Concealed Carry Question

[AngryOldGuy]

thing is I can't really hit nuthin' past 25 yards with my P-226

 

[Lutherf]

Truth is if I ever have ta get in a fire fight I'm gonna wanna have my AR-15 and them five (evil) 30 round magazines.
Only cuz a Mk 19 Grenade Launcher won't fit in the glove box ?

Well....with a little duct tape, a pair of vice grips and a really big glove box anything is possible:lol:

 

[LaMidRighter]

My EDC is a compact .40 I carry in a pocket holster in my R-front pocket. Lot of pros I hang with give me a ration of **** about that, until they see me draw at least. I'm not Bob Munden but I'm not trying to be.

Rule One: have a gun. I've had guys that like to come off as bad-ass give me hell and tell me anything less than a 1911 with a 5" barrel in a strong-side belt holster is a waste.... but THEN I'll catch them out somewhere and ask "you packin'?" and they stutter and go "Uh, no, it's locked in my glovebox..." :lamo

It ain't doing you any good in there, Tex. Rule One is HAVE a gun. A three-eighty in hand is better than a 1911 you left at home because it is a steel brick and a bitch to conceal.

I've never understood the "caliber snob" mentality. There are calibers I don't personally trust, but if someone else is more comfortable with them for various reasons(recoil, concealment, weight, capacity,etc.) it's like you said, better to HAVE a gun when you need it. I own a .40 and it's got plenty of pop to get the job done, I'm looking into compact .45 for a conceal weapon but everything has a tradeoff, and big cal. compacts definitely have a wicked kick.

 

[Goshin]

I've never understood the "caliber snob" mentality. There are calibers I don't personally trust, but if someone else is more comfortable with them for various reasons(recoil, concealment, weight, capacity,etc.) it's like you said, better to HAVE a gun when you need it. I own a .40 and it's got plenty of pop to get the job done, I'm looking into compact .45 for a conceal weapon but everything has a tradeoff, and big cal. compacts definitely have a wicked kick.

Yup, well I will grant one exception: the .25 acp is a round I will turn my nose up at. It is incredibly anemic, I'd rather pack a 22 rimfire.

 

[TurtleDude]

My EDC is a compact .40 I carry in a pocket holster in my R-front pocket. Lot of pros I hang with give me a ration of **** about that, until they see me draw at least. I'm not Bob Munden but I'm not trying to be.

Rule One: have a gun. I've had guys that like to come off as bad-ass give me hell and tell me anything less than a 1911 with a 5" barrel in a strong-side belt holster is a waste.... but THEN I'll catch them out somewhere and ask "you packin'?" and they stutter and go "Uh, no, it's locked in my glovebox..." :lamo

It ain't doing you any good in there, Tex. Rule One is HAVE a gun. A three-eighty in hand is better than a 1911 you left at home because it is a steel brick and a bitch to conceal.

Many years ago-Soldier of Fortune (magazine) convention and three gun combat shoot. Lots of big name IPSC hose masters. Lots of wannabes. A bunch of the latter type were standing around. The late great Jimmy Cirillo was out for a jog. Shorts, t-shirt and some funky looking wrist bands. One of the tough guys ask Cirillo what his back up was. 22 short beretta he said. tough guy sorts of pushes JC and laughs

WTF can you do with a fairy gun like that? Cirillo had it under his wrist band-sticks it up against tough guy's sunglasses and laughs-

shoot you 4 times in your eyeball tough guy.


Jim Cirillo's Tales Of The Stakeout Squad: Paul Kirchner: 9781581606492: Amazon.com: Books

 

[Goshin]

Many years ago-Soldier of Fortune (magazine) convention and three gun combat shoot. Lots of big name IPSC hose masters. Lots of wannabes. A bunch of the latter type were standing around. The late great Jimmy Cirillo was out for a jog. Shorts, t-shirt and some funky looking wrist bands. One of the tough guys ask Cirillo what his back up was. 22 short beretta he said. tough guy sorts of pushes JC and laughs

WTF can you do with a fairy gun like that? Cirillo had it under his wrist band-sticks it up against tough guy's sunglasses and laughs-

shoot you 4 times in your eyeball tough guy.


