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Zimmerman 2nd degree murder

barbarian_style

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AP: Zimmerman to be charged with 2nd-degree murder - Washington Times
TALLAHASSEE, Fla. — A law enforcement official says that the killer in the Trayvon Martin case will be charged with second-degree murder and is in custody.

The official with knowledge of the case says that the charge against George Zimmerman will be announced at a news conference at 6 p.m. Wednesday. The official says he’s in custody in Florida but wouldn’t say where. The official spoke on condition of anonymity because he wasn’t authorized to disclose the information.

This should become very interesting now.
 
They then had an interview or presser with his new attorney Mark O'Mara. He was very well spoken and at ease talking and answering questions. He should be very good for Zimmerman.
 
Wonder if Z will plead not guilty or guilty of murder. I believe if recollect that you must plead not guilty in order to take advantage of the appeals process.
 
He will plead not guilty. His defense will be based upon the stand your ground law.



Sent from the handicapped stall.
 
Wonder if Z will plead not guilty or guilty of murder. I believe if recollect that you must plead not guilty in order to take advantage of the appeals process.

I would think an appeal would be next to impossible:

The problem the defendant will have is that he had to stand before the court and agree to the guilty plea. he will have to answer questions from the court including whether you have had sufficient time to talk the matter over with the attorney, whether you understand the ramifications of the plea, whether anyone had given you inducements to compel you to take the plea, etc. So, to go back and say that you were lied to also says that you committed perjury to the court. We then get the old adage: 'Were you lying then? or, are you lying now?' Because, at some point, you will have had to lie to the court.

Can You Appeal After Taking A Plea Bargain

Perfectly reasonable and clear explanation. Sounds right to me.
 
He will plead not guilty. His defense will be based upon the stand your ground law.

Sent from the handicapped stall.

I'm not as sure as you are about that. First, I'm not even sure he'd be offered a plea deal. Since I think this is more political than satisfying the letter of the law, I believe the prosecution won't want to avoid a trial and all the hoopla that'll go with it. Second, if I were offered a plea deal of, say, three years in prison? I think I'd take it in a heartbeat. He's going to need three years in a safe place 'til all this crap dies down. (Seriously doubt a plea deal will be offered, though.)
 
First he would have to accept a plea deal. You plead not guilty to take advantage of the appeals process. If you are offered a plea deal and accept that, then no appeals, you just do your time...except for ineffective council.
 
Appeal would still be open if he wants to claim ineffective counsel, after taking the plea deal.

Sorry, I see no signs of ineffectiveness, here

Mark M. O'Mara | O?Mara Law Group | Orlando Florida

Mark is a former felony prosecutor and Division Chief and has handled all types of criminal cases, including traffic, property crimes, DUI, drug cases and Death Penalty cases. He has extensive trial experience in both state and federal criminal defense.
 

I thought this was helpful:

JEFFREY WEINER: The proof is certainly more than what is required for manslaughter. They're going to have to show that he had really a depraved mind. In other words, he didn't plan this ahead of time. It wasn't premeditated, but it was as reckless and wanton behavior as could possibly have taken place short of premeditation.

Zimmerman's Murder Charge: Prosecution Must Prove 'Depraved Mind' | PBS NewsHour | April 11, 2012 | PBS

The burden seems pretty high. I'll be interested in seeing what evidence will be used to try and meet that burden.
 
I thought this was helpful:

JEFFREY WEINER: The proof is certainly more than what is required for manslaughter. They're going to have to show that he had really a depraved mind. In other words, he didn't plan this ahead of time. It wasn't premeditated, but it was as reckless and wanton behavior as could possibly have taken place short of premeditation.

Zimmerman's Murder Charge: Prosecution Must Prove 'Depraved Mind' | PBS NewsHour | April 11, 2012 | PBS

The burden seems pretty high. I'll be interested in seeing what evidence will be used to try and meet that burden.

He's in jail, not 1 minute of hearing or 1 item of evidence, so he has already been found guilty summarily. The only question is will a judge or jury at some point in the future months or a year or more from now decide if actually he was not guilty and should have never spent a minute in jail? Regardless, he now loses everything he had.
They can try to break him with solitary, threats of putting him in general population, tell him that his family will be finally be safe if he pleas and that even the President is against him - and that he'll probably get a life sentence.

They can also tell him that even if finally found not guilty, they will just keep him in jail months or a year or two longer while they try him again in federal court for civil rights violations - for which he now is looking probably at 2 to 3 years in prison before a possibility of being twice found not guilty. In short, there is no not guilty - he already has been found guilty. All he can hope to do is get that reduced to 2 or 3 years at best.

With all that ahead of him, at some point they will offer him a plea to manslaughter - giving him time served and only maybe 2 or 3 years longer and then probation, for which he at least gets out of county jail and to a bigger prison where he actually might be able to have visitors, make phone calls and watch TV - and avoiding him getting a life sentence in his President Obama V George Zimmerman trials.

He's already been found guilty. He is already serving his sentence. It is only the question of how much time he serves. That is the only question a juries get to make over the next 2 to 3 years.

