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Breaking: Israel launches 'preemptive strike' against Iran, declares state of emergency

Logophile said:
Russia has a vested interest in BRICS, and will defend it. Iran is a member:

BRICS currently consists of ten member countries: Brazil, Russia, India, China, South Africa, Egypt, Ethiopia, Iran, Indonesia, and the United Arab Emirates.

Should Trump escalate, it will pit Russia, India and China - three major powers - against the US - and will endanger US relations with the rest of BRICS, some of which are already shaky. Nobody likes a bully. Egypt's cooperation with us is paramount in the region, and risking it is irrational
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BRICS is not a military bloc, just an economic grouping. Furthermore, Iran is not even a founding member with founder privileges
 
Logophile said:
Israeli strikes have hit several nuclear and military sites, killing top generals and nuclear scientists. A Washington-based Iranian human rights group said at least 585 people, including 239 civilians, have been killed and more than 1,300 wounded.

Iran has fired some 400 missiles and hundreds of drones in retaliatory strikes that have killed at least 24 people in Israel and wounded hundreds. Some have hit apartment buildings in central Israel, causing heavy damage, and air raid sirens have repeatedly forced Israelis to run for shelter.

Iran has fired fewer missiles as the conflict has worn on. It has not explained the decline, but Israel has targeted launchers and other infrastructure related to the missiles.

Casualties mount in Iran
www.wsbtv.com

Iran's leader rejects call to surrender, saying US intervention would cause 'irreparable damage'

Iran’s supreme leader has rejected U.S. calls for surrender in the face of blistering Israeli strikes and warned that any military involvement by the Americans would cause “irreparable damage” to them
www.wsbtv.com www.wsbtv.com

If Trump supports this conduct and escalates/facilitates more international murder, he has to be impeached by his party and replaced. It's a moral responsibility if he escalates
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The moral responsibility appears to be to stop Iran, the theocratic regime that is the no.1 sponsor of terrorism in the world, from gaining nuclear weapons.
 
sanman said:
BRICS is not a military bloc, just an economic grouping. Furthermore, Iran is not even a founding member with founder privileges
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Apocalypse said:
The moral responsibility appears to be to stop Iran, the theocratic regime that is the no.1 sponsor of terrorism in the world, from gaining nuclear weapons.
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There is no moral justification at all for bombing Iran. Zero. There is no evidence at all that nuclear bombs were in the making or believe me, it would be all over mainstream press. It's not there because there's no evidence to tout. And everybody knows that BRICS is an economic group predicated mostly on oil. That's a fundamental. Thank you for pointing out the obvious. But nations are very leery of indiscriminate bombing of other nations with which they have a common interest. None of these nations have to "go to war" - aka the lowest of IQ problem solving which is rarely successful - to put a great deal of pressure on Israel and the US. Personally, I want a president that represents the US, not whose first loyalty is a rogue nation. It's the fundamental reason why I detested Biden and all his disgusting baby bombing. And if Trump is doing that, he is no longer a viable US representative, never mind viable American president
 
Logophile said:
There is no moral justification at all for bombing Iran. Zero. There is no evidence at all that nuclear bombs were in the making or believe me, it would be all over mainstream press. It's not there because there's no evidence to tout. And everybody knows that BRICS is an economic group predicated mostly on oil. That's a fundamental. Thank you for pointing out the obvious. But nations are very leery of indiscriminate bombing of other nations with which they have a common interest. None of these nations have to "go to war" - aka the lowest of IQ problem solving which is rarely successful - to put a great deal of pressure on Israel and the US. Personally, I want a president that represents the US, not whose first loyalty is a rogue nation. It's the fundamental reason why I detested Biden and all his disgusting baby bombing. And if Trump is doing that, he is no longer a viable US representative, never mind viable American president
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Iran has been murdering innocents all across the globe for the past several decades through its terrorist proxies and it's the same theocratic regime that did it that refuses to let go of its nuclear aspirations, there is every justification.
 
