I don't think I'd say it is an AGGRESSIVE act, but it IS a suspicious act.
I actively watch for people following me (ex-cop habits). If I think I see someone following me, I will make two 90 degree turns and see if they're still behind me. If so, I assume it is deliberate. I will then either take evasive action or else pick my ground and turn to confront them.
Old military adage: Once is happenstance, twice may be coincedence, but three times is enemy action. If they follow me through two turns headed back the way we came, it is almost certainly deliberate.
It may not be hostile; they may want to hand me a religious tract, or ask me if I'd like to subscribe for 12 issues of Useless Magazine, or ask me if I'd like to buy health insurance.... but if I can't avoid them I'm going to find out before they come up behind me.
Interestingly enough, I once had an incident where I was in a very similar position to Treyvon Martin. I was even wearing a hoodie. (It was cold and windy).
It was daytime. I was walking back from my sister's house down the road, passing a closed garage building with a parking area in front. I veered into the parking lot a bit as I passed, since there is no sidewalk or curb and I didn't want to be any closer to the passing cars than necessary.
THAT was apparently enough to qualify as suspicious in the minds of two young men who'd appointed themselves to guard their Uncle's garage, which had been burgled twice in two weeks. One of them stepped out to block my way, while another tried to circle behind me. I saw #2 and placed myself where I could see both men at once. When #2 saw me do this, he stopped and looked at #1.
What they didn't know: I had a small pistol in the pocket of my hoodie and was pointing at them from inside the pocket.
#1 started barking questions at me: who was I, what was I doing, etc. I barked back that I was walking down the damn road and it was none of his business. THEN I recognized him as a local, and pushed back my hood so he could see me and recognize me as well, which he did. He explained what they were doing. I told them it was a bad idea, confronting strangers on flimsy suspicions, and went on my way.
Somebody just about got shot. Could have been me, of course... I don't know what THEY had in THEIR pockets either.
It could have turned out as a tragic case of misunderstanding ending with one or more dead bodies; I was not pleased to have my way blocked or see someone trying to get behind me, not one bit.
Following someone is not ILLEGAL, that I know of.... but it IS a suspicious and dangerous thing to do.
She said and I quote "Anyone who follows people and isn't a cop or a licensed PI should be considered a threat." this would include plain closed officers and most PI's. It is hyperbole, so I responded with such.
Then it's a pity Trayvon Martin wasn't armed, because he could have legally shot Zimmerman dead on the spot, right?
Wait, you're still comparing the average individual to you, a self-described former police officer and security guard. I'm not sure if you are aware of this, but that puts you above the average individuals awareness, confidence, self-defense prepardness, etc. And if you also carry a gun, that puts you even further up the list. Again, can you stop for a moment and discuss the GENERAL notion of someone, other than yourself, (i.e. a majority of people? Most people? Average person?) in the situation.It doesn't but that is not the problem here as it is legal.
I have been followed. I turn around and say can I help you? Only one time was it an issue as the person pulled a knife. I laughed and pulled my badge and handcuffs and he ran. Notice I did not pull a gun?
I haven't mentioned legality, and the OP poll doesn't either. There are many improper, bad, unethical things people do, that are not illegal, as I'm sure you know. We're talking risks to ones safety. If some perceives someone else is putting them at risk, they may perceive that as aggressive behavior.. So what they perceive has no bearing other than it is not illegal to be followed unless it is repeated behavior.
The real problem with her post was that she didn't say "potential" before threat. It would be foolish to not assume that some stranger following you is not a potential threat. You were a cop, so I know that you know that's just the smart way to approach things.
Is following someone an aggressive act?
Simple question, simple answer.
I don't believe that it is. If it was then police would not be able to legally follow people. Investigators (PI's) would not legally be able to do it. Paparazzi would not be able to do it.
It's not nosy to be curious about why someone is following you. It's a part of making a threat assessment. The very fact that you have had a knife pulled on you in such scenarios proves that you are actually making just such an assessment. Fear has nothing to do with it.
Only an idiot would assume that the person following them means them no harm and, based on that assumption, refrain from further investigation.
Not being an idiot =/= being afraid.
If you aren't a shoplifter and you aren't breaking any laws someone following you had got to be perceived as a predator.
The real problem with her post was that she didn't say "potential" before threat. It would be foolish to not assume that some stranger following you is not a potential threat. You were a cop, so I know that you know that's just the smart way to approach things.
No, I was talking about myself following someone. Not someone following me.
