Are there more uneducated voters on the left or on the right?

[Xelor]

Re: Wide Gender Gap, Growing Educational Divide in Voters’ Party Identification

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. As of 2016 the Republican party was dead and would never be heard from again due to changing demographics. There has already been stories recently showing that millenials can't be counted on as much as previously thought to support Democrats in the midterms.

Well, now isn't that typical of conservatives and illustrative of exactly the point under discussion? I do hope conservatives have something more credible on which to rely than just stories.

For Democrats to prevail quite nicely, millennials need not deliver as many votes as previously thought; they need only deliver more than they previously have. (BTW, "previously" when?)

 

[SmartCat]

Re: Wide Gender Gap, Growing Educational Divide in Voters’ Party Identification

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. As of 2016 the Republican party was dead and would never be heard from again due to changing demographics. There has already been stories recently showing that millenials can't be counted on as much as previously thought to support Democrats in the midterms.

I never heard in 2016 that the Republican Party was "dead."

Nevertheless, there are more registered Democrats than registered Republicans. More independents lean Democrat than the number of independents who lean Republican.

The Republican Party retains its dominance because of gerrymandering and because the Electoral College and the Senate benefit rural states at the expense of urban states.

A growing percentage of Americans prefer socialism to capitalism. More Americans voted for Hillary than Trump. Polls indicated that Bernie Sanders would have had an even higher vote margin if he had run against Trump.

 

[Xelor]

Re: Wide Gender Gap, Growing Educational Divide in Voters’ Party Identification

I never heard in 2016 that the Republican Party was "dead."

Nevertheless, there are more registered Democrats than registered Republicans. More independents lean Democrat than the number of independents who lean Republican.

The Republican Party retains its dominance because of gerrymandering and because the Electoral College and the Senate benefit rural states at the expense of urban states.

A growing percentage of Americans prefer socialism to capitalism. More Americans voted for Hillary than Trump. Polls indicated that Bernie Sanders would have had an even higher vote margin if he had run against Trump.

What? Can you quantify and qualify that remark?

• By whose reckoning do a "growing percentage of Americans prefer socialism to capitalism?"
• What are are the temporal and quantitative endpoints that describe the noted change?
• Who exactly has advocated for the nationalization of the factors of production?
• What industries, if not all factors of production, have a "growing percentage of Americans" advocated for nationalizing?

I find that hard to believe unless it refers to Americans who comprise not a wing, but a "wingtip" or minor "vane," of the citizenry. There are some economists who've proposed healthcare be transformed to function in a variation on the natural monopoly market structure. Some have floated the notion of doing so whereby the government is the provider and payer and others have proposed a "water/electric company" model; however, AFAIK, none of them have proposed the prohibition of private sector healthcare providers, payers or insurers, which would be necessary for healthcare to be socialized.

 

[holbritter]

Another anti-intellectual. True, you can’t get common sense from a degree. However, a college education does provide you with a wealth of knowledge, experience, and exposure to help you understand the complexities of a changing, dynamic world. On the other hand, those who choose to live their entire lives in the town where they were born and raised, where 90% or more of their neighbors think, believe, and look just like them, are resigned to isolating themselves in a cultural bubble.[/QUOTE]

Maybe they like their small town and want to stay near family. 'Resigned' is the wrong interpretation.

 

[spud_meister]

HAHAHA!! Umm...no.

Haha, yes? The guy was a nationally recognised poet, a gifted painter, and a top student when he was at school and not fighting other students. He also taught and worked as a meteorologist.

 

[Moderate Right]

Re: Wide Gender Gap, Growing Educational Divide in Voters’ Party Identification

I never heard in 2016 that the Republican Party was "dead."

Nevertheless, there are more registered Democrats than registered Republicans. More independents lean Democrat than the number of independents who lean Republican.

The Republican Party retains its dominance because of gerrymandering and because the Electoral College and the Senate benefit rural states at the expense of urban states.

A growing percentage of Americans prefer socialism to capitalism. More Americans voted for Hillary than Trump. Polls indicated that Bernie Sanders would have had an even higher vote margin if he had run against Trump.

There are thousands of posts here on DP back in 2016 declaring the Republican party dead forever. Obama was president, Hillary was already sipping champaigne and picking out curtains, with white's turning into a minority in democraphics, all topped off with Trump winning the nomination. The Republican party was in shambles and a ***** grabber was the head of their party. The left were falling all over themselves totally drunk in laughter. Now we're hearing the very same thing all over again.

