63 Republicans vote against resolution expressing support for NATO

[TU Curmudgeon]

First off, How about all the countries that are still not paying their proper share of NATO be brought up to date, before any expansion of NATO? Does the USA have more money to throw at NATO? Of course not.

​

As you can see, the US spends less of its GDP on NATO than Canada does.

Second, what the hell is anything about climate change doing in a NATO Bill?

I see, so mentioning that NATO is interested in the effects of climate change is now totally verboten and is the same thing as saying "We are going to toss a whole truckload of money into NATO's climate change amelioration efforts.". Suuuuuuuuuuurrrrrrrrrrrrreeeeeeeeeee it is.

Of course this shit needs to be rejected.


“Our commitment to shared democratic values is what distinguishes NATO from other military alliances,” said Rep. Connolly. “Without it, NATO is just another military block that does not like Russia. But this commitment cannot remain purely aspirational or rhetorical. It must be operationalized. This is why we believe that we need formal architecture in NATO itself. There are divisions and units within NATO dedicated to collective defense, terrorism, hybrid warfare, cyber, climate change, and all other security challenges. But after 72 years, there’s not even a broom closet in NATO headquarters dedicated to democratic institution building. This Center is long overdue. I want to thank my friend, Mike Turner, for his collaboration on this resolution, and I look forward to working with him further to pass it in the House.”

Turner and Connolly Introduce Resolution in Support of Establishing a NATO Center for Democratic Resilience

turner.house.gov

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Its bull shit.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

No, we’re not. McCarthy was a hero and a patriot who tried to expose the tendrils of foreign ideology in our country.

The current people condemning the right are the people who’s intellectual ancestors should’ve been purged by McCarthy

I'm always glad when I see a Falangist talking about freedom.

 

[justoneman]

View attachment 67384100
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As you can see, the US spends less of its GDP on NATO than Canada does.

I see, so mentioning that NATO is interested in the effects of climate change is now totally verboten and is the same thing as saying "We are going to toss a whole truckload of money into NATO's climate change amelioration efforts.". Suuuuuuuuuuurrrrrrrrrrrrreeeeeeeeeee it is.

Real spending chart top ten by % of GDP. Where is Germany and Canada in this top ten?


Top 10 NATO Countries with the Highest Defense Expenditures (by % of 2021 GDP)

1. Greece — 3.82%
2. United States — 3.52%
3. Croatia — 2.79%
4. United Kingdom — 2.29%
5. Estonia — 2.28%
6. Latvia — 2.27%
7. Poland — 2.10%
8. Lithuania — 2.03%
9. Romania — 2.02%
10. France — 2.01%

NATO Spending by Country 2024

 

[The Mark]

More than 60 Republicans [nearly a third of the Republican caucus] today voted against a resolution expressing support for NATO and calling on President Joe Biden to strengthen the organization's committement to defending democracy.​

​

Republicans who voted against Tuesday's resolution included most of Trump's most loyal defenders in Congress, among them: Reps. Lauren Boebert of Colorado; Madison Cawthorn of North Carolina; Matt Gaetz of Florida; Paul Gosar of Arizona; Marjorie Taylor-Greene of Georgia; and Jim Jordan of Ohio.​

​

The "House Republicans for Authoritarians" caucus.

Wasn't that long ago Republicans were personally kissing Putin's ass. Now they do it with their votes.

This may sound conspiracy-theory-ish, but I keep wondering if some of the dark money used in our elections is laundered into the country from Russia. Russia has to be happy with what some of the Republicans have been doing, and they're disturbingly well funded.

But keeping that money dark is how powers in our own country keep their hands publicly clean, so I don't think it'll be revealed anytime soon.

 

[Dayton3]

All right! The far-right propaganda machine makes its appearance! Where ya been, boy?

Why do you label me in such a way?

 

[Dayton3]

Real spending chart top ten by % of GDP. Where is Germany and Canada in this top ten?


Top 10 NATO Countries with the Highest Defense Expenditures (by % of 2021 GDP)

1. Greece — 3.82%
2. United States — 3.52%
3. Croatia — 2.79%
4. United Kingdom — 2.29%
5. Estonia — 2.28%
6. Latvia — 2.27%
7. Poland — 2.10
8. Lithuania — 2.03%
9. Romania — 2.02%
10. France — 2.01%

NATO Spending by Country 2024

U.S. defence spending should be at least 4% of GDP, probably 5% in order to prepare the U.S. for the next major war.

