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Why Religion is Stupid

FinnMacCool

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I know I'm going to get my head bitten off about this but here we go. I've been going to Catholic private schools for 8 years and I can tell you first hand that forcing down religious values on people doesn't do any good, even if they actually believe what their religion teaches. Christianity, and any other religion, is just an excuse; an excuse, and an explanation. This is why twenty different religion arose out of certain cultures, which explains why I would be a Hindu with an absolute believe in about a thousand Gods if I lived in India as opposed to me fanatically believing in a chrstian God here in america. If a bible is the absolute truth then surely the other books must be absolute truths as well? What a vicious cycle of religion! And meanwhile, people go to church and be bored so they can go away and feel better about themselves, as if that makes them anymore morally correct then others. Morality isn't defined by religion but by common human instinct. Religion is a helpful way of dictating this, which is why so many christians commit sins though they fanatically believe in God. If one is willing to simply throw out all this religious vomit, then you can actually see the truth.
 

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For one thing, there can only be one book that is absolutly true. If A + B =C then A + D cannot = C.

Secondly, everyone has a religion. Religion is your view of life. If you are an athiest, that is your religion. What you say simply does not make sense.
 

FinnMacCool

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For one thing, there can only be one book that is absolutly true. If A + B =C then A + D cannot = C.
How do you know that any of them are right? That's my point. They were simply beliefs that were generally accepted and never questioned.
Secondly, everyone has a religion. Religion is your view of life. If you are an athiest, that is your religion. What you say simply does not make sense.
I don't really see how atheism can be considered a religion, at least if we consider atheism in the context of what is generally accepted as religion.
 

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Never the less, two things which are opposite cannot both be true.

And athiesm is a religion. Religion is your view of life, and athiesm is that there is no God.
 

FinnMacCool

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Never the less, two things which are opposite cannot both be true.
Yes. . .your correct. . .

And athiesm is a religion. Religion is your view of life, and athiesm is that there is no God.
Religion can be a million things. If you look it up in the dictionary, you will get six definitions. But in the context of what I am speaking of, that is of Christianitiy and Islam, then we can safely say that Atheism is not a religion.
 

robin

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I cannot rate Prof Richard Dawkins two programme 'The root of all evil' highly enough. He discusses the process of 'non thinking'... otherwise known as 'faith' along with the virus like properties of religion & just how the process of indoctrination ocurrs in children, in much depth.
Children trust adults because they need learned behaviour to survive. At a young age they haven't developed the power of rational thought so they don't have what becomes in effect the immune system to overcome mind virus's.
The programmes are being hosted here.
http://www.debatepolitics.com/showthread.php?t=7485&highlight=dawkins
Well worth watching & they should be shown in all schools as part of the curriculum.
 
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cherokee

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I wouldn’t call is 100% stupid. Yes it has a ton of counter dictions and most groups are full of hate and racism but it can have a few good points.
The Ten Commandments have a couple of good points, don’t steal and don’t kill (unless the person is convicted for murder or rape)
I believe only 3 of the 10 are real laws?

If religion can give meaning to a person life while not interfering with the rights of another then I’m ok by that.

On a lighter note one Sunday I answered a knock at the door I was confronted by a man and woman asking me if I had found Jesus? I replied, No is he lost?
 

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If you head gets bitten off it would quite disgusting. I do not know who would dare. It seems you are honest and more puzzled and questioning, rather than attacking anybody. And one should understand and feel sympathy to, at least, what you said.
I was brought up almost forcefully as an atheist. I was thought to spit at God and I did. All over suddenly I found myself a Christian. I was quite surprised and tried to look at religions and God as a “thinking” man.
I went trough the same observation as you did and asked myself the same questions. I also was thinking about blood of Christians-Jews, and then Jews, Crusades and Inquisition, looked at Evolution and talked to people. Nothing worked. My faith holds me more and more; and I practically gave up.
It would be difficult, impossible for me recall all the process for you, it would boring and unrelated to you and it would a kind of imposing. If I can send a wish you I would say never give up to seek the truth, doubt everything and come to peace with yourself. My favorite place in the Bible is Ecclesiastes. The first time I was reading it as a poem, just literature. One of my friends – a long time Christian – was surprised saying there that was the last place to find God in the Bible. Happens. I would be really upset to see a Christian biting on you head ( I can imagine you experienced that a number of time). But I know it happens. Ecclesiastes describes things which a lot more disturbing. Just a nightmare with no meaning and no way out.
 