Apocalypse said:
The moral responsibility appears to be to stop Iran, the theocratic regime that is the no.1 sponsor of terrorism in the world, from gaining nuclear weapons.
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Israel talking about “morality” when it proudly backed apartheid South Africa and has murdered tens of thousands of innocent civilians over the last two years is hilarious.
 
IAF destroys Iran attack helicopters, Emad missile launchers.

Approximately 25 fighter jets struck over 40 missile infrastructure components, including missile storage sites and military operatives of the Iranian regime

www.jpost.com

IDF strikes destroy Iran air force attack helicopters, missile launchers | The Jerusalem Post

Approximately 25 fighter jets struck over 40 missile infrastructure components, including missile storage sites and military operatives of the Iranian regime.
www.jpost.com www.jpost.com
 
Tigerace117 said:
Israel has killed tens of thousands of innocent civilians over the last two years.....which makes your posturing rather laughable.
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So Israel doing wrong absolves all the other sins in the world? Basically Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran killing civilians on purpose is okay and especially targeting them is okay because Israel also killed civilians. Heck who cares that Iran sponsors literal terrorists and then terrorists run several places and oppress people and kill them to maintain their power. But yeah, Israel killed Civilians so it is all right?

Heck, by this logic Hitler and Stalin are also okay because Britain, US, France killed civilians.

What about the Unabomber or Columbine school shooters? Are they also absolved of their sins because US killed civilians?
 
JohnRawls said:
So Israel doing wrong absolves all the other sins in the world? Basically Hamas, Hezbollah, Iran killing civilians on purpose is okay and especially targeting them is okay because Israel also killed civilians. Heck who cares that Iran sponsors literal terrorists and then terrorists run several places and oppress people and kill them to maintain their power. But yeah, Israel killed Civilians so it is all right?

Heck, by this logic Hitler and Stalin are also okay because Britain, US, France killed civilians.

What about the Unabomber or Columbine school shooters? Are they also absolved of their sins because US killed civilians?
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The United States sponsors “literal terrorists” and has for decades. Does that mean American civilians should be subjected to indiscriminate bombing attacks?

Israel has killed more innocent civilians since October 7th than Hamas and Hezbollah have in their entire existence….combined.

The only reason the current government of Iran is in power is because the U.S. destroyed Iran’s democracy for the “crime” of wanting to control their own oil.
 
Tigerace117 said:
The United States sponsors “literal terrorists” and has for decades. Does that mean American civilians should be subjected to indiscriminate bombing attacks?

Israel has killed more innocent civilians since October 7th than Hamas and Hezbollah have in their entire existence….combined.

The only reason the current government of Iran is in power is because the U.S. destroyed Iran’s democracy for the “crime” of wanting to control their own oil.
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Cool, US sponsoring terrorists and killing civilians absolves everyone else for doing much, much, much worse things?

You know what, you have no common sense at all. I don't know what or why or for what reason brainwashed you. There is no equivalence here. It is time to stop pretending that running dictatorships and killing your own civilians on purpose on mass or mass terror from Hezbollah or Hamas or Iran is anywhere close to what Israel is doing or did.

Yes US killed civilians, Yes Israel killed civilians, Yes US/Israel sponsored terrorist and made deals with guys we might not like but lets not pretend here or try to say that somehow Israel or US is worse or not justified to do all that. Iran literally sponsors several state level proxies to fight Israel while its main doctrine is basically destruction of Israel. Hamas and Hezbollah openly want to kill all the jews in Israel and its impossible to hide. The named entities basically outright kill their opponents to maintain power, fully supress their opposition and kill civilians on a whim if they feel even a threat of disloyalty. They have no free speech, they have no rule of law, they have no prosperity or technology of any sort, they have nothing. They are not interested in even improving the lives of their own people or giving them a happy or a prosperous life.