That would depend on allot of "if's" at best.
I was talking about me following as I mentioned.
A potential predator, yes. That's just the smart thing to assume.
But following you doesn't automatically make them a predator. They might be doing it for a lot of non-predatory reasons as well.
I changed directions once or twice in my life to figure out if I knew the person that was walking for an opportunity to catch up, disengaged when I realized it wasn't who I was thinking of. I've had people follow me to return something I dropped and have done so for others as well.A potential predator, yes. That's just the smart thing to assume.
But following you doesn't automatically make them a predator. They might be doing it for a lot of non-predatory reasons as well.
Wait, you're still comparing the average individual to you, a self-described former police officer and security guard. I'm not sure if you are aware of this, but that puts you above the average individuals awareness, confidence, self-defense prepardness, etc. And if you also carry a gun, that puts you even further up the list. Again, can you stop for a moment and discuss the GENERAL notion of someone, other than yourself, (i.e. a majority of people? Most people? Average person?) in the situation.
I haven't mentioned legality, and the OP poll doesn't either. There are many improper, bad, unethical things people do, that are not illegal, as I'm sure you know. We're talking risks to ones safety. If some perceives someone else is putting them at risk, they may perceive that as aggressive behavior.
Like what? What sort of raving nutter follows people for no reason?
From the 911 call, do you think it was suspicious and dangerous for Martin to turn and come angrily towards Zimmerman with Martin putting his hand in his pocket as he did - until he saw and maybe heard Zimmerman on the phone to the police department?
Is following someone an aggressive act?
Simple question, simple answer.
I don't believe that it is. If it was then police would not be able to legally follow people. Investigators (PI's) would not legally be able to do it. Paparazzi would not be able to do it.
From the 911 call, do you think it was suspicious and dangerous for Martin to turn and come angrily towards Zimmerman with Martin putting his hand in his pocket as he did - until he saw and maybe heard Zimmerman on the phone to the police department?
Like what? What sort of raving nutter follows people for no reason?
If they turned around and confronted you about following them, would you not think that this was a perfectly reasonable behavior on their part?
If they turned around and confronted you about following them, would you not think that this was a perfectly reasonable behavior on their part?
NOt really. If a stranger is following you, it would be very stupid to not take precautions.
As I asked above, would you think it's unreasonable for someone you are following to confront you about it?
Is following someone an aggressive act?
Simple question, simple answer.
I don't believe that it is. If it was then police would not be able to legally follow people. Investigators (PI's) would not legally be able to do it. Paparazzi would not be able to do it.
I think whats going on here is a disconnect how women react to the feeling of being followed and how men react to it.....Everyone with half a brain knows women are mostly the victims and they have every right to be more sensitive about any feeling of being followed....they had better be
I'm asking you.What is the average person? This is a country of 300,000,000 people, so what is average? A large proportion has had some kind of self defense training or military experience. So what is average?
If they are put "at risk" yes. Simply following someone does not put anyone at risk automatically.
I think they both made some bad miscalculations. Zimmerman should've listened to dispatch and not gotten out of his vehicle. Martin should have restrained himself from being overly aggressive in confronting Zimmerman about following him. If either man had exercised a little measure of prudence, this may not have happened at all.
Zimmerman's following of Martin was not prudent and could be construed as suspicious by Martin. However, the key to unraveling the incident, IMO, is the final seconds leading up to the physical fight, and who initiated it. I'd have to have more evidence that Zimmerman was the initiator or escalator of the physical fight before I could convict him of anything other than being imprudent, which is not a crime.
As it is, without an eyewitness other than Zimmerman, available evidence (Z's testimony, Z's injuries, eyewitness seeing Treyvon on top of Zimmerman beating him) I could not convict Z of anything because of a lack of evidence of criminal wrongdoing. If following someone is a criminal act, then a lot of charity workers, religious tract-givers, brochure passer-outers, raffle-ticket and insurance salesmen, not to mention persons of amorous intent, are guilty too.
As I said, when I detect someone following me I evade if I can, or confront if I can't. When I confront, I put my back to something safe and loudly inquire why they are following me while they are still a safe distance away. I don't run up on them and attack them without knowing what is going on.
I personally consider the Zimmerman/Martin case to be a comedy-of-errors with a tragic ending, where both men acted poorly and contributed to the situation.... but from what info I have I don't think there is evidence to convict Z of murder-2nd.
Like what? What sort of raving nutter follows people for no reason?
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