And build a nationwide ABM system.

 

[Tigerace117]

It is time to choose sides so we know where we stand. We are not heading anywhere now. The fascists are still in a minority but they are growing and our democracy is under attack. That is what that vote showed. BTW it is treason to plot against our Constitution no matter what the founders might have said. We can have treason from within without any war being declared.

Claiming that their vote was “a plot against the constitution” is ludicrous. Paranoia is not, in fact, healthy, and hampers actual efforts for protect said constitution.

 

[Tigerace117]

True. How do you feel about trying to overturn a free and fair election? Is that "traitorous"? Just trying to guage where you're coming from here...

Yep. And I’ve said so, repeatedly.

 

[Tigerace117]

Well what Turkey is an example of was a secular authoritarian country that strictly oppressed the muslim majority, then when a leader was democratically elected and began pulling back outrageous laws like the banning of women’s head scarves then treasonous elements in the military attempted to overthrow said president and they went out murdering Turkish civilians who took to the streets to support their valid government.

It may be true Turkey is going Authoritarian the other way, but that’s what happens when violent overthrow of regimes occurs. Since you love to talk about Chile all the time, do you think Chile would’ve transformed into a vibrant open democracy if Allende defeated the coup? Or do you think with the help of Cuban intelligence that they would’ve purged the entire military,congressional, and judicial structures? You know full well what the answer is.

Gee, it certainly would have been far more democratic than it was under Pinochet, a psychotic tyrant who ordered a terrorist attack on American soil. Fearmongering about “communist purges” was nothing more than a thin layer of excuses to “justify” the atrocities committed.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Claiming that their vote was “a plot against the constitution” is ludicrous. Paranoia is not, in fact, healthy, and hampers actual efforts for protect said constitution.

I don’t know what you mean by “protecting the constitution” America no longer has any formal constitution, the constitution of 1787 has long since died. We can say the articles of confederation were the 1st American Republic, the Constitution of 1787 is the 2nd Republic, and now we’re in kind of a rule by decree situation from the administration.

What you must mean by “protecting the constitution” is protecting the left dictatorship now in effect, and you know enough about history to know what’s going to happen if the regime doesn’t begin to self moderate

Gee, it certainly would have been far more democratic than it was under Pinochet, a psychotic tyrant who ordered a terrorist attack on American soil.

Allegedly, certainly Chilean intelligence carried it out with the assistance of Cuban CIA assets. I’ve not heard of like a signed order by Pino himself to carry it out.

Fearmongering about “communist purges”

It wasn’t fear mongering. Fidel Castro came down to Chile several months before the coup and gave a speech to amped out Allende supporters decrying striking truck drivers and protesting women to be “fascists” and he urged Allende to create a parallel military structure of politically loyal communists, Fidel was smarter than Allende for sure, at least better at street smarts, but in any event it’s quite clear that Fidel was pushing Allende to begin the total revolution sooner rather than later. Thankfully for Chile Allende was a Baffoon or else Chile would be like Cuba probably today.

was nothing more than a thin layer of excuses to “justify” the atrocities committed.

You seem to operate under the idea most people kill just because they love killing. This is a silly position. Whatever you think of the threat, The first assumption should be that Pinochet and his regime believed they were protecting Chile from violent communists. And as a matter of fact, they were.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

U.S. defence spending should be at least 4% of GDP, probably 5% in order to prepare the U.S. for the next major war.

And build a nationwide ABM system.

What next major war? The US is surrounded by oceans. There is no military force on planet earth that can invade the US mainland. There is no major war to prepare for. Military spending needs to be greatly reduced. I mean I guess you can justify military spending as a jobs program for people from depressed communities in the Midwest, but why don’t we just cut the defense contractors out of the deal and instead do actual infrastructure projects?

 

[venice_ca]

No. Most of the GOPers that so voted were motivated by their loathing of "wokism" and what they see as the LGBT agenda.

NATO is “woke” and has a LGBT agenda —
when did this happen?
Take Italy as an example; what’s their LGBT agenda?

 

[KingLeo]

It appears they are afraid of being uninvited to next months CPAC conference in Budapest.

The May meeting of the Conservative Political Action Conference (CPAC) is seen by some Republicans as a test of how closely American conservatives are willing align themselves with a global movement of far-right, Russia-friendly strongmen embraced by former U.S. President Donald Trump.