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If athiesm is not a religion, then religion is sanity. Atheism dictates that since there is no God, then I am an animal. Since I am an animal, I cannot do wrong, since there is no God and since there is no God there is no sin. Therefore, if I find you in a dark alley and kill you and take your wallet, that's not sin, since it does not exist. As a matter of fact, since I'm an animal, it's healthy for me to act as an animal.

Christianity states that there is a God, there is sin, there are laws that govern my behavior.

Which nation would you rather live in, one in which men act as animals, or one in which men act in ways that are governed by law?
 

FinnMacCool

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If athiesm is not a religion, then religion is sanity. Atheism dictates that since there is no God, then I am an animal. Since I am an animal, I cannot do wrong, since there is no God and since there is no God there is no sin. Therefore, if I find you in a dark alley and kill you and take your wallet, that's not sin, since it does not exist. As a matter of fact, since I'm an animal, it's healthy for me to act as an animal.

Christianity states that there is a God, there is sin, there are laws that govern my behavior.

Which nation would you rather live in, one in which men act as animals, or one in which men act in ways that are governed by law?
Atheism may dismiss God and God's principles but that doesn't mean it makes an atheist devoid of basic moral principles. Atheism is more of an individualists discovery rather then on the whole. If you look at it that way, then I could argue that I myself might not think there is a God but I'm glad religion exists cause otherwise people have no morals. That's the way I used to think. I don't really think religion is such a great thing anymore though. Peope can have morality without having to be dictated on many other things that may or may not be truely moral.

For example, sex is a basic human need. However, according to christianity, sex is evil. That's one thing that most christians don't follow. Only the most devout do but they are, frankly, probably to distasteful for someone to even want to have sex with them.

Not to mention all the attrocities commited in the name of Christianity or other religions. If there are so many evil christians, muslims, hindus, jews, and whatever, why should atheists be more or less evil then they?
 

FinnMacCool

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If you head gets bitten off it would quite disgusting. I do not know who would dare. It seems you are honest and more puzzled and questioning, rather than attacking anybody. And one should understand and feel sympathy to, at least, what you said.
I was brought up almost forcefully as an atheist. I was thought to spit at God and I did. All over suddenly I found myself a Christian. I was quite surprised and tried to look at religions and God as a “thinking” man.
I went trough the same observation as you did and asked myself the same questions. I also was thinking about blood of Christians-Jews, and then Jews, Crusades and Inquisition, looked at Evolution and talked to people. Nothing worked. My faith holds me more and more; and I practically gave up.
It would be difficult, impossible for me recall all the process for you, it would boring and unrelated to you and it would a kind of imposing. If I can send a wish you I would say never give up to seek the truth, doubt everything and come to peace with yourself. My favorite place in the Bible is Ecclesiastes. The first time I was reading it as a poem, just literature. One of my friends – a long time Christian – was surprised saying there that was the last place to find God in the Bible. Happens. I would be really upset to see a Christian biting on you head ( I can imagine you experienced that a number of time). But I know it happens. Ecclesiastes describes things which a lot more disturbing. Just a nightmare with no meaning and no way out.
It's very strange how the world works. I was brought up a Catholic and went to Catholic school for about 8 years until finally, as of this year, I refused to go. A lot of it had to do with my personal atheist belief, which I had harbored in myself for a long time and also my personal philosophy which I didn't know until recently actually had a name, that of 'absurdism.'