 

[tres borrachos]

I don't know what in the hell you are talking about. I was asked by another poster why any 99%'r would vote for a Republican and I gave the poster some reasons. That's all there is to it. Nothing to analyze.

You didn't say anything about "God"? Did you forget what you posted?

 

[SmartCat]

Socialism’s Rising Popularity

What? Can you quantify and qualify that remark?

By whose reckoning do a "growing percentage of Americans prefer socialism to capitalism?"

National Review, March 18, 2017

The American Culture and Faith Institute recently conducted a survey of adults 18 and older...

four out of every ten adults say they prefer socialism to capitalism,” the ACFI noted in its commentary on the poll. “That is a large minority,” Barna said, “and it includes a majority of the liberals...

The popularity of Bernie Sanders, whose 2016 presidential campaign was marked by an altruistic spirit and a consistent value system, is of course not the cause of this movement in public opinion but rather an indicator of it.
https://www.nationalreview.com/2017...te-george-barna-tradition-liberty-capitalism/

---------

The Washington Post, April 26, 2016

In an apparent rejection of the basic principles of the U.S. economy, a new poll shows that most young people do not support capitalism.

The Harvard University survey, which polled young adults between ages 18 and 29, found that 51 percent of respondents do not support capitalism. Just 42 percent said they support it...

A subsequent survey that included people of all ages found that somewhat older Americans also are skeptical of capitalism. Only among respondents at least 50 years old was the majority in support of capitalism...

John Della Volpe, the polling director at Harvard, went on to personally interview a small group of young people about their attitudes toward capitalism to try to learn more. They told him that capitalism was unfair and left people out despite their hard work.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...capitalism-poll-shows/?utm_term=.2f26c53f4990

 

[LetsGoBrandon]

Just curious. The left claim that the uneducated people voted Trump into office. I say there are more uneducated on the left than there are on the right.

The left does not want to count those in their own fold who are addicted to government assistance. The massive numbers on the welfare rolls. They also do not want to include working class Americans who did not go to ivy league universities. They are elitists.

 

[Waddy]

Quit blaming it on uneducated/low IQ voters. They don't elect candidates. And both sides have plenty of them. The people who get candidates elected are well educated ideologues who go to conventions, make big donations, and push their agenda forward. Dumb and Dumber are NOT running the political system.

 

[Fiddytree]

Quit blaming it on uneducated/low IQ voters. They don't elect candidates. And both sides have plenty of them. The people who get candidates elected are well educated ideologues who go to conventions, make big donations, and push their agenda forward. Dumb and Dumber are NOT running the political system.

Yeah, because that worked so well in the Republican Primary just a couple years ago.

Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk

 

[post]

The left does not want to count those in their own fold who are addicted to government assistance. The massive numbers on the welfare rolls. They also do not want to include working class Americans who did not go to ivy league universities. They are elitists.

Utter BS! Your politics are guaranteed to bring about serfdom in a country with a former vibrant middle class. Last year, privately held U.S. assets amounted to $94.8 trillion.
What is your actual point, do you even know?

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...0-years/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.cb1e1e5ae4ce
The richest 1 percent now owns more of the country’s wealth than at any time in the past 50 years
By Christopher Ingraham December 6, 2017
.....

America's Wealth Is Staggeringly Concentrated in the Northeast ...https://www.citylab.com/life/2013/12/staggering-concentrated-wealth.../7872/

Dec 13, 2013 - What's most startling, though, in new local income and poverty data released this week by the Census Bureau, is the way these opposing poles of poverty and wealth in America concentrate geographically.
The Census map below shows median household income data from 2012 for every county in the ...​

​

https://www.federalreserve.gov/publ...s-in-us-family-finances-from-2013-to-2016.htm

 

[Xelor]

Re: Socialism’s Rising Popularity

The Washington Post, April 26, 2016 ("A majority of millennials now reject capitalism, poll shows")

In an apparent rejection of the basic principles of the U.S. economy, a new poll shows that most young people do not support capitalism.

The Harvard University survey, which polled young adults between ages 18 and 29, found that 51 percent of respondents do not support capitalism. Just 42 percent said they support it...

