Why Religion is Stupid

[FluffyNinja]

Not the majority. The majority are agnostic or aetheist. Also I dispute the proportion that only become religious when adult. Most when children or adolescent. Also it can be no coincidence that they invariably take up the endemic religion of their country which shows one way or another they are a product of their environments. No one said screaming & kicking. In effect I said the opposite didn't I if you think about it.

Religions:
Christians 33.03% (of which Roman Catholics 17.33%, Protestants 5.8%, Orthodox 3.42%, Anglicans 1.23%), Muslims 20.12%, Hindus 13.34%, Buddhists 5.89%, Sikhs 0.39%, Jews 0.23%, other religions 12.61%, non-religious 12.03%, atheists 2.36% (2004 est.)

These statistics are from the CIA World fact book at

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/

According to these statistics, over 66% of the world's population are either Christian, Muslim or Hindu (all FAITH-BASED). Less than 15% are non-religious or atheists. I'd say that is a bit one-sided. I suppose 70% of all humans are stupid?

 

[128shot]

Religions:
Christians 33.03% (of which Roman Catholics 17.33%, Protestants 5.8%, Orthodox 3.42%, Anglicans 1.23%), Muslims 20.12%, Hindus 13.34%, Buddhists 5.89%, Sikhs 0.39%, Jews 0.23%, other religions 12.61%, non-religious 12.03%, atheists 2.36% (2004 est.)

These statistics are from the CIA World fact book at

http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/

According to these statistics, over 66% of the world's population are either Christian, Muslim or Hindu (all FAITH-BASED). Less than 15% are non-religious or atheists. I'd say that is a bit one-sided. I suppose 70% of all humans are stupid?

Almost all advances in humanity were made by a select few that helped make the lives of everyone better. I'd say less than 5% of the world population will actually make a difference in your life.

 

[oracle25]

Not the majority. The majority are agnostic or aetheist.

Where did you get this from? Read a poll once in a while.

Also I dispute the proportion that only become religious when adult. Most when children or adolescent.

The same can be said of atheists.

[quote[Also it can be no coincidence that they invariably take up the endemic religion of their country which shows one way or another they are a product of their environments.[/quote]

To some degree perhaps, but again, the same can be said for atheists.

 

[oracle25]

Almost all advances in humanity were made by a select few that helped make the lives of everyone better.

Many, if not most of which were religious.

I'd say less than 5% of the world population will actually make a difference in your life.

I would say even less than that. But what does it matter?

 

[MrFungus420]

If athiesm is not a religion, then religion is sanity. Atheism dictates that since there is no God, then I am an animal.

No, atheism is simply a lack of belief in a diety. Nothing more, nothing less.

Since I am an animal, I cannot do wrong,

Only if you ignore society.

since there is no God and since there is no God there is no sin.

True, since a sin is a transgression against some sort of religious law. That is a very different proposition from something being wrong.

Therefore, if I find you in a dark alley and kill you and take your wallet, that's not sin, since it does not exist.

Again, true, it's not a sin. It is, however, wrong.

As a matter of fact, since I'm an animal, it's healthy for me to act as an animal.

If you are not a part of a society, then you would be correct.

Christianity states that there is a God, there is sin, there are laws that govern my behavior.

No more so than any other religion. Each religion has it's own rules and laws. As does each society. Religion is not a requirement for laws.

Which nation would you rather live in, one in which men act as animals, or one in which men act in ways that are governed by law?

As long as we're making extremist statements, I'd rather live in a society where laws weren't necessary because people behaved properly and respected each other.

Alternately, would you rather live in a society where people are only motivated by threat and the promise of reward (heaven and hell), or where people are motivated solely by the recognition of something being the right thing to do?

Why do religious people often seem to think that they are the only ones that can understand the difference between wrong and right?

After all, in Christianity you can do whatever you want, but all you have to do is repent and ask for forgiveness and you are no longer responsible for any reprehensible act that you may have commited. Atheists have no such release from responsibility, they recognize that they are responsible for their actions.

 

[FluffyNinja]

MrFungus420 wrote:

Why do religious people often seem to think that they are the only ones that can understand the difference between wrong and right?

After all, in Christianity you can do whatever you want, but all you have to do is repent and ask for forgiveness and you are no longer responsible for any reprehensible act that you may have commited. Atheists have no such release from responsibility, they recognize that they are responsible for their actions.

You speak stereotypically with many generalizations. Why do many atheists place ALL Christians in the same category? Where is the TRUE intolerance here?

First off, I am a Christian, and I know many non-religious people who are good, rational citizens who obviously know right from wrong. I have never condemned a non-religious person as immoral simply based on his/her religious or political status. It's simply not the Christian way.

Secondly, I feel that your view of Christianity is somewhat incomplete. Not all Christian faiths teach that repentance will suffice for all wrong-doings. On the contrary, the scripture reads "The wages of sin are death." That's fairly easy to understand. True Christians believe that we will always be held responsible for our actions. Repentance does not relieve the conscience of a true Christian.