The event’s keynote speaker is Hungarian Prime Minister Viktor Orban, a longtime supporter of Russian President Vladimir Putin. The European Union has accused Orban, who won re-election by a large margin on Sunday, of curbing media and judicial independence, enriching associates with public funds and recasting election laws to entrench his power.

 

[Tigerace117]

I don’t know what you mean by “protecting the constitution” America no longer has any formal constitution, the constitution of 1787 has long since died. We can say the articles of confederation were the 1st American Republic, the Constitution of 1787 is the 2nd Republic, and now we’re in kind of a rule by decree situation from the administration.

What you must mean by “protecting the constitution” is protecting the left dictatorship now in effect, and you know enough about history to know what’s going to happen if the regime doesn’t begin to self moderate

Allegedly, certainly Chilean intelligence carried it out with the assistance of Cuban CIA assets. I’ve not heard of like a signed order by Pino himself to carry it out.

It wasn’t fear mongering. Fidel Castro came down to Chile several months before the coup and gave a speech to amped out Allende supporters decrying striking truck drivers and protesting women to be “fascists” and he urged Allende to create a parallel military structure of politically loyal communists, Fidel was smarter than Allende for sure, at least better at street smarts, but in any event it’s quite clear that Fidel was pushing Allende to begin the total revolution sooner rather than later. Thankfully for Chile Allende was a Baffoon or else Chile would be like Cuba probably today.

You seem to operate under the idea most people kill just because they love killing. This is a silly position. Whatever you think of the threat, The first assumption should be that Pinochet and his regime believed they were protecting Chile from violent communists. And as a matter of fact, they were.

Claiming America is a “dictatorship” is laughably dumb. If that was actually true you’d be in a prison camp right now, not posting on this website.

Dictators don’t let their intelligence agencies carry out attacks—much less attacks in the United States—without approving them, so arguing that he wouldn’t have approved said attack beforehand doesn’t hold water.

Gee, given the open disloyalty of the Chilean military he probably should have. It would have saved a lot of lives. Especially since the US sure as hell thought things would go well, since “fear of a well functioning socialistic experiment” is what panicked us enough to support Pinochet in the first place.

Except they certainly weren’t, and they killed more Chileans than the communists could have ever dreamed of, wrecking Chile’s democracy in the process.

 

[Dayton3]

What next major war? The US is surrounded by oceans. There is no military force on planet earth that can invade the US mainland. There is no major war to prepare for. Military spending needs to be greatly reduced. I mean I guess you can justify military spending as a jobs program for people from depressed communities in the Midwest, but why don’t we just cut the defense contractors out of the deal and instead do actual infrastructure projects?

Why do you people love to act like an "invasion" is the only threat the U.S. could face?

Defense contractors have to eat to you know.

 

[Dayton3]

NATO is “woke” and has a LGBT agenda —
when did this happen?
Take Italy as an example; what’s their LGBT agenda?

What are you babbling about now?

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Why do you people love to act like an "invasion" is the only threat the U.S. could face?

What other threat can the US face? Now I want you to read that carefully, I didn’t say white thread Our sock puppets around the world face, what threat can we face?

Defense contractors have to eat to you know.

And I fully believe they should be well fed, with black bread and cabbage, in the canteens of the Alaskan labor camps.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Claiming America is a “dictatorship” is laughably dumb. If that was actually true you’d be in a prison camp right now, not posting on this website.

Oh, so Poland and Hungary are not authoritarian dictatorships? Thank you for the admission.

Dictators don’t let their intelligence agencies carry out attacks—much less attacks in the United States—without approving them, so arguing that he wouldn’t have approved said attack beforehand doesn’t hold water.

I mean that is what you claim right now, but you have no reason to believe that other than you want to.

Gee, given the open disloyalty of the Chilean military he probably should have.

Wow, so now you are insisting that Allende should’ve imposed to communist dictatorship. Well, a lot of people around him thought so too, which is why the coup was justified.

It would have saved a lot of lives. Especially since the US sure as hell thought things would go well, since “fear of a well functioning socialistic experiment” is what panicked us enough to support Pinochet in the first place.

There is no existing communist dictatorship that was less deadly than the Pinochet dictator ship. Imposing a full on communist dictator ship would’ve killed many many more people. I mean Cambodia has half the population of Chile and communist killed millions.

