Boo Radley
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iWere you not judging others when you said:
Because if you were not I'd like you to explain how it is that you can make such a blanket generalization about others and skirt your own fail on this.
i
In the sense that I mentioned, what it means to be Christian. To be a thing, you must follow the teachings of it, the essence. It that context, my judgement is reasonable.
yet still condemned by the teachings of Luke.
Doesn't the faith also teach that you don't have the power to judge? I think it does.
"Judge not, and ye shall not be judged: condemn not, and ye shall not be condemned: forgive, and ye shall be forgiven:"
-Luke 6:37
Not at all. That final judgement is in God's hands. Being in God's image, we are not sheep unable to make no judgements at all. It requires a judgement to even choose to be Christian. In the context I laid out, again, it is a reasonable judgement.
Faith doesn't teach that, dogma does.
Are you now a theologian? You can do what you wish because we have free will, but in context you will be judged yourself.
Of course I will be. We all will be, and are daily. But I have little to fear from reasonable judgements like the ones I made. It is in keeping with the teachings.
Well, I disagree. But if you're happy with it, then it is what it is....Merry Christmas Joe, and Merry Christmas to all.
Faith does indeed teach that. Tell me a Christian faith that does not teach that...
I should have included theology, or some form of written word. That is what I meant. Rules and written words teach that.
Faith is an act of the individual, and not some written words, was my point.
I don't really care if torture is effective. It's evil. And we are evil if we employ it. If we become evil to fight evil, then we have lost. Sacrificing the things that make us different from our enemy destroys us even more effectively than any weapons they could ever use against us. In the last decade, we have become more like the people Al Qaeda and their ilk want us to be. That's a victory for them, not for us, no matter how many of them we kill.
Of course I will be. We all will be, and are daily. But I have little to fear from reasonable judgements like the ones I made. It is in keeping with the teachings.
Huh, I've always been hesitant to make judgments about whether others are truly "Christian" or not or have a real relationship with God or not. I've always figured that was between them and God, but you're saying I have no need for such hesitancy. I can determine, as you have, who is really a Christian and who isn't?
True enough, but we should do well to remember that all are humbled in the presence of God, it is our own hubris, and inflated ego that leads us to believe that we can dictate the terms of what faith lays out for us to follow and aspire to. Each of us will answer to that in our own time.
Huh, I've always been hesitant to make judgments about whether others are truly "Christian" or not or have a real relationship with God or not. I've always figured that was between them and God, but you're saying I have no need for such hesitancy. I can determine, as you have, who is really a Christian and who isn't?
I think there are certain precepts you must adhere to, by definition, to actually be any specific thing. A homosexual who can't stare sex with the same sex, for example, is not homosexual. So while I actually agree with what you write above, Christians are actually called to live by some precepts. Torture cannot be found in the ideology anywhere. By definition, one who supports torture is not following Christian ideology, thus not Christian. Yes, we will have to personally answer to God, who makes the final judgement, the one that matters, we are not incapable of reasoned thought r reasonable judgements.
I thought a homosexual was a homosexual regardless of their actions. You're confusing me. On one hand, you're saying you agree with me but on the other, you tell me you're quite comfortable making that very judgment. I trust that these judgements can also be fairly made in other discussions outside of this one? Right? I ask because I see Christians criticized for saying things like the Westborrow Baptist folks aren't really Christians. Can I send those critics your way?
Christians are actually called to live by some precepts. Torture cannot be found in the ideology anywhere. By definition, one who supports torture is not following Christian ideology, thus not Christian.
Do you have the passage handy where Jesus referred to 'torture'?
I wasn't actually speaking about actions. If I like the opposite sex and don't desire someone f the same same sex, I'm not a homosexual no matter what I say.
And yes, I agree faith is personal. But, ideologies of all kinds have clear definitions of what makes one a follower of that ideology. If we cannot make that judgement, how do we know when we are one?
Big difference between making that judgment for yourself and making it for others.
Do you?
It was you who made the claim that "By definition, one who supports torture is not following Christian ideology, thus not Christian".
By whose definition?
Yet you also said "Torture cannot be found in the ideology anywhere".
Do you actually have a clue as to what you are talking about or is this another instance of the infinite monkey theorem?
Torture is assault upon the individual, over a period of time. A most unconsensual situation.
Certainly society can invoke due process to detain somebody temporarily, but the due process must be strict and open.
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