Lastly, your final comments suggest that ALL Atheists accept responsibility for their actions - again, generalization. Are you speaking on behalf of all atheists? Do you truly believe this statement? Are you saying that no atheist would commit a wrong and fail to live up to it? Absurd. I can readily admit that many "Christians" are bad people. Can you admit as easily that there are as many Christians who are GOOD? I will never place myself upon a pedestal simply because of my Faith. Christ teaches that we should try and lead by example. Christians should be devout but humble in their undertakings.

 

[kal-el]

And athiesm is a religion. Religion is your view of life, and athiesm is that there is no God.

Athesim is the disbelief in a god. Hence, the "a" prefix. If you lack a belief in pink unicorns, you'd be an apinkunicornist.

 

[Upstart]

you're pretty shallow...


I don't see any point you're trying to make. Its just a blunt attack at any atheist on the board as I see it.

No it's not. It's a defense of religion and why religion has value.

 

[128shot]

No it's not. It's a defense of religion and why religion has value.

I highly suggest you read the rest of this thread...


I really don't have to answer, others have for me.

 

[Upstart]

Are you saying that the only reason that you don't go out and rape women or kill people is because you're religious? It's a nonsensical proposition, that atheists are any more or less "moral" than theists. In fact, the atheist divorce rate is significantly lower than any religious group in America, and atheists are not statistically any more likely to commit crimes than theists.

According to the polls, Kerry beat Bush. I really don't trust statistics.

Even if your argument were true, it is a blatant appeal to the consequences of a belief. Even if being religious had advantages, that does not make it necessarily true.

That's true, but it does mean that religion is not stupid.

 

[Engimo]

According to the polls, Kerry beat Bush. I really don't trust statistics.

Polls are not statistics, mister. Statistics factor in every bit of information, while polls extrapolate based on a certain sample size. When we talk about crime rate, we're factoring in every single crime committed, whereas polls involve a few thousand people at most.

 

[Upstart]

I still really don't believe that Christians are more likely to commite crimes. The only reason I don't have sex with people(I'm not married), shoplift, do drive-by paintballings, and other bad stuff is because I'm a Christian, and I cannot allow myself to do that since God says it's wrong.

 

[Engimo]

I still really don't believe that Christians are more likely to commite crimes. The only reason I don't have sex with people(I'm not married), shoplift, do drive-by paintballings, and other bad stuff is because I'm a Christian, and I cannot allow myself to do that since God says it's wrong.

That's great, but no one ever made that claim. All I said was that atheists were not more likely to commit crimes than religious people, not that religious people commit more crimes than atheists.

 

[Upstart]

I realize that you were just refering to religious people, not Christians specificly, but we need to draw a line between religion and Christianity.

When I think of religion, I think of people like the Aztecs, who would capture people to sacrifice to their gods to in affect, pay for their sins.

Christianity is just the opposite. We believe that God came to earth in the form of a man. His name was Jesus. He deliberately allowed Himself to be killed in payment for our sins. We cannot pay for our sins by sacrifices. Since Jesus was sinless, His death would pay for our sins. By trusting in Jesus, we will be forgiven of our sins.

Religion is man's way of trying to earn Heaven, but Christianity is trusting in the Son of God when we have no hope of paying our debt ourselves.

 

[tecoyah]

Religion is man's way of trying to earn Heaven, but Christianity is trusting in the Son of God when we have no hope of paying our debt ourselves.

So....you're saying Christianity is a Cop Out....I know quite a few Christians who would find this statement...offensive, to say the least.

 

[Upstart]

So....you're saying Christianity is a Cop Out....I know quite a few Christians who would find this statement...offensive, to say the least.

Think of it this way:

You get a credit card, but fail to see that you have to pay it back. You go wild and ring up an enormous debt. The credit company sends you a little notice that your going to court.

Your at court, and you find out that you've rung up 7 Million. Bankrupcy is not in the cards. You have no hope of paying the debt back, and as the judge pronounces the sentence, Jesus walks up to you and offers to pay the debt for you, no strings attachted. If you don't accept the offer, the ballif in the back is going hall you off for ever.

You call accepting the offer a cop-out? The only way you can pay off that 7 mil debt is by spending the rest of your life in Club-Fed.

 

[tecoyah]

Think of it this way:

You get a credit card, but fail to see that you have to pay it back. You go wild and ring up an enormous debt. The credit company sends you a little notice that your going to court.

Your at court, and you find out that you've rung up 7 Million. Bankrupcy is not in the cards. You have no hope of paying the debt back, and as the judge pronounces the sentence, Jesus walks up to you and offers to pay the debt for you, no strings attachted. If you don't accept the offer, the ballif in the back is going hall you off for ever.

You call accepting the offer a cop-out? The only way you can pay off that 7 mil debt is by spending the rest of your life in Club-Fed.

That is....quite possibly...the most assenine attempt to explain The Christs' existance I have ever seen.....congratulations on making a complete ass of yourself....heh.

 

[Upstart]

That is....quite possibly...the most assenine attempt to explain The Christs' existance I have ever seen.....congratulations on making a complete ass of yourself....heh.

What's wrong with it? And why are you insulting me when I've not done so to you?

