America has it Wrong # 73

[Ug make hammer]

No, it's not the Metric system this time, that was #12

No, it's not the driving-on-the-right business, that was resolved in #41. America is actually right.

I'm here today to harangue Americans about their DATE FORMAT.

Firstly, all dates should be the same number of characters. It's just laziness to leave leading zeros off. If Americans absolutely insist on putting the month first, then at least make January an 01 instead of a 1. I know, it's a style point, but it really does look better, and dates will never be mistaken for anything else. I walked into a 7/11 and said 9/11 by mistake, the cashier pulled a gun on me. That's not right!

Secondly, and more seriously, the only date format which sorts alphabetically into chronological order is YYYY-MM-DD and that's the format every country on Earth should use. It is somewhat in use in the US, in science and the military, but it should be required in all government documents and websites. And I mean exclusively: if people can't grasp it, they should try harder.

Thirdly, if government doesn't strongly encourage the use of YYYY-MM-DD then there's a risk of the US trying to adopt the most popular format from overseas, which is DD-MM-YYYY and since about one quarter of dates have an indistinguishable format (01/06/2021 could be two different dates) it would be a shemozzle. Not considering YYYY- at the START of a date, is probably why America has never changed from the worst possible system.

Fourthly and finally, China uses the YYYY-MM-DD system, as does Japan. If the US is serious about engaging in Asia (for markets, or to contain China, or both) then it should forget about them adopting the worst system, and save them from using the second worst, by switching to the best. Most Western European countries and the UK also use the YYYY-MM-DD system, but not exclusively. They also use the second best DD-MM-YYYY but it doesn't get them in a tangle the way it would Americans. For instance, 2021-01-06 is clearly distinguishable from 06-01-2021.

Fifthly, I'm only bugging you for fun. I know there's no way the average American will ever break their date habit, any more than they will go metric. "If it ain't broke yet, don't try and fix it" should be the national motto.

 

[Gateman_Wen]

date format which sorts alphabetically into chronological order is YYYY-MM-DD and that's the format every country on Earth should use.

Why?

 

[Ug make hammer]

Why?

It sorts alphabetically into chronological order.

 

[Gateman_Wen]

It sorts alphabetically into chronological order.

What difference does that make? I mean, why should I care about that?

 

[Ug make hammer]

What difference does that make? I mean, why should I care about that?

Just vote in the poll and move on to some other thread. I can't make you care.

 

[Gateman_Wen]

Just vote in the poll and move on to some other thread. I can't make you care.

Why does it matter whether its alphabetical or not? Explain it.

 

[ElChupacabra]

As someone who works with data, the lack of date standardization across a wide array of applications is pretty annoying.

 

[Ug make hammer]

Why does it matter whether its alphabetical or not? Explain it.

Suppose you make a daily note of something. You can put the date in the file-name and providing all the rest of the name is the same, it doesn't matter if the date is at the start, at the end, or somewhere in between. Sort by filename will also sort by date (ascending or descending, whichever you choose)

Can't you do that with the file creation date? Yes you could, but you'd have to change the creation date to an earlier date (which I personally don't know how to do in Windows) if you forgot one day to make the note, and made it the next day instead.


Don't overlook reason 5 either. An Asian dispatcher looking at the date on an order, would need to know if it's in British DD-MM-YYYY or US MM-DD-YYYY to be sure they have it right. YYYY-MM-DD doesn't have that problem because thankfully no-one has muddied the water by using YYYY-DD-MM.

 

[Lloyd Christmas]

It sorts alphabetically into chronological order.

Definitely great for file management, but don't see importance for other uses.

 

[AGENT J]

No, it's not the Metric system this time, that was #12

No, it's not the driving-on-the-right business, that was resolved in #41. America is actually right.

I'm here today to harangue Americans about their DATE FORMAT.

Firstly, all dates should be the same number of characters. It's just laziness to leave leading zeros off. If Americans absolutely insist on putting the month first, then at least make January an 01 instead of a 1. I know, it's a style point, but it really does look better, and dates will never be mistaken for anything else. I walked into a 7/11 and said 9/11 by mistake, the cashier pulled a gun on me. That's not right!

Secondly, and more seriously, the only date format which sorts alphabetically into chronological order is YYYY-MM-DD and that's the format every country on Earth should use. It is somewhat in use in the US, in science and the military, but it should be required in all government documents and websites. And I mean exclusively: if people can't grasp it, they should try harder.