Jim Cirillo's Tales Of The Stakeout Squad: Paul Kirchner: 9781581606492: Amazon.com: Books

Anybody that would provoke Jim Cirillo is several bricks shy of a full load. Also, his elevator doesn't go all the way to the top; he ain't got both oars in the water; his axe is almost sharp enough to cut white pine; he's missing some cards from his deck but still has both Jokers.

in other words dumb-**** move...

 

[TurtleDude]

Anybody that would provoke Jim Cirillo is several bricks shy of a full load. Also, his elevator doesn't go all the way to the top; he ain't got both oars in the water; his axe is almost sharp enough to cut white pine; he's missing some cards from his deck but still has both Jokers.

in other words dumb-**** move...

One of the guys I used to travel to matches was there working for one of the displays-Spyderco IIRC. He also was one of the range masters. It was funny. A beretta in the hand beats a cannon in the dude's car

 

[blackjack50]

99% of the holsters we dudes wear won't work for old mags. She ain't gonna have the hip structure we got. Check any article on women's holsters. She gonna have to buy a ladies holster and consider her clothing choices...women's clothing is a lot tighter than us dudes in certain areas...and it served different functions.

 

[LaMidRighter]

Yup, well I will grant one exception: the .25 acp is a round I will turn my nose up at. It is incredibly anemic, I'd rather pack a 22 rimfire.

I've shot the .25, not a great round and definitely one of the ones on my "not comfortable list". It will do in a pinch if that's all you've got, but it is a real turd of a round IMO, that and it can be hard to find at times, most odd rounds TBH.

 

[TurtleDude]

I've shot the .25, not a great round and definitely one of the ones on my "not comfortable list". It will do in a pinch if that's all you've got, but it is a real turd of a round IMO, that and it can be hard to find at times, most odd rounds TBH.

the main argument for the 25 over the 22 is that centerfire rounds are more reliable than rim fires.

 

[LaMidRighter]

the main argument for the 25 over the 22 is that centerfire rounds are more reliable than rim fires.

Yeah, but realistically anything can fail, and when it really counts that .25 is a turd whether you account for firing mechanism or not. I'm with Goshin, I'd rather get stuck with a rimfire .22 than a .25, at least I have the chance of a lucky bounce in the chest cavity creating a situation where the assailant has to stop. With that .25 I might as well dip it in ink and tattoo the guy with it.

 

[Goshin]

the main argument for the 25 over the 22 is that centerfire rounds are more reliable than rim fires.

Centerfire more reliable, absolutely. Misfires are a major annoyance in shooting 22s at targets... in a real-life shootout a misfire can be the end of you, if your tap-rack-slap is too slow or fails.


But the .25... damn that round is anemic. Seen them literally fail to penetrate on a guy wearing blue jeans, didn't even draw blood.

 

[CRUE CAB]

Well....with a little duct tape, a pair of vice grips and a really big glove box anything is possible:lol:

And a sawzall if things really get tricky.

 

[CRUE CAB]

Well said. So far, every time I've needed my pistol, I saw trouble coming far enough ahead that I already had my hand on the grips before anything went down.

If you need to 'fast draw', you usually failed to notice something important several seconds earlier.

Situ aware is a great thing to practice and keep at the front of your mind on a daily basis. Dont look like a vic and you wont be one.
But preparedness needs to go farther and for that "worse case scenario" of things you least expect.

 

[CRUE CAB]

the main argument for the 25 over the 22 is that centerfire rounds are more reliable than rim fires.

Not today. Most .25s made now a days are junk. Plus the .22 has a much higher muzzle velocity.

 

[AngryOldGuy]

The twenty two long rifle is a much maligned round. I'd think that most of us have fired that round more than any other?
I know I've shot off tens of thousands of em. You've got to admit it is dead on accurate at the ranges it is suited too
and heh our military has bean shootin' 22's as it's primary battle rifle for decades. (I know 5.56mm NATO isn't .22 LR but you get my drift).

The .22 LR is in a class of its own.

 

[Jerry]

Why are big city people so scared of guns?