 

[black wolf]

The judge sentences me to 7 Million bucks fine or jail for something that he just came up with at that moment (not revealing his sources), not what I know to have actually spent. Then Jesus, who is a persona of the judge, offers me to pay the debt that he came up with himself. Or else. Sounds like racketeering to me...

 

[Upstart]

The judge sentences me to 7 Million bucks fine or jail for something that he just came up with at that moment (not revealing his sources), not what I know to have actually spent. Then Jesus, who is a persona of the judge, offers me to pay the debt that he came up with himself. Or else. Sounds like racketeering to me...

Dude, Jesus is giving you a way out with no "you must do this then" stuff, you know you've spent it, cause they have the transactions and you see all the plasmas tv's. Would you not take his payment in your place?

 

[black wolf]

Dude, Jesus is giving you a way out with no "you must do this then" stuff, you know you've spent it, cause they have the transactions and you see all the plasmas tv's. Would you not take his payment in your place?

Now, that wouldn't be very nice of me, would it?

The judge is the one who gave me the credit card in the first place - omitting the "payback" part from the contract.
And in the next room (open doors and all) there's another judge calling over to me, saying that it's perfectly o.k. what I did, that he's rally the one who gave me the credit card, and that I can go through his door and start a new life, debt-free with bonus pocket money.
The next one sends me straight to jail just for taking the credit card.
Or for letting someone else take my payment.
And there are about 20,000 more judges to choose from...

And then a guy comes up to me and explains that I had misunderstood a certain judge, and that he meant something totally different, so I'm supposed to go back and ask again - but now the room numbers have changed, and the judges all look the same.

Whew, that one judge's got a mighty big book, he must be the right one. No, wait! Half of his book is just copied from that other guy's book. And he won't show me who wrote the book's chapters anyway, or when they were written. Or even his judging permit. Or where the torn out pages are.

And so on...

Since everyone actually can make of any religion whatever he wishes (or is told to believe), no religion, living or dead, is logically more valid than any other. No religion can prove the existence of their god any more logically sound than any other, just as I can't prove the non-existence of any god (or any other supernatural being).
All sense, memory and current experience is in no way indicating the existence or activity, currently or at any other point in the universe's time frame, of a god or gods.

 

[Upstart]

Now, that wouldn't be very nice of me, would it?

The judge is the one who gave me the credit card in the first place - omitting the "payback" part from the contract.
And in the next room (open doors and all) there's another judge calling over to me, saying that it's perfectly o.k. what I did, that he's rally the one who gave me the credit card, and that I can go through his door and start a new life, debt-free with bonus pocket money.
The next one sends me straight to jail just for taking the credit card.
Or for letting someone else take my payment.
And there are about 20,000 more judges to choose from...

And then a guy comes up to me and explains that I had misunderstood a certain judge, and that he meant something totally different, so I'm supposed to go back and ask again - but now the room numbers have changed, and the judges all look the same.

Whew, that one judge's got a mighty big book, he must be the right one. No, wait! Half of his book is just copied from that other guy's book. And he won't show me who wrote the book's chapters anyway, or when they were written. Or even his judging permit. Or where the torn out pages are.

And so on...

Since everyone actually can make of any religion whatever he wishes (or is told to believe), no religion, living or dead, is logically more valid than any other. No religion can prove the existence of their god any more logically sound than any other, just as I can't prove the non-existence of any god (or any other supernatural being).
All sense, memory and current experience is in no way indicating the existence or activity, currently or at any other point in the universe's time frame, of a god or gods.

I was trying to explain what Christ did, not prove the Bible. I spend my time trying to help you understand, and all you can do is make fun of what I'm saying?

 

[black wolf]

I was trying to explain what Christ did, not prove the Bible. I spend my time trying to help you understand, and all you can do is make fun of what I'm saying?

I know what Christ (allegedly, but that's not the discussion) did. If what we know is correct and complete, he was a pretty good person, not much explanation needed.
But I have no reason to believe that any miracles or other supernatural occurrences were involved.
My opinion is that living an honest, lawful and decent life holds the same value, with or without a faith. Adding faith raises the potential for abuse. While one person (you, me) is strong of mind enough to be resistant to religious abuse and will find comfort with or without faith, his own descendant a few generations later might not be. There lies the danger for future generations.

 

[tecoyah]

My opinion is that living an honest, lawful and decent life holds the same value, with or without a faith. Adding faith raises the potential for abuse. While one person (you, me) is strong of mind enough to be resistant to religious abuse and will find comfort with or without faith, his own descendant a few generations later might not be. There lies the danger for future generations.

Damn....very well stated......Too bad your a guy....and I'm not gay....heh.
The point here is one that has been argued for thousands of years, Anyone who claims they know the mind of God, is either insane, lying, or terribly confused.

 

[MrFungus420]

You speak stereotypically with many generalizations. Why do many atheists place ALL Christians in the same category? Where is the TRUE intolerance here?

I was using generalizations to make a point about the generalizations that Upstart was making. His entire point seemed to be that only Christians are capable of knowing the the difference between good and evil, that only Christians are capable of showing self-restraint, and only Christians are capable of accepting the rules and laws of society.