcare industry saved that.

Maybe you should be bringing up Solindra, instead. It has been highly publicized that oil imports are dropping like a rock, and the production of oil and natural gas in the US have been skyrocketing.
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We may be producing more, but we don't use it. Gotta keep the price up. Exports have shot way up in distillate petroleum. Can't export crude, but just barely refined distillate can be. This is for sure some exploiting of our energy resources, just not for us common folk. Imported oil is dropping like a rock? This graph would show otherwise. The drop after 2008 would likely be attributed to the downturn in the economy which led to the decimation of jobs and demand. I wouldn't say it dropped like a rock when we are still at 10 million barrels a day.

That's been said every single year for the past 220. It's a tired old nonspecific argument that no one other than libertarians and tea party nuts buy into. Those people are already going to vote for republicans, so that's not an election changer.
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Patriot Act, NSA spying revelations, meddling with foreign affairs for our own benefit yet when Russia does the same thing we are outraged, lack of transparency from the POTUS who claimed in 2008 to run the most transparent admin. in history, cameras now recording license plates, cameras now taking over as police for traffic tickets, the FCC wants to "monitor" news coverage at not only broadcast stations, but also at print publications that the FCC has no authority to regulate. I could go on.
But its for our own good right? Making the world a better place one erosion of liberty at a time....now that is PROGRESS!
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mak2 said:
I think your soruces are a bit biased and have been firmly discredited in several threads. I know for a fact nurse vacancies are not soaring, in fact they are making modest gains, not as much as nurses would like. Not all are getting jobs out of school.
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What source isn't? I like how you show yours in your claim. :roll:
 
Then came the recession in 2008, when health care spending dropped to its lowest rate in nearly 50 years. Seemingly overnight, the nursing shortage morphed to a nursing surplus and job vacancies dwindled to nothing. Layoffs and hiring freezes became the status quo. Particularly hard hit were new graduates, who found that it was taking months, if not longer, to secure a position.

With the economy recovering, and the worst of the tough times presumably past, the outlook for nursing jobs is bright, according to many experts. The Bureau of Labor Statistics projects that registered nursing will be the top occupation in terms of job growth through the year 2020. An estimated 26% increase in nursing jobs is predicted between 2010 and 2020.

Revisiting the Nursing Job Market : AJN The American Journal of Nursing

JRSaindo said:
What source isn't? I like how you show yours in your claim. :roll:
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mak2 said:
Then came the recession in 2008, when health care spending dropped to its lowest rate in nearly 50 years. Seemingly overnight, the nursing shortage morphed to a nursing surplus and job vacancies dwindled to nothing. Layoffs and hiring freezes became the status quo. Particularly hard hit were new graduates, who found that it was taking months, if not longer, to secure a position.

With the economy recovering, and the worst of the tough times presumably past, the outlook for nursing jobs is bright, according to many experts. The Bureau of Labor Statistics projects that registered nursing will be the top occupation in terms of job growth through the year 2020. An estimated 26% increase in nursing jobs is predicted between 2010 and 2020.

Revisiting the Nursing Job Market : AJN The American Journal of Nursing
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Sounds like a market reaction to the recession. Now with the ACA, jobs will pick up for them because now everyone is required to have insurance. If it weren't for the increase in healthcare spending, GDP would have been negative last quarter. So yeah, the future does look bright for the medical field. Too bad costs are still going up.
 
Cost have gone up for years. I look for cost to go up for a while, while people who used to go to the ER only when very sick get used to going to the clinic before they are very sick, and more and more clinics open. It will take awhile. But is it still better to have healthcare for all and a system to make it more efficent and cost effective.
JRSaindo said:
Sounds like a market reaction to the recession. Now with the ACA, jobs will pick up for them because now everyone is required to have insurance. If it weren't for the increase in healthcare spending, GDP would have been negative last quarter. So yeah, the future does look bright for the medical field. Too bad costs are still going up.
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The numbers are made up

How many PAID vs how may we are told "signed up" do not match

The bottom line is Obamacare was doomed from the start and taxpayers will be on the hook for another huge liberal failure
 
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