Democratic Debate Discussion Thread

[pbrauer]

She never missed an opportunity to bash Republicans did she?

WOW That's a new concept, I wonder if the Republicans will do the same thing.

 

[Chomsky]

The American Public has bifurcated. :shrug:

Yes, and it all now comes down to getting out your vote - whoever gets their turnout wins (in general terms, of course).

 

[tech30528]

I only was able to watch the last hour or so but it was definitely entertaining.

Webb and Chafee were just plain poor performers and, frankly, they also seemed to get ignored.

O'Malley was energetic but it didn't appear that he got a lot of face time either and when he did...well, It's nice to know that he wants to green the hell out of the country.

Hillary seems to have prioritized demonizing Republicans and Sanders appears to like demonizing corporations and the wealthy.

Sanders struck me as being the most sincere and most honest of the bunch but his ideas almost made Hillary sound conservative.

I'll try to catch the rerun later on but at this point the one thing that struck me is that even Trump would be preferable to any of them and that scares the hell out of me.

Spot on the way I saw it.

 

[sangha]

Simply a return to historic norms. The mistake is believing 1945-1975 was normal. It was not. That period was an anomaly.

"Our best days are behind us"

Jack's idea of a winning political platform

 

[Lutherf]

If you actually believe trump would be preferable to any of them, that's disturbing.

Well, every one of them on that stage tonight were talking about how great it would be to do stuff I fiercely disagree with so my position shouldn't be a surprise.

Like I said, I didn't get to watch the whole thing but free college for everybody is a ludicrous idea. It would devalue a degree even more than it already has been and even Sanders noted that a Bachelor's today is like a HS diploma a few decades ago. I'm also appalled at the idea of trying to "fix" the economy through "rape the rich" schemes. You simply don't create incentive to succeed by punishing success. That should be obvious but apparently it's all a Republican conspiracy.

 

[Fiddytree]

The American Public has bifurcated. :shrug:

Largely so. No doubt. You and I agree with the problem. Whether that will continue without substantial governmental modifications, I am less certain.

 

[poweRob]

Spot on the way I saw it.

Bull****. You'll be voting for Sanders and you know it. You may not tell anyone but that's the way it's going down. You and I both know this.

 

[anatta]

If you actually believe trump would be preferable to any of them, that's disturbing.

time for me to start looking 3rd party again.. I find them all utterly lacking in desires to reach across the aisle to reverse
"post Constitutional governing" ..
Clinton is happy to issue executive orders...she's already promised to superceed Obama on that particular monstrosity.

Seriously. If Clinton weren't such a screw up (Libya/Syria/Emails) I'd consider her..
but she's just more Democratic pandering to their identity groups.

Sanders is a nice guy..I don't think he's got it though for POTUS...

Paging Gary Johnson!!! *Be Libertarian for a day* ( his 2008 motto)

 

[Chomsky]

I only was able to watch the last hour or so but it was definitely entertaining.

Webb and Chafee were just plain poor performers and, frankly, they also seemed to get ignored.

O'Malley was energetic but it didn't appear that he got a lot of face time either and when he did...well, It's nice to know that he wants to green the hell out of the country.

Hillary seems to have prioritized demonizing Republicans and Sanders appears to like demonizing corporations and the wealthy.

Sanders struck me as being the most sincere and most honest of the bunch but his ideas almost made Hillary sound conservative.

I'll try to catch the rerun later on but at this point the one thing that struck me is that even Trump would be preferable to any of them and that scares the hell out of me.

Spot on the way I saw it.

Yeah, for a guy who just caught the end - he nailed it.

I was going to comment, as well.

 

[cpwill]

He plans on bagging those folks who think themselves "strategic voters" and actually believe that electing the most republican acting democrat will somehow steal republican voters away from the GOP.

These idiots miss two things:

1) Why would republicans vote for a faux republican when they can vote for a real republican?
2) A conservative dem would assure massive chunks of Dems would lose all interest in turning out to the polls all but assuring a GOP victory.​

Yup. It's the flip side of the "You Have To Vote For The Liberal Republican" argument on my side of the fence - where both rules still apply.

 

[David_N]

Well, every one of them on that stage tonight were talking about how great it would be to do stuff I fiercely disagree with so my position shouldn't be a surprise.

Like I said, I didn't get to watch the whole thing but free college for everybody is a ludicrous idea. It would devalue a degree even more than it already has been and even Sanders noted that a Bachelor's today is like a HS diploma a few decades ago. I'm also appalled at the idea of trying to "fix" the economy through "rape the rich" schemes. You simply don't create incentive to succeed by punishing success. That should be obvious but apparently it's all a Republican conspiracy.

Other countries have college paid for through taxation and it is better for low income students, our loans are getting out of control, public colleges need to be accessible to those who can't afford them. How do you know sanders plan just accepts anyone into any college? Rape the rich schemes? A modest tax increase compared to historical rates isn't raping, and if higher taxes punish initiative, why do the rich continually gain while the poor and middle class stagnate/lose out on productivity.

 

[cpwill]

Largely so. No doubt. You and I agree with the problem. Whether that will continue without substantial governmental modifications, I am less certain.

I think it likely will. The information age comes along with the balkanization of information spheres. There is no reason to come into contact with an unsettling opinion if you don't want to, and almost no penalty online for responding with spewage if you do. The people like us who come to places like this are probably more exposed to the other sides' arguments than the vast majority of voters, but by and large, we're pretty firmly settled.