A subsequent survey that included people of all ages found that somewhat older Americans also are skeptical of capitalism. Only among respondents at least 50 years old was the majority in support of capitalism...

TY for the reply to my request. For reference, your assertion that catalyzed my incredulousness:

A growing percentage of Americans prefer socialism to capitalism.

[Time constraints (and perhaps space ones, knowing DP's 5K character limit) force me to address it parts...sorry for that.]



Let's look at the actual results of the April 25, 2016 poll rather than WaPo's distillation of it.

Majority of 18- to 29-Year-Olds Reject Both Socialism and Capitalism.
When 18- to 29-year-old young Americans were asked whether or not they support socialism, capitalism, and other political theories and labels, a majority reject both socialism and capitalism.​

• 
  [*=1]Socialism is supported by 33% of young Americans.
  [*=1]Capitalism is supported by 42% of young Americans.

(Source: Harvard IOP Spring 2016 Poll)
​

Looking at the topline report, however, one observes that:

• 51% don't support capitalism.
• 59% don't support socialism.

It doesn't take much to see that if one spits the qualitative responses between c


The WaPo article doesn't give enough info for me to suss out what be the one the reporter describes only as a "subsequent survey."

The article does, however, refer to a Pew study, "Little Change in Public’s Response to ’Capitalism,’ ’Socialism’." That study is from 2011. That study produced the following results:

​

Comparing "apples to apples" -- 18-29 year-olds preferring socialism -- between Pew's 2011 study and Harvard's 2016 one:

• 2011 --> 49%
• 2016 --> 33%

On the contrary, the percentage of 18-29 year-olds preferring socialism dropped by a third (16 points) in just five years, or an average rate of about -11% per year.

For reference, here is the objection I raised with regard to your assertion noted at the start of this post:

I find that hard to believe unless it refers to Americans who comprise not a wing, but a "wingtip" or minor "vane," of the citizenry.

I realize 18-29 year-old Americans is not as broad as "Americans;" however, I realize too that if the sentiments of that age cohort are remotely similar to those of the larger society, when I look at the other reference you citedd, I may again not find "growing percentages" of folks preferring socialism.

 

[Xelor]

Utter BS! Your politics are guaranteed to bring about serfdom in a country with a former vibrant middle class. Last year, privately held U.S. assets amounted to $94.8 trillion.
What is your actual point, do you even know?


[/FONT][/COLOR][/CENTER][/COLOR]
[/COLOR][/FONT]

https://www.federalreserve.gov/publ...s-in-us-family-finances-from-2013-to-2016.htm

I'm not sure what your point is.

• Jan. 2017 -- The world’s eight richest billionaires control the same wealth between them as the poorest half of the globe’s population -- 3.6 billion people -- according to a charity warning of an ever-increasing and dangerous concentration of wealth. (Source)
• Nov. 2017 -- The 3 Richest Americans Hold More Wealth Than Bottom 50% Of The Country, Study Finds
  
  
  

I suspect a lot of folks are outraged by the top three metrics. I, however, find the last one utterly astounding.

 

[SmartCat]

Re: Socialism’s Rising Popularity

TY for the reply to my request. For reference, your assertion that catalyzed my incredulousness:

​

[Time constraints (and perhaps space ones, knowing DP's 5K character limit) force me to address it parts...sorry for that.]



Let's look at the actual results of the April 25, 2016 poll rather than WaPo's distillation of it.

Majority of 18- to 29-Year-Olds Reject Both Socialism and Capitalism.
When 18- to 29-year-old young Americans were asked whether or not they support socialism, capitalism, and other political theories and labels, a majority reject both socialism and capitalism.​

• 
  [*=1]Socialism is supported by 33% of young Americans.
  [*=1]Capitalism is supported by 42% of young Americans.

(Source: Harvard IOP Spring 2016 Poll)
​

Looking at the topline report, however, one observes that:

• 51% don't support capitalism.
• 59% don't support socialism.

It doesn't take much to see that if one spits the qualitative responses between c


The WaPo article doesn't give enough info for me to suss out what be the one the reporter describes only as a "subsequent survey."

The article does, however, refer to a Pew study, "Little Change in Public’s Response to ’Capitalism,’ ’Socialism’." That study is from 2011. That study produced the following results:

​

Comparing "apples to apples" -- 18-29 year-olds preferring socialism -- between Pew's 2011 study and Harvard's 2016 one:

• 2011 --> 49%
• 2016 --> 33%

On the contrary, the percentage of 18-29 year-olds preferring socialism dropped by a third (16 points) in just five years, or an average rate of about -11% per year.