Welcome to the new America, where everyone is now presumed guilty and summarily imprisoned, unless months or years later they can get a jury they were wrongly imprisoned and have to be released.
 
He's in jail, not 1 minute of hearing or 1 item of evidence, so he has already been found guilty summarily. The only question is will a judge or jury at some point in the future months or a year or more from now decide if actually he was not guilty and should have never spent a minute in jail? Regardless, he now loses everything he had.
They can try to break him with solitary, threats of putting him in general population, tell him that his family will be finally be safe if he pleas and that even the President is against him - and that he'll probably get a life sentence.

They can also tell him that even if finally found not guilty, they will just keep him in jail months or a year or two longer while they try him again in federal court for civil rights violations - for which he now is looking probably at 2 to 3 years in prison before a possibility of being twice found not guilty. In short, there is no not guilty - he already has been found guilty. All he can hope to do is get that reduced to 2 or 3 years at best.

With all that ahead of him, at some point they will offer him a plea to manslaughter - giving him time served and only maybe 2 or 3 years longer and then probation, for which he at least gets out of county jail and to a bigger prison where he actually might be able to have visitors, make phone calls and watch TV - and avoiding him getting a life sentence in his President Obama V George Zimmerman trials.

He's already been found guilty. He is already serving his sentence. It is only the question of how much time he serves. That is the only question a juries get to make over the next 2 to 3 years.

Welcome to the new America, where everyone is now presumed guilty and summarily imprisoned, unless months or years later they can get a jury they were wrongly imprisoned and have to be released.

Enough with the tin foil hattery of "they will break him while in his cell" bullcrap. He's going through the very same process as everyone else does whose been arrested and headed to trial.
 
Enough with the tin foil hattery of "they will break him while in his cell" bullcrap. He's going through the very same process as everyone else does whose been arrested and headed to trial.

Joko's just mad cause he didn't think this would make it to a trial. He was betting on a race war. :shrug:
 
Enough with the tin foil hattery of "they will break him while in his cell" bullcrap. He's going through the very same process as everyone else does whose been arrested and headed to trial.

Same process as, the rest..nope.

There seems to be a hostile criminal justice system that stacks the deck against ccw/cops who are forced to make a split second decision and the public who hates law enforcement.

Both ccw/cops are fighting a losing battle and are caught between the hammer and anvil.

Wonder what external, community based factors weighed on the ridiculous 2nd degree murder rap?
 
Same process as, the rest..nope.

There seems to be a hostile criminal justice system that stacks the deck against ccw/cops who are forced to make a split second decision and the public who hates law enforcement.

Both ccw/cops are fighting a losing battle and are caught between the hammer and anvil.

yeah. Statistics show that the blacks got it good with regards to our judicial and penal system. LOL

Wonder what external, community based factors weighed on the ridiculous 2nd degree murder rap?

I wonder if we could dispense with the conspiracy hypotheticals posing as if they were fact.
 
I'm glad to hear it's going to trial. Based on the evidence I've heard, 2nd degree murder might be going a little too far, but it'll be interesting to see what comes out during the trial and what the jury thinks.
 
If that name sounds familiar to anybody, he is the same attorney who appeared as an analyst on many TV shows during the Casey Anthony trial. This guy is very good. So is the prosecutor. This trial is going to be fascinating to follow.

If it comes to a trial, it may just come down to a plea bargain and will be over in no time. If it does go to trial it may be a very good trial but I still think that it will be fairly short. Also it may come down to how long Zimmerman can afford that type of defense team.
 
Appeal would still be open if he wants to claim ineffective counsel, after taking the plea deal.

No, if he could prove ineffective counsel. If that were a slam-dunk, DA's wouldn't offer plea bargains.

If it comes to a trial, it may just come down to a plea bargain and will be over in no time. If it does go to trial it may be a very good trial but I still think that it will be fairly short. Also it may come down to how long Zimmerman can afford that type of defense team.

I think you're naive to think that a top criminal attorney won't handle this case pro bono. You can't buy the type of publicity this trial will garner.
 
Alan Dershowitz I believe noted that such a charge is a joke and should be easy to beat if GZ has competent counsel

concerned that at yesterday's press conference corey said she is seeking "justice for trayvon martin"
that indicates a bias on her part
she should be seeking justice
but appears to lean towards zimmerman being found guilty
guess that is what much of the public wants
let's just hope a fair trial is possible
if so, based on what little i know, i think zimmerman will be found not guilty
 
As long as the jury has the opotion to lowering the charge, I'm fine with this charge.
 
No, if he could prove ineffective counsel. If that were a slam-dunk, DA's wouldn't offer plea bargains.



I think you're naive to think that a top criminal attorney won't handle this case pro bono. You can't buy the type of publicity this trial will garner.


I do agree with you on this to some extent, if this thing get to stretched out or expensive and not to sure if he wouldn't bow out. He still hasn't seen all the evidence so it still to early to tell. If he hangs on and gets him off the hook yes this could boost his career.
 
As long as the jury has the opotion to lowering the charge, I'm fine with this charge.

depends, in some cases the DA does not charge a lesser included offense and in some jurisdictions manslaughter is not a LIO to murder. you'd be surprised how many times that bites ADA's in the butt
 
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