So saying US BAD, ISRAEL BAD doesn't change anything. Sure, whatever. There is no reason why we should support Iran, Hezbollah and Hamas or try to defend them by saying Israel BAD. The only reason I see here is because somebody is brainwashed or outright under influence of very stupid and deranged ideas.

Having said that, it doesn't mean things can't change. They certainly can. If Palestinians or Hezbollah or Iran were actually, you know, proper structures that were humane then they would have a leg to stand on in this regard because Israel does do bad things. The problem is that Israel doesn't even do 1/10th of what the other 3 do. And US doesn't do even 1/100th of bad things that Iran or China or Russia does. The naivety of Americans sometimes amazes me.
 
Apocalypse said:
Iran has been murdering innocents all across the globe for the past several decades through its terrorist proxies and it's the same theocratic regime that did it that refuses to let go of its nuclear aspirations, there is every justification.
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Israel has been murdering all kinds of people. None of it is justified. Immature leadership and violent trade offs are no solution. Do you want a peaceful world or don't you?? By supporting a rogue nation's lawlessness and viciousness, we are supporting humanity's demise. We have 8.2 billion homo sapiens on the planet with the ability to eradicate them all. We have to stop the adolescent "mine's bigger than yours" crap and act like adults. In a nuclear age, to leave others with nothing left to lose is suicide for all on an overpopulated planet
 
Big announcement anytime time now from Trump.

Ya lol

Like so many other propaganda stunts Trump keeps pulling the MAGA chain.
 
Logophile said:
Israel has been murdering all kinds of people. None of it is justified. Immature leadership and violent trade offs are no solution. Do you want a peaceful world or don't you?? By supporting a rogue nation's lawlessness and viciousness, we are supporting humanity's demise. We have 8.2 billion homo sapiens on the planet with the ability to eradicate them all. We have to stop the adolescent "mine's bigger than yours" crap and act like adults. In a nuclear age, to leave others with nothing left to lose is suicide for all on an overpopulated planet
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It is entirely justified and necessary to defend against an aggressor that refuses to have peace and is dedicated to the destruction of others. Iran is an aggressor that refuses to have peace and threatens others with destruction. They are opposed because of it. It's justified.
 
Apocalypse said:
It is entirely justified and necessary to defend against an aggressor that refuses to have peace and is dedicated to the destruction of others. Iran is an aggressor that refuses to have peace and threatens others with destruction. They are opposed because of it. It's justified.
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I think that's mostly manufactured/hyperbolic nonsense to justify the immoral agenda of creating a failed state with the indiscriminate slaughter of others. Murder is murder
 
JohnRawls said:
Cool, US sponsoring terrorists and killing civilians absolves everyone else for doing much, much, much worse things?

You know what, you have no common sense at all. I don't know what or why or for what reason brainwashed you. There is no equivalence here. It is time to stop pretending that running dictatorships and killing your own civilians on purpose on mass or mass terror from Hezbollah or Hamas or Iran is anywhere close to what Israel is doing or did.

Yes US killed civilians, Yes Israel killed civilians, Yes US/Israel sponsored terrorist and made deals with guys we might not like but lets not pretend here or try to say that somehow Israel or US is worse or not justified to do all that. Iran literally sponsors several state level proxies to fight Israel while its main doctrine is basically destruction of Israel. Hamas and Hezbollah openly want to kill all the jews in Israel and its impossible to hide. The named entities basically outright kill their opponents to maintain power, fully supress their opposition and kill civilians on a whim if they feel even a threat of disloyalty. They have no free speech, they have no rule of law, they have no prosperity or technology of any sort, they have nothing. They are not interested in even improving the lives of their own people or giving them a happy or a prosperous life.

So saying US BAD, ISRAEL BAD doesn't change anything. Sure, whatever. There is no reason why we should support Iran, Hezbollah and Hamas or try to defend them by saying Israel BAD. The only reason I see here is because somebody is brainwashed or outright under influence of very stupid and deranged ideas.