For reference, here is the objection I raised with regard to your assertion noted at the start of this post:

​

I realize 18-29 year-old Americans is not as broad as "Americans;" however, I realize too that if the sentiments of that age cohort are remotely similar to those of the larger society, when I look at the other reference you citedd, I may again not find "growing percentages" of folks preferring socialism.

I said "a growing percentage" of Americans prefer socialism to capitalism. I did not say "a majority do."

 

[Xelor]

Re: Socialism’s Rising Popularity

I said "a growing percentage" of Americans prefer socialism to capitalism. I did not say "a majority do."

Seriously? That's your response to what I wrote in post 138? Did you even completely read the post? Did you completely read the WaPo article you cited?

 

[Xelor]

Re: Socialism’s Rising Popularity

National Review, March 18, 2017

The American Culture and Faith Institute recently conducted a survey of adults 18 and older...

four out of every ten adults say they prefer socialism to capitalism,” the ACFI noted in its commentary on the poll.

Neither the National Review article nor the survey to which it refers supports your assertion with which I took exception. That claim is:

A growing percentage of Americans prefer socialism to capitalism.

Do you understand what is required to show that statement to be true? I don't believe you do, so I'm going to break it down for you. With regard to your claim:

• What is the temporal context? Change over time.
  • To show that anything is growing, one must show its value, minimally, at two points in time. The survey the NR article references doesn't provide the same data point at two points in time. It provides only one data point that corresponds to your assertion: "[Adults who] prefer socialism to capitalism (37%)." Because there is only one data point in that survey, one cannot use it alone to corroborate an assertion about there being a "growing percentage [who] of Americans prefer socialism to capitalism."
• What is the relevant population (qualitative scope of the statement)? Americans, not a subset of Americans.
  • Why not a subset of the population of Americans? Because you didn't qualify "Americans" by using some sort of adjective/adjectival phrase. Examples of such phrases can be found in the survey the National Review (NR) (and WaPo) article references and include "SAGE" or "Liberal" or "Conservative" just to name a few.

Having now reviewed the totality of reference information -- a NR and WaPo articles that refer to third-party surveys -- you provided in response to my challenge, I have now, between this post and post 138, shown:

• This post --> The NR article doesn't provide enough information to indicate growth.
• Post 138 (in that post I address the WaPo reference article you provided):
  • That article does not address the qualitative scope of your statement. It provides content that pertains only to 19-29 year-old Americans.
  • That article does refer to two surveys that quantify the same trait with regard to 18-29 year-old Americans. That trait is not exactly the one in your claim, but it's related.
    • The surveys quantify "preference for socialism."
    • Your claim refers to a "preference of socialism to capitalism."
    • Do you understand that and how those two preferences are not the same things?
  • In terms of 18-29 year-olds' preference for socialism and using the data from two surveys the WaPo article references, it's clear that preference is shrinking not growing.
    • In 2011, that percentage was 49%.
      In 2016, that percentage was 33%.

So what did you assert? This:

A growing percentage of Americans prefer socialism to capitalism.

You provided two references in support of that assertion and, as shown in my remarks above and in post 138, it's clear that neither reference you cited corrorates your claim.

 

[SmartCat]

Re: Socialism’s Rising Popularity

Neither the National Review article nor the survey to which it refers supports your assertion with which I took exception.


[*]This post --> The NR article doesn't provide enough information to indicate growth.

You provided two references in support of that assertion and, as shown in my remarks above and in post 138, it's clear that neither reference you cited corrorates your claim.

I will make a partial concession to you. Recent surveys, taken by different organizations, asking different questions will give different indications about the relative popularity of socialism and capitalism.

I have been cruising the internet ins search of polls taken during the 1930's, and later, about the popularity of capitalism and socialism. I have not found any. If you know of one, please post it.

The fact that polls on the subject are taken now and that they find a large minority of Americans do prefer socialism tells me that socialism is more popular than it was, let us say a generation or so ago, when polling agencies did not think the question was worth asking. The fact that polls indicate that Bernie Sanders is the most popular American politician also give indication of the growing support for socialism.