Thirdly, if government doesn't strongly encourage the use of YYYY-MM-DD then there's a risk of the US trying to adopt the most popular format from overseas, which is DD-MM-YYYY and since about one quarter of dates have an indistinguishable format (01/06/2021 could be two different dates) it would be a shemozzle. Not considering YYYY- at the START of a date, is probably why America has never changed from the worst possible system.

Fourthly and finally, China uses the YYYY-MM-DD system, as does Japan. If the US is serious about engaging in Asia (for markets, or to contain China, or both) then it should forget about them adopting the worst system, and save them from using the second worst, by switching to the best. Most Western European countries and the UK also use the YYYY-MM-DD system, but not exclusively. They also use the second best DD-MM-YYYY but it doesn't get them in a tangle the way it would Americans. For instance, 2021-01-06 is clearly distinguishable from 06-01-2021.

Fifthly, I'm only bugging you for fun. I know there's no way the average American will ever break their date habit, any more than they will go metric. "If it ain't broke yet, don't try and fix it" should be the national motto.

I do DOD contracting and when entering data in a computer or system we are required to enter it year/month/ day 🤷‍♂️

been doing this for years so it doesnt really seem weird to me

now of course i agree we do not WRITE it that way and america will probably never do it even though they should just like the metric system

 

[Gateman_Wen]

Suppose you make a daily note of something. You can put the date in the file-name and providing all the rest of the name is the same, it doesn't matter if the date is at the start, at the end, or somewhere in between. Sort by filename will also sort by date (ascending or descending, whichever you choose)

Only if you just use numbers. Otherwise you'll end up with August before everything but April.

Otherwise it's an interesting idea.

 

[bomberfox]

Eh i dont see the point of including extra 0s.

 

[EdwinWillers]

Why does it matter whether its alphabetical or not? Explain it.

Well, here's one example - files on a computer that are date sensitive as to their content (versus when they were last modified). The YYYY-MM-DD format enables ready sorting of such files if they're used as part of the file name. We've been doing that for years in my line of work.

That said - is it necessary we "adopt" some sort of standard for this format? No. Different formats have different purposes for different needs and everyone seems plenty satisfied with how things stand now. It's really just a personal preference issue in my mind.

 

[ElChupacabra]

Definitely great for file management, but don't see importance for other uses.

Data migration. Without standardized values you have to reformat for ingestion. It's not a massive lift, but an added step that isn't necessary.

 

[The flaming lib]

Why?

cause it hurts some libs fweelings that why

 

[Noodlegawd]

No, it's not the Metric system this time, that was #12

No, it's not the driving-on-the-right business, that was resolved in #41. America is actually right.

I'm here today to harangue Americans about their DATE FORMAT.

Firstly, all dates should be the same number of characters. It's just laziness to leave leading zeros off. If Americans absolutely insist on putting the month first, then at least make January an 01 instead of a 1. I know, it's a style point, but it really does look better, and dates will never be mistaken for anything else. I walked into a 7/11 and said 9/11 by mistake, the cashier pulled a gun on me. That's not right!

Secondly, and more seriously, the only date format which sorts alphabetically into chronological order is YYYY-MM-DD and that's the format every country on Earth should use. It is somewhat in use in the US, in science and the military, but it should be required in all government documents and websites. And I mean exclusively: if people can't grasp it, they should try harder.

Thirdly, if government doesn't strongly encourage the use of YYYY-MM-DD then there's a risk of the US trying to adopt the most popular format from overseas, which is DD-MM-YYYY and since about one quarter of dates have an indistinguishable format (01/06/2021 could be two different dates) it would be a shemozzle. Not considering YYYY- at the START of a date, is probably why America has never changed from the worst possible system.

Fourthly and finally, China uses the YYYY-MM-DD system, as does Japan. If the US is serious about engaging in Asia (for markets, or to contain China, or both) then it should forget about them adopting the worst system, and save them from using the second worst, by switching to the best. Most Western European countries and the UK also use the YYYY-MM-DD system, but not exclusively. They also use the second best DD-MM-YYYY but it doesn't get them in a tangle the way it would Americans. For instance, 2021-01-06 is clearly distinguishable from 06-01-2021.

Fifthly, I'm only bugging you for fun. I know there's no way the average American will ever break their date habit, any more than they will go metric. "If it ain't broke yet, don't try and fix it" should be the national motto.

I disagree. We should adopt a different dating system entirely. Every day of the year should have a number. That's it. No months needed.

Dates would be reflected as: 2022-123

If someone asks you want day it is, you could just say "151" or "17."