Having said that, it doesn't mean things can't change. They certainly can. If Palestinians or Hezbollah or Iran were actually, you know, proper structures that were humane then they would have a leg to stand on in this regard because Israel does do bad things. The problem is that Israel doesn't even do 1/10th of what the other 3 do. And US doesn't do even 1/100th of bad things that Iran or China or Russia does. The naivety of Americans sometimes amazes me.
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Uh.....I hate to break it to you but the US’ actions are not, in fact “not as bad”.

I get that your country honors Nazi collaborators and SS scum as national heroes and all, and that clearly skews what you see as acceptable behavior on a national level, but that doesn’t change the fact that mass murdering tens of thousands of Palestinian civilians to steal their land is textbook “mass terror”.

Explain, in detail, how the US and or Israel sponsoring terrorists and mass murdering civilians could ever be seen as “justified”.

Kind of hard for civilians to have a “happy and prosperous life” when Israel is murdering them en masse in order to steal their land.

Except your claims are blatantly false, as the body count shows quite clearly.
 
Logophile said:
I think that's mostly manufactured/hyperbolic nonsense to justify the immoral agenda of creating a failed state with the indiscriminate slaughter of others. Murder is murder
Click to expand...
Indeed murder is murder and killing in self defense is not murder. Civilians will always die in wars and that is tragic and the reason for the war is on the aggressor not on the side defending its citizens. The harsh reality is that there are bad people who want to do harm to innocent people and you can't not defend against them and roll over and die.
 
Logophile said:
There is no moral justification at all for bombing Iran. Zero. There is no evidence at all that nuclear bombs were in the making or believe me, it would be all over mainstream press. It's not there because there's no evidence to tout. And everybody knows that BRICS is an economic group predicated mostly on oil. That's a fundamental. Thank you for pointing out the obvious. But nations are very leery of indiscriminate bombing of other nations with which they have a common interest. None of these nations have to "go to war" - aka the lowest of IQ problem solving which is rarely successful - to put a great deal of pressure on Israel and the US. Personally, I want a president that represents the US, not whose first loyalty is a rogue nation. It's the fundamental reason why I detested Biden and all his disgusting baby bombing. And if Trump is doing that, he is no longer a viable US representative, never mind viable American president
Click to expand...

I think Trump is going this route because of multiple reasons. Chiefly, his whole trade war with China has fallen apart, due to China's reciprocal tariffs and especially its playing of its powerful Rare Earths card. China's cutting off access to Rare Earths materials essential for sustaining America's tech industries has forced Trump to completely back down, under a barrage of TACO taunts from the peanut gallery.
So he's got to run for cover, and find something new to fill the headlines. Bessant is likewise running out of steam.

Nextly, Trump may be hungrily eyeing Iran's oil wealth, the same way he's been eyeing Greenland, Canada, Ukraine, etc.
He'd like those natural resources to be in his hands.

Finally, Trump got major donations from Mrs Adelson and others in the Israel lobby. He doesn't want to lose that sin money, and sees quid pro quo with them as a reliable benefit for himself.

So Trump may feel that a regime change in Iran would be a way to kill multiple birds with one stone, gaining multiple wins for himself in one swoop.

Whether or not the govt in Tehran and their backers would cooperate may be a different matter, however.
 
Apocalypse said:
Indeed murder is murder and killing in self defense is not murder. Civilians will always die in wars and that is tragic and the reason for the war is on the aggressor not on the side defending its citizens. The harsh reality is that there are bad people who want to do harm to innocent people and you can't not defend against them and roll over and die.
Click to expand...
I'm afraid you've bought into a lot of propaganda
 
Apocalypse said:
Iran has been murdering innocents all across the globe for the past several decades through its terrorist proxies and it's the same theocratic regime that did it that refuses to let go of its nuclear aspirations, there is every justification.
Click to expand...
In all fairness, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia have been doing the same for decades as well, one of them actually developed nuclear weapons and even proliferated the technology to North Korea, and their reward was that we sold them more weapons!
 
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