Speaking only for myself, I would like for the United States to move in a socialist direction. I do not advocate that all or most productive wealth be owned by the government. Under democratic socialism it would be, but not under social democracy.

Democratic socialism has been a popular ideal in much of the world for over a century. The fact that it exists nowhere leads me to suspect that it cannot exist, given constraints of human nature. Social democracy does exist to varying degrees in Scandinavia, Germany, the British Commonwealth, and perhaps in France. I prefer it to what exists in the United States. So does a large minority of uncertain size, but one that seems to be larger than it was even during the high point of political liberalism, which was 1964.

So again, a partial concession to your point.

 

[Moderate Right]

You didn't say anything about "God"? Did you forget what you posted?

I have no clue why you are acting like this. A poster asked why any 99%'r would vote Republican and I gave them several reasons, including God and religion.

 

[MrWonka]

Haha, yes? The guy was a nationally recognized poet, a gifted painter, and a top student when he was at school and not fighting other students. He also taught and worked as a meteorologist.

Sorry, but no. The guy went to jail for kidnappings and burglaries, and as you mentioned fighting other students. He was angry and violent not an intellectual.

By the way, George W. Bush has been doing a lot of painting since he left office. His grades in school were also just fine. Nobody in their right mind would call him an intellectual. An intellectual is someone who by definition someone who uses their intellect to solve problems and sway people to their ideas. The usage of pre-emptive physical violence against enemies pretty much instantly rejects you for such a title.

 

[Xelor]

Re: Socialism’s Rising Popularity

I have some thoughts to share about the "growing preference for socialism" narrative/trend you introduced, but I will have to present them in a separate post because of the character limit.

I have been cruising the internet ins search of polls taken during the 1930's, and later, about the popularity of capitalism and socialism. I have not found any. If you know of one, please post it.

I generally won't ever post content to aid my debate partner in making their case. The closest I ever come to advancing an opposing POV is writing the counterargument portion of a dialectical essay, an example of which is attached to this post.

I will out of courtesy alone offer that while I don't know of a specific poll that meets your criteria, I can suggest a few documents that may contain information that may (or may not; I haven't read them) be of use. I suspect, however, the specific information you seek exists in one or more of the cited documents in the documents to which I've below provided links. Too, I suspect you may have to aggregate data from one or more of them to develop your own compendium that may support your claim about the growing preference for socialism. It may be too that you won't find something so succinct as a poll.

• The Socialist Party of America, 1900–1929
• Socialism: The 20th Century and 21st Century
• The Rise Of American Socialism
• The Historical Conflict of Socialism and Capitalism
• Millennials Like Socialism Until They Get Jobs -- [When I and my siblings were kids, we thought of Dad's earnings as our earnings, yet as dad, I am of a different mind. LOL]

I am aware of the poll that led me to challenge your original claim about the "growing preference" for socialism. That poll indicates that Americans' preference for socialism over capitalism (1) is non-existent and (2) has not changed materially from 2010 - 2016.

The fact that polls on the subject are taken now and that they find a large minority of Americans do prefer socialism tells me that socialism is more popular than it was, let us say a generation or so ago, when polling agencies did not think the question was worth asking. The fact that polls indicate that Bernie Sanders is the most popular American politician also give indication of the growing support for socialism.

What am I to say to that? Everyone's got abducted stances that don't align with any corroborating data.

• Including the above referenced polls, I've provided five data sets that collectively indicate there is no "growing support" for socialism.
• How you can look at the information pertaining to a single point in time and infer that it reflects an increase or decrease from a prior point in time is beyond me, yet that is what you've done. Do you truly not see how irrational your inference is?

Democratic socialism has been a popular ideal in much of the world for over a century. The fact that it exists nowhere leads me to suspect that it cannot exist, given constraints of human nature.

Democratic socialism has existed.

​

Social democracy does exist to varying degrees in Scandinavia, Germany, the British Commonwealth, and perhaps in France. I prefer it to what exists in the United States. So does a large minority of uncertain size, but one that seems to be larger than it was even during the high point of political liberalism, which was 1964.

I have spent time in a host of places. In each locale, I found life quite pleasant, yet I noticed they all have pros and cons.

I prefer the cultural ethos and sci-tech adoption of nearly all places I've been/lived outside the U.S. to that in the U.S., yet I prefer the U.S. political and economic structures to those of other places. Nonetheless, I'm sure I could live happily in any peaceful country.