 

[Gateman_Wen]

cause it hurts some libs fweelings that why

I don't see that hurting anyone's feelings, unless you're saying its your ass that's chapped?

 

[StillBallin75]

This may be curious to some, but the US Armed Forces actually uses the YYYYMMDD format (no dashes).

 

[The flaming lib]

I don't see that hurting anyone's feelings, unless you're saying its your ass that's chapped?

Your welcome to come by and see if it’s chapped yourself. But it’s just still perfectly smooth and delightful….bodacious even.

 

[Ug make hammer]

Only if you just use numbers. Otherwise you'll end up with August before everything but April.

Otherwise it's an interesting idea.

We could rename the months! But I was seeking to take advantage of significant overseas adoption (of YMD) to unite the world on one standard. Naming the months would just be a shitfest. Starting with Americal, Brazilia, etc ...

As it is, YYYY-MM-DD enjoys the huge advantage that it can't be mistaken for anything else. Both the others, you need to know the nationality of the writer (in about one quarter of cases: 9/30.5 /12 x10) and the only thing worse is rare varieties where year is given YY. These were more common last century, and it's where they belong.

 

[Ug make hammer]

This may be curious to some, but the US Armed Forces actually uses the YYYYMMDD format (no dashes).

That's good for in-house (and NATO?). But there are surely dates which are false matches with DDMMYYYY and MMDDYYYY so you still need to know who you're dealing with.

Using ONE decimal point so the date scans as a number and as text, might fix the false match problem? Like, YYYYMM.DD

How does a time in 24 hour format attach to a date?

 

[Ug make hammer]

I disagree. We should adopt a different dating system entirely. Every day of the year should have a number. That's it. No months needed.

Dates would be reflected as: 2022-123

If someone asks you want day it is, you could just say "151" or "17."

I'm drafting you as a primary school teacher. Your job is to teach kids the seven times table up to 52 x 7

It's not a terrible idea, really. It would be a lot easier to figure the time between dates in your head (simple subtraction) and with normal or extended 7 times tables, know what day of the week a date falls on.

To anyone whose birthday falls on day 13: well that's just bad luck.

 

[armycowboy]

No, it's not the Metric system this time, that was #12

No, it's not the driving-on-the-right business, that was resolved in #41. America is actually right.

I'm here today to harangue Americans about their DATE FORMAT.

Firstly, all dates should be the same number of characters. It's just laziness to leave leading zeros off. If Americans absolutely insist on putting the month first, then at least make January an 01 instead of a 1. I know, it's a style point, but it really does look better, and dates will never be mistaken for anything else. I walked into a 7/11 and said 9/11 by mistake, the cashier pulled a gun on me. That's not right!

Secondly, and more seriously, the only date format which sorts alphabetically into chronological order is YYYY-MM-DD and that's the format every country on Earth should use. It is somewhat in use in the US, in science and the military, but it should be required in all government documents and websites. And I mean exclusively: if people can't grasp it, they should try harder.

Thirdly, if government doesn't strongly encourage the use of YYYY-MM-DD then there's a risk of the US trying to adopt the most popular format from overseas, which is DD-MM-YYYY and since about one quarter of dates have an indistinguishable format (01/06/2021 could be two different dates) it would be a shemozzle. Not considering YYYY- at the START of a date, is probably why America has never changed from the worst possible system.

Fourthly and finally, China uses the YYYY-MM-DD system, as does Japan. If the US is serious about engaging in Asia (for markets, or to contain China, or both) then it should forget about them adopting the worst system, and save them from using the second worst, by switching to the best. Most Western European countries and the UK also use the YYYY-MM-DD system, but not exclusively. They also use the second best DD-MM-YYYY but it doesn't get them in a tangle the way it would Americans. For instance, 2021-01-06 is clearly distinguishable from 06-01-2021.

Fifthly, I'm only bugging you for fun. I know there's no way the average American will ever break their date habit, any more than they will go metric. "If it ain't broke yet, don't try and fix it" should be the national motto.

This matters, how?

 

[Ug make hammer]

This matters, how?

Vote and move on.

 

[Noodlegawd]

I'm drafting you as a primary school teacher. Your job is to teach kids the seven times table up to 52 x 7

It's not a terrible idea, really. It would be a lot easier to figure the time between dates in your head (simple subtraction) and with normal or extended 7 times tables, know what day of the week a date falls on.

To anyone whose birthday falls on day 13: well that's just bad luck.

Why 52 and 7?