Except they certainly weren’t, and they killed more Chileans than the communists could have ever dreamed of, wrecking Chile’s democracy in the process.

Blah blah blah.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Claiming America is a “dictatorship” is laughably dumb. If that was actually true you’d be in a prison camp right now, not posting on this website.

Dictators don’t let their intelligence agencies carry out attacks—much less attacks in the United States—without approving them, so arguing that he wouldn’t have approved said attack beforehand doesn’t hold water.

Gee, given the open disloyalty of the Chilean military he probably should have. It would have saved a lot of lives. Especially since the US sure as hell thought things would go well, since “fear of a well functioning socialistic experiment” is what panicked us enough to support Pinochet in the first place.

Except they certainly weren’t, and they killed more Chileans than the communists could have ever dreamed of, wrecking Chile’s democracy in the process.

But also, in a roundabout way you have basically proven the point I originally made. You think that imposing a full on communist dictatorship would’ve been justified by Allende. Which is why you denouncing President Erdogan of Turkey is really funny, because he is doing nothing different than what you think IND should have done.

 

[The Hairy Fiddler]

But at the same time, McCarthyism is equally dangerous. Isolationism has been around since the dawn of the country. You can think it’s stupid all you want— I certainly do— but the constant stream of accusations of “treason” without the slightest shred of evidence is a dangerous game to be playing.

Isolationist sentiment waxes and wanes over time. After 9/11 it declined for a while, but I think people are just tired. America can help others, but it’s become blindingly obvious we can’t solve all the world’s problems, and interjecting ourselves into them has left many exhausted.

As for the John Birch Society, I think it was Barry Goldwater who said that the actual Birch would be appalled at the kind of crap that gets spouted in his name.

What does MCarthyism have to do with this topic? absolutely nothing. Really bad parallel. NATO was designed to keep Russia at bay and McCarthy erroneously called out covert cimmunists in the government and elsewhere. The topic isn't about isolationism either for that matter.

These 63 people are in fact traitors...a disgusting group of Trump-Putin sycophants. It's that simple. Just goes to show that Trump did an unbelievable amount of damage to our democracy. The man needs to be incarcerated.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Well, I haven't been able to find a single one of these 63 explaining what their issue is. If anyone finds one, let me know.

Yep, I found it very odd that was (intentionally?) not included in the OP linked “news” article.

 

[Tigerace117]

Oh, so Poland and Hungary are not authoritarian dictatorships? Thank you for the admission.

I mean that is what you claim right now, but you have no reason to believe that other than you want to.

Wow, so now you are insisting that Allende should’ve imposed to communist dictatorship. Well, a lot of people around him thought so too, which is why the coup was justified.

There is no existing communist dictatorship that was less deadly than the Pinochet dictator ship. Imposing a full on communist dictator ship would’ve killed many many more people. I mean Cambodia has half the population of Chile and communist killed millions.

Blah blah blah.

Both are run by authoritarian thugs, particularly Hungary. You being upset by that fact doesn’t change it.

Gee, other knowing how dictatorships operate. There is ZERO evidence that Pinochet’s intelligence service did anything without his approval.

I hate to break it to you, but given the openly treasonous actions of the Chilean military preventing your heroes from carrying out their coup has nothing to do with “communist dictatorships”.

Yes, “blah blah blah” does tend to sum up your pathetic excuses for the Chilean junta.

 

[Tigerace117]

What does MCarthyism have to do with this topic? absolutely nothing. Really bad parallel. NATO was designed to keep Russia at bay and McCarthy erroneously called out covert cimmunists in the government and elsewhere. The topic isn't about isolationism either for that matter.

These 63 people are in fact traitors...a disgusting group of Trump-Putin sycophants. It's that simple. Just goes to show that Trump did an unbelievable amount of damage to our democracy. The man needs to be incarcerated.

Hysterical accusations of “treason” without evidence is pretty much the definition of McCarthyism.

 

[Tigerace117]

But also, in a roundabout way you have basically proven the point I originally made. You think that imposing a full on communist dictatorship would’ve been justified by Allende. Which is why you denouncing President Erdogan of Turkey is really funny, because he is doing nothing different than what you think IND should have done.

I think preventing your treasonous heroes from establishing their junta would be a good thing, and that your desperation to try to excuse tyrants across the globe is even more pathetic than before.

Especially since there’d already been one treasonous attack by the Chilean military only a few months earlier.