 

[anatta]

Other countries have college paid for through taxation and it is better for low income students, our loans are getting out of control, public colleges need to be accessible to those who can't afford them. How do you know sanders plan just accepts anyone into any college? Rape the rich schemes? A modest tax increase compared to historical rates isn't raping, and if higher taxes punish initiative, why do the rich continually gain while the poor and middle class stagnate/lose out on productivity.

why not go after out of control spiriling college costs?

I do not want to pay for free college . I worked my way thru before I flunked out !! :lol:

 

[Fiddytree]

I think it likely will. The information age comes along with the balkanization of information spheres. There is no reason to come into contact with an unsettling opinion if you don't want to, and almost no penalty online for responding with spewage if you do. The people like us who come to places like this are probably more exposed to the other sides' arguments than the vast majority of voters, but by and large, we're pretty firmly settled.

But will they be satisfied with not getting anything done. Of course, before that moniker was settled to bills which strived to be more Henry Clay than anything else, but now when we say "anything" we are coming desperately close to that being a literal interpretation of what passes for legislative initiative.

 

[poweRob]

why not go after out of control spiriling college costs?

I do not want to pay for free college . I worked my way thru before I flunked out !! :lol:

The college tuition is paid for by a small wall street speculation tax. So if you aren't speculating on wall street you won't be paying for it.

The bonus to that tax is that speculation is running rampant and partially the reason causing really stupid imbalanced bubbles in the economy that burst. It's a lot of false investment not based on market realities and it's skewing the economy. The tax would temper that and stabilize the investment side of supply and demand.

Another great bonus to that tax is kids get the full college education and come out being able to land a job where they spend the money they make into goods and services rather than throwing it into debt from their past.

 

[US Conservative]

Sanders won this. I expect his popularity to rise after this.

Hillary will have to try and play catch up.

DRUDGE REPORT 2016®

First poll Ive seen after the debate, has Bernie beating Clinton 60% to 5%, so its not even close.

 

[Chomsky]

I think it likely will. The information age comes along with the balkanization of information spheres. There is no reason to come into contact with an unsettling opinion if you don't want to, and almost no penalty online for responding with spewage if you do. The people like us who come to places like this are probably more exposed to the other sides' arguments than the vast majority of voters, but by and large, we're pretty firmly settled.

I will say I have gained insight into the thoughts of those that think differently than myself during my time here, and have even changed or modified a few of my views.

I also ran into a few that are so far out of the realm of reality, that they scared me enough to redouble my original convictions so as not to become like them!

 

[betuadollar]

I like Webb but I'm not at all big on rhetoric, especially hollow campaign rhetoric.

Things like "gross inequality," or, free education, are utterly meaningless. There are what? Twenty million college age students right now? With an expected educational cost of some twenty trillion? Is that doable? And even if it were, how does one propose to get that through congress?

I don't believe we're going to see a big female turnout for the next election. But still, the temptation to flip the switch for a woman, for the first time in history, equates to a lot of political capital.

 

[sangha]

why not go after out of control spiriling college costs?

I do not want to pay for free college . I worked my way thru before I flunked out !! :lol:

So did I but back then tuition was about $800/semester ($50/credit)

 

[Chomsky]

why not go after out of control spiriling college costs?

I do not want to pay for free college . I worked my way thru before I flunked out !! :lol:

But then you could go back! Free! :2razz:

 

[Fiddytree]

IMO, Hillary did more than just stand her ground. She responded to criticisms in ways that put her competitors and the GOP on defense.

To some extent, I agree-perhaps more on your point about the invisible general election between Clinton and Trump-Bush-Rubio, but I would say that with a great deal more hesitancy with Sanders.

 

[poweRob]

I like Webb but I'm not at all big on rhetoric, especially hollow campaign rhetoric.

Things like "gross inequality," or, free education, are utterly meaningless. There are what? Twenty million college age students right now? With an expected educational cost of some twenty trillion? Is that doable? And even if it were, how does one propose to get that through congress?

I don't believe we're going to see a big female turnout for the next election. But still, the temptation to flip the switch for a woman, for the first time in history, equates to a lot of political capital.

Numbers aren't your strong suit huh?

Bernie Sanders issues bill to make 4-year colleges tuition-free​

It's nowhere near what you thought it'd cost. It's very doable and very easy to afford.

 

[cpwill]

But will they be satisfied with not getting anything done.

Oh, I think we'll still get things done. This administration demonstrates that. We just won't get it done through open democratic, deliberative processes. The next Republican President isn't going to put down The Pen And The Phone just because he lambasted Obama for it.

We're going to try to force our Constitutional Republic, with Separation of Powers, to function as a Parliament, with POTUS as Prime Minister.

Oh well. History is full of Executives seizing an ever-expanding range of authority, with popular support, against unpopular Legislative bodies widely perceived as being corrupt, and everything Just Turning Out Swimmingly. Literally No Time Has That Ever Gone Horribly Horribly Badly.

 

[cpwill]

Numbers aren't your strong suit huh?

Bernie Sanders issues bill to make 4-year colleges tuition-free​

He was probably referring to the $18 Trillion price tag on all of Bernie's proposals combined.

 

[poweRob]

He was probably referring to the $18 Trillion price tag on all of Bernie's proposals combined.

Which remarkably is $5 trillion less than the price tag we are paying now without his plans.