joe six-pack
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In my view, what placement you put it in is not really relevant.firstly, it's worth pointing out that this commandment's placement as the second is itself in contention; Protestans tend to place it as #2, while Catholics tend to place it as the second half of #1, saying that it flows from having no other gods.
It's both "don't make a likeness of anything" and "don't worship a likeness of anything." But, yes, that's up for interpretation in terms of how far you take it.i think that's key; what is being said here isn't "don't have artwork", it's "don't make and worship idols";
No. "Hey don't do that" isn't what God said.which we know both from historical text and independent archaeology was a good bit of the local (non-hebrew) religion at the time. carving a figure out of stone (melting a calf out of gold, whatever), declaring it to be "a god" and then worshiping it was a big deal at the time, and so "hey, don't do that" became a commandment.
I agree.really, it's about focus: there is one God, He is the God of everything and everybody, don't put other things before him.
Read Again:The second commandment isn't being broken because nothing is etched or engraved (graven).
Another interpretation actually phrase the translation like this:Jesus was taken down off the Cross, so Jesus isn't enduring Crucifixion in Heaven. Jesus isn't in the tomb, isn't in the earth....so all of the admonitions of the second commandment don't apply.
That also breaks the 10 Commandments. Read Commandment ONE:The renderings of the Crucifix are to remind us of Jesus being the perfect sacrifice to atone for humankind's sins and no further human sacrifice would ever be legit from then on. We are to be reminded of all that was done on our behalf and to act accordingly...with gratitude and humility, praising God all the while. You don't worship the Crucifixion, you worship the 1/3 of the Trinity who was sacrificed for you, personally, so you'd have individual, personal Salvation given to you by your Redeemer.
I actually think the Church preforms logical cartwheels to explain away the parts of it's doctrine that doesn't make sense. Christmas is actually a pagan holiday, just as an example of the weirdness of how the Romans originated Christianity.I don't believe a word of it any more, but this is what I taught when I taught Religion in an RC parochial school.
Regards from Rosie
This is also interesting considering the fish if often a sign of Christianity.or that is in the water under the earth
What the commandment means is to not make images intended for worship like idols. I don't worship a cross or a painting. How many threads attacking Christianity do we need?
What I think many are missing is this part you shall not bow down to them or serve them. It gives context to the commandment.
God says pictures of Saints, Mother Marry or Jesus on the Cross is bad.
Exodus 25:17-21 (New International Version)
17 "Make an atonement cover [a] of pure gold—two and a half cubits long and a cubit and a half wide. 18 And make two cherubim out of hammered gold at the ends of the cover. 19 Make one cherub on one end and the second cherub on the other; make the cherubim of one piece with the cover, at the two ends. 20 The cherubim are to have their wings spread upward, overshadowing the cover with them. The cherubim are to face each other, looking toward the cover. 21 Place the cover on top of the ark and put in the ark the Testimony, which I will give you.
I must also note that most Christians that I know, do not "bow down" to the cross, but do agree that Jesus IS God, and His image on the cross is indicative of the entire message of Christianity and salvation. To me, seeing the cross, or an image of Christ upon it, only serves as a reminder or a focal point in the story of my faith, if you will.This is idolatry. A violation of the Second Commandment, yet this image can be seen in every Christian Church. Millions of Christians pray to wood carving of Jesus and worship the image of a man being murdered. Can someone explain this?
Thanks.
In my view--and a literal interpretation of the Bible--worshiping Jesus is a violation of the 1st Commandment. Jesus never said, "I am God, worship me." But he did say to keep the 10 Commandments; and commandment one says to worship only God, who identifies himself as the Hebrew characters יהוהWhat you have to understand is that back in those days people were more likely to worship an inanimate statue than the deity on which that statue was based on.
Take, for example, when Moses was on Mount Sinai getting the Ten Commandments from God. While Moses were doing that, the Hebrews at the base of the mountain got worried that they were abandoned and decided to collect all the gold in the camp and fashioned a Golden Calf to worship. They then worshiped the statue itself. Moses came down, saw it, got pissed, and tore down the statue with the tablets and broke both to pieces. Moses then had to go back up and get another copy.
When Christians have paintings of Jesus Christ on the Cross, they don't pray to the painting. They pray to Jesus Christ. That's the key difference. Christians don't mistake a rendering of the Messiah as the Messiah itself. Christians understand that such paintings don't have any divine power or force.
This is why as a general rule most Christians don't think it's a big deal to depict Jesus Christ in media.
The angels on the Arch were not for worship, as images of Jesus/Joshua's cruxifiction is. That's the difference.To the contrary, God instructed his people in the Old Testament specifically how to construct the Ark of the Covenant, and it did indeed have golden images of angels on the cover:
"Flesh" is not God. God cannot die. God doesn't sleep or weep or grow.I must also note that most Christians that I know, do not "bow down" to the cross, but do agree that Jesus IS God, and His image on the cross is indicative of the entire message of Christianity and salvation. To me, seeing the cross, or an image of Christ upon it, only serves as a reminder or a focal point in the story of my faith, if you will.
In my view--and a literal interpretation of the Bible--worshiping Jesus is a violation of the 1st Commandment. Jesus never said, "I am God, worship me." But he did say to keep the 10 Commandments; and commandment one says to worship only God, who identifies himself as the Hebrew characters יהוה
Tetragrammaton - Four Character name of God <-- God's name is YHWH.
"I, Yahweh, am the God of Abraham your father and the God of Isaac. The ground on which you are lying I shall give to you and your descendants." God is identified as "YHWH" all throughout the Old Testament, if you just look. Sadly, many English translations replace "YHWH" with the title "Lord." I find that to be blasphemy.
The God of the Old Testament has a name, and it isn't "Jesus." In fact, that wasn't even Christ's real name. The son of Mary was named Yeshua, which translated into English directly is Joshua. "Jesus" is derived from a Greek translation, that was translated into Latin as Jesu. Wrong, wrong, wrong.
That doesn't change the fact that people bow down and pray to images of "Joshua."
And, regardless of that semantic difference, that violates the 1st Commandment of worshiping YHWH / הוה'.People don't bow down and pray to images of Jesus.
People bow down and pray to Jesus in places that have images of him.
Huge difference.
Yep that's exactly what I'm talking about.I've wondered about this as well. My church doesn't have any statues, crucifixes or even a cross in the sanctuary. I often wonder why people stand in front of, say, a statue of Mary and pray. I would be uncomfortable going to a church with statues and such.
I also think it's highly inappropriate for humans to deem other humans "Saints," but that's for another thread.
And, regardless of that semantic difference, that violates the 1st Commandment of worshiping YHWH / הוה'.
The 10 Commandments are clear and Christianity would seem to have turned it's back on them. Please explain this.
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Also, "Jesus" was not Christ's name, as I mentioned.
Not true. Some pray to various Saints. Some pray to Mother Mary. "Hail Mary, full of Grace..."There is no semantic difference. Christians pray to Jesus himself. This is regardless as to whether or not there are paintings of of him.
That's a really important difference between Judaism and Christianity. Christians believe they know the face and image of God.
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