"Large minority" --> I'm not sure why you noted that.

So again, a partial concession to your point.

Let's be clear: You, not I, have a point.

1. You made an claim (your point).
2. I challenged you to support the verity of your claim.
3. You provided two references.
4. I showed that the information contained in those references does not support your assertion.

That discursive sequence doesn't give me "a point;" it leaves you with an unsubstantiated point.

 

[Bum]

Re: Socialism’s Rising Popularity

Are there more uneducated voters on the left or on the right?

I think both sides have some stupid in equal measure....just slightly different flavors.

 

[slick]

Re: Socialism’s Rising Popularity

I think both sides have some stupid in equal measure....just slightly different flavors.

Know this: The facts do not seem to be on your side.

In 2012, Obama garnered 64% of the high school drop out vote.. And that
in 2008 he took in 66% of the drop out vote, in 2000 Gore got 59% of their vote,
as did Clinton is 1996. There are exceptions during a few elections, but
for the most part Democrats dominate the high school dropout
(grade school) demographic,

 

[Bum]

Re: Socialism’s Rising Popularity

Know this: The facts do not seem to be on your side.

In 2012, Obama garnered 64% of the high school drop out vote.. And that
in 2008 he took in 66% of the drop out vote, in 2000 Gore got 59% of their vote,
as did Clinton is 1996. There are exceptions during a few elections, but
for the most part Democrats dominate the high school dropout
(grade school) demographic,

Know this: stupid is not the sole domain of the uneducated.....some of the most educated people I know are uninformed and dumber than a box of rocks.

Try not to limit your notion of education to the brick and mortar institutions that produce certificates with letters.

 

[SmartCat]

Re: Socialism’s Rising Popularity

I have some thoughts to share about the "growing preference for socialism" narrative/trend you introduced, but I will have to present them in a separate post because of the character limit.

I generally won't ever post content to aid my debate partner in making their case. The closest I ever come to advancing an opposing POV is writing the counterargument portion of a dialectical essay, an example of which is attached to this post.

I will out of courtesy alone offer that while I don't know of a specific poll that meets your criteria, I can suggest a few documents that may contain information that may (or may not; I haven't read them) be of use. I suspect, however, the specific information you seek exists in one or more of the cited documents in the documents to which I've below provided links. Too, I suspect you may have to aggregate data from one or more of them to develop your own compendium that may support your claim about the growing preference for socialism. It may be too that you won't find something so succinct as a poll.

• The Socialist Party of America, 1900–1929
• Socialism: The 20th Century and 21st Century
• The Rise Of American Socialism
• The Historical Conflict of Socialism and Capitalism
• Millennials Like Socialism Until They Get Jobs -- [When I and my siblings were kids, we thought of Dad's earnings as our earnings, yet as dad, I am of a different mind. LOL]

I am aware of the poll that led me to challenge your original claim about the "growing preference" for socialism. That poll indicates that Americans' preference for socialism over capitalism (1) is non-existent and (2) has not changed materially from 2010 - 2016.


What am I to say to that? Everyone's got abducted stances that don't align with any corroborating data.

• Including the above referenced polls, I've provided five data sets that collectively indicate there is no "growing support" for socialism.
• How you can look at the information pertaining to a single point in time and infer that it reflects an increase or decrease from a prior point in time is beyond me, yet that is what you've done. Do you truly not see how irrational your inference is?

Democratic socialism has existed.

​

I have spent time in a host of places. In each locale, I found life quite pleasant, yet I noticed they all have pros and cons.

I prefer the cultural ethos and sci-tech adoption of nearly all places I've been/lived outside the U.S. to that in the U.S., yet I prefer the U.S. political and economic structures to those of other places. Nonetheless, I'm sure I could live happily in any peaceful country.

"Large minority" --> I'm not sure why you noted that.



Let's be clear: You, not I, have a point.

1. You made an claim (your point).
2. I challenged you to support the verity of your claim.
3. You provided two references.
4. I showed that the information contained in those references does not support your assertion.

That discursive sequence doesn't give me "a point;" it leaves you with an unsubstantiated point.

Let's agree that a large minority of Americans prefer socialism to capitalism, that Bernie Sanders is the most popular American politician,

https://morningconsult.com/2018/01/23/senator-rankings-jan-2018/

and let it go at that.