 

[LaMidRighter]

The twenty two long rifle is a much maligned round. I'd think that most of us have fired that round more than any other?
I know I've shot off tens of thousands of em. You've got to admit it is dead on accurate at the ranges it is suited too
and heh our military has bean shootin' 22's as it's primary battle rifle for decades. (I know 5.56mm NATO isn't .22 LR but you get my drift).

The .22 LR is in a class of its own.

.22lr has that odd ballistics characteristic of low mass to velocity. It's not a powerful round, nor is it spectacularly heavy round but it has so little mass for it's relatively fast speed that the bullet path upon contact is unpredictable. You can hit a guy in the ribcage and pull the bullet out of his knees. That kind of bounce causes so much internal injury that the poor bastard will bleed to death before dying of excessive organ damage. Chances are that they'll still be conscious to feel it to.

 

[CRUE CAB]

Why are big city people so scared of guns?

Their mayors told them to be.

 

[Goshin]

.22lr has that odd ballistics characteristic of low mass to velocity. It's not a powerful round, nor is it spectacularly heavy round but it has so little mass for it's relatively fast speed that the bullet path upon contact is unpredictable. You can hit a guy in the ribcage and pull the bullet out of his knees. That kind of bounce causes so much internal injury that the poor bastard will bleed to death before dying of excessive organ damage. Chances are that they'll still be conscious to feel it to.

IF it penetrates to the inner body cavity... my research indicates this happens about 1 time in 4.

Doctors hate trying to treat 22lr wounds that do penetrate to the inner organs, because of the wound path is difficult to determine, and making sure you plugged all the holes in all the organs and arteries is tricky.

 

[Lutherf]

.22lr has that odd ballistics characteristic of low mass to velocity. It's not a powerful round, nor is it spectacularly heavy round but it has so little mass for it's relatively fast speed that the bullet path upon contact is unpredictable. You can hit a guy in the ribcage and pull the bullet out of his knees. That kind of bounce causes so much internal injury that the poor bastard will bleed to death before dying of excessive organ damage. Chances are that they'll still be conscious to feel it to.

Better than that, LRN rounds end up so busted up that tracing them is next to impossible and subsonic rounds through a halfway decent can don't make any more noise than the action produces.

 

[LaMidRighter]

IF it penetrates to the inner body cavity... my research indicates this happens about 1 time in 4.

Doctors hate trying to treat 22lr wounds that do penetrate to the inner organs, because of the wound path is difficult to determine, and making sure you plugged all the holes in all the organs and arteries is tricky.

Absolutely, I've read up more than once on trauma professionals having a tough time with just that. Usually it's going to penetrate a soft area to begin with, then with no mass to stop it from the projectile you just hope it doesn't hit something like bone in the body.

 

[LaMidRighter]

Better than that, LRN rounds end up so busted up that tracing them is next to impossible and subsonic rounds through a halfway decent can don't make any more noise than the action produces.

Soft, heavy metals don't make for a pretty wound pattern that's for sure. Subsonics, man, I didn't even think you could find that stuff easily anymore, even the small stuff seems to be all supersonic now, I've even heard that the high end stuff has shown hypersonic speeds.

 

[Lutherf]

Soft, heavy metals don't make for a pretty wound pattern that's for sure. Subsonics, man, I didn't even think you could find that stuff easily anymore, even the small stuff seems to be all supersonic now, I've even heard that the high end stuff has shown hypersonic speeds.

Well, you can't find ANY .22lr now so it doesn't really matter.

My bad...it seems that Bass Pro even has some in stock! - Winchester® Super-X Subsonic .22LR Rimfire Ammo - Hollow Point | Bass Pro Shops

 

[LaMidRighter]

Well, you can't find ANY .22lr now so it doesn't really matter.

My bad...it seems that Bass Pro even has some in stock! - Winchester® Super-X Subsonic .22LR Rimfire Ammo - Hollow Point | Bass Pro Shops

I tend to see a bit of it around here. We have a lot of plinkers and squirrel hunters that use that over the "varmint' rounds so that's actually a bit easier to find in my city than some of the big game stuff. Here .338 Lapua is a BITCH to find(I don't need it now but looking into buying that configuration), and some of the Weatherby configurations are tough as well.