barfolemew
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Australianlibertarian said:Don't do it.
A few years ago the conservative government of John Howard introduced a 10% sales tax in Australia. Many people thought that the GST would herald in tax system changes or at least provide more funding for our (inefficient) government hospital system.
Well several years later, Australians are still waiting from tax reform, and we are still waiting to have a better hospital system. :2brickwal
Sales tax would be great, if that was the only form of government tax!
You have --absolute-- control over what doctor you see.jfuh said:Actually I fully support some form of national health care coverage. The health inssurance agencies hold a complete monopoly on our health as is today. I can not see a physician of my choosing without the approval of my insurer. Even after I'm "approved" I end up footing 80% of the bill anyway.
Ok, lesse...National health care coverage in other countries that I've seen and been to are excellent. Went on vacation in GB, had "travelers" food poisoning and ended up in the hospital. How was I charged? 5L for the antibiotics, and nothing for seeing the physician. I'm not even a citizen of that country and yet they just said don't sweat it.
Thats 8% on TOP of what you pay now.Something needs to be addressed with regards to how the US sees healthcare. If only 8% sales tax is all that's need, I could care less about that extra 1% if it means I get full coverage.
Navy Pride said:National health care is a disaster in Canada....I know people who have had to wait up to a year for critical surgery and have finally gave up and came to the states to get it done.......
GarzaUK said:I bet those people paid alot of money for that surgery in the US. What about a poor Canadian who can't pay that kind of money - I'm sure they are grateful for national healthcare.
But hey in the good old USA the poor are always getting f**ked over.
Australianlibertarian said:Don't do it.
A few years ago the conservative government of John Howard introduced a 10% sales tax in Australia. Many people thought that the GST would herald in tax system changes or at least provide more funding for our (inefficient) government hospital system.
Well several years later, Australians are still waiting from tax reform, and we are still waiting to have a better hospital system. :2brickwal
Sales tax would be great, if that was the only form of government tax!
Sure if I had several hundred dollars for normal checkups or that being several thousands of dollars to pay for surgery if required.Goobieman said:You have --absolute-- control over what doctor you see.
You --abdicate-- your control when you choose to have someone else pay your bills.
Goobieman said:Ok, lesse...
-Insurance company monopoly over heath care = bad
-Government monopoly over health care = good
Anyone else having a problem visualizing that?[/QUTOE]
Who said anything over government "monopoly"? Very poor red herring attempt.
Why should I pay for your personal property? Completely irrational.Goobieman said:Thats 8% on TOP of what you pay now.
Glad to see you;re so willing to have me pay for your health insurance -- maybe I can get the government to slap another 1% on so you can pay for my guns.
Also, an 8% sales tax is hardly indicative of being on top of what I already pay now. No where in the initiaters thread does it mention that. So by that premise you can not add this additional premise.
Kandahar said:Absolutely not. Both a national sales tax and universal health care would be economically devastating.
complete crap.aquapub said:I couldn't agree more. Socialism IN GENERAL stagnates economies, cripples production, and kills innovation. I hate it.
The last numbers I saw had Germany's growth rate at 1.1% and dropping, for years. France was 2.2% and dropping, for years.
Our rate was 5.4% and climbing, for years. And 5.4% of an economy OUR size is way, way bigger than 5% of an economy Germany's or France's size!
In their world, around 40% of the workers work for the government. Employees are virtually impossible to fire. Everything costs a fortune. Health care is terrible, slow, and behind in technology. In France, the GOVERNMENT RUN internet hasn't been upgraded since 1996. When people recently started complaining about the poor state of their internet, the government's brilliant solution was to give them a choice between different colored backgrounds for their PCs. It's really laughable.
Remember when the British got to be in charge of one sector of West Germany's reconstruction and we were in charge of the other? They did things their way (socialism), and we did them ours. Within a year, we had to bail them out because their sector's incredibly stagnate economy had grounded to a halt and they couldn't keep it running.
Think about public schools, public transportation, public housing, government food, BMVs and all other things public...
Now think about private schools, private transportation, private housing, store-bought food, and all things private.
There is a reason private is always better, and it is not money. D.C. schools are the most over-funded schools per capita and they are at the bottom in performance. It is about competition. Government agencies have no reason to penny-pinch, to innovate, to cut costs. Actually, government agencies usually waste as much money and resources as possible to be guaranteed equal or greater funding the next year.
The private sector does it faster, cheaper, and better.
Socialism takes all the priority off productivity and innovation and places it all on making life suck a little bit less for those who do the very least for their own station in life.
Socialism is a disease. Let's keep it contained in Europe.
jfuh said:complete crap.
Like I said -- don't complain about your lack of choices when you decide to let someone else pay for your bills. Beggars can't be choosers; as soon as you choose to have someone else pay your bills, you give them the right to decide a great many things.jfuh said:Sure if I had several hundred dollars for normal checkups or that being several thousands of dollars to pay for surgery if required.
By the way, what eslse is health insurance for?
Well, if the government pays for everyone;s health care, then the government gets to make all the decisions, just like the insurance companies. All you;re doing is replacing several insurance companies with one (the government). If the insurance companies presently have a monopoly, then so will the gvmnt.Who said anything over government "monopoly"? Very poor red herring attempt.Goobieman said:Ok, lesse...
-Insurance company monopoly over heath care = bad
-Government monopoly over health care = good
Anyone else having a problem visualizing that?
Why shoud -I- pay for -your- personal health care? Completely irrational.Why should I pay for your personal property? Completely irrational.
Right now, there is a 0% federal sales tax. An 8% federal sales tax for health care would necessarily be on top of whatever sales taxes there already are.Also, an 8% sales tax is hardly indicative of being on top of what I already pay now. No where in the initiaters thread does it mention that. So by that premise you can not add this additional premise.
Navy Pride said:National health care is a disaster in Canada....I know people who have had to wait up to a year for critical surgery and have finally gave up and came to the states to get it done.......
galenrox said:Man, EXACTLY! I am astounded how much people who hate this current government trust the government to take care of. I wouldn't trust this government to tell me if it's 12 AM or PM decisively, why the hell would anyone trust them with control of our health?
galenrox said:Man, EXACTLY! I am astounded how much people who hate this current government trust the government to take care of. I wouldn't trust this government to tell me if it's 12 AM or PM decisively, why the hell would anyone trust them with control of our health?
jfuh said:Actually I fully support some form of national health care coverage. The health inssurance agencies hold a complete monopoly on our health as is today. I can not see a physician of my choosing without the approval of my insurer. Even after I'm "approved" I end up footing 80% of the bill anyway.
National health care coverage in other countries that I've seen and been to are excellent. Went on vacation in GB, had "travelers" food poisoning and ended up in the hospital. How was I charged? 5L for the antibiotics, and nothing for seeing the physician. I'm not even a citizen of that country and yet they just said don't sweat it.
Something needs to be addressed with regards to how the US sees healthcare. If only 8% sales tax is all that's need, I could care less about that extra 1% if it means I get full coverage.
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