Absurdist beliefs are atheist at principle but it pretty much rejects everything else as well. I've been okay with this knowledge, cause I don't feel absurdism neccesarly means that 'life is bad' or 'life is meaningless.' While its true that I believe life is meaningless, it doesn't mean that I don't enjoy life or that I've given up all hopes in humanity. Indeed, it simply means I've put my faith in humanity rather then my faith in the spiritual world. Similiary to existentinalists, I don't really believe there is any 'absolute truth' but I believe science proves many things. IN that regard, I prefer to call myself an absurdist rather then an atheist.

I suggest reading Douglas Adam's 'the Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy'. It's a comedy with an underlining absurdist philosophy. It's not only hilarious but profound as well and it outlines greatly the idea of absurdism.

What is the meaning of life the Universe and everything? it is asked in the book.

The answer (according to a giant computer):42.

What's that supposed to mean? Nothing! Well what it really means is that the universe is irrational and cannot be explained.

I know that was really off topic but whatever.
 
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Upstart

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First of all, sex is not evil. Only when it is had outside of marriage is it wrong.
Think of the sense in this. Think of all the horrible things that come from sex outside of marriage: STD's, broken homes, children aborted or sent to orphanages, poverty, the list goes on.

Secondly, think of when we got all of these problems with drugs, fornication, and teenage delinquency. It happened after the court case in which Christianity was removed from schools. That is the effect of evolution. That is the effect of athiesm.
 

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FinnMacCool said:
It's very strange how the world works. I was brought up a Catholic and went to Catholic school for about 8 years until finally, as of this year, I refused to go. A lot of it had to do with my personal atheist belief, which I had harbored in myself for a long time and also my personal philosophy which I didn't know until recently actually had a name, that of 'absurdism.'

Absurdist beliefs are atheist at principle but it pretty much rejects everything else as well. I've been okay with this knowledge, cause I don't feel absurdism neccesarly means that 'life is bad' or 'life is meaningless.' While its true that I believe life is meaningless, it doesn't mean that I don't enjoy life or that I've given up all hopes in humanity. Indeed, it simply means I've put my faith in humanity rather then my faith in the spiritual world. Similiary to existentinalists, I don't really believe there is any 'absolute truth' but I believe science proves many things. IN that regard, I prefer to call myself an absurdist rather then an atheist.

I suggest reading Douglas Adam's 'the Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy'. It's a comedy with an underlining absurdist philosophy. It's not only hilarious but profound as well and it outlines greatly the idea of absurdism.

What is the meaning of life the Universe and everything? it is asked in the book.

The answer (according to a giant computer):42.

What's that supposed to mean? Nothing! Well what it really means is that the universe is irrational and cannot be explained.

I know that was really off topic but whatever.
The universe is rational. It is created with scientific laws and priciples. And a computer cannot understand questions like, what is the meaning of life.
 

FinnMacCool

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The universe is rational. It is created with scientific laws and priciples. And a computer cannot understand questions like, what is the meaning of life.
Science explains many things but not everything. If you can't explain the rest then the choice is either to invent stuff up, like most religions try to do, or to simply accept the truth that there is no rational explanation for everything.
 

FinnMacCool

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First of all, sex is not evil. Only when it is had outside of marriage is it wrong.Think of the sense in this. Think of all the horrible things that come from sex outside of marriage: STD's, broken homes, children aborted or sent to orphanages, poverty, the list goes on.
You just brought up perhaps seven issues that I could write forever on but I think instead we'll just have to agree to disagree.

Secondly, think of when we got all of these problems with drugs, fornication, and teenage delinquency. It happened after the court case in which Christianity was removed from schools. That is the effect of evolution. That is the effect of athiesm.
Now thats just silly. Things like that have been going on since the beginning of time. Why should we shelter children from the truth about the real world? It can only lead to bad things if we repress our own human nature.
 

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Upstart said:
If athiesm is not a religion, then religion is sanity. Atheism dictates that since there is no God, then I am an animal. Since I am an animal, I cannot do wrong, since there is no God and since there is no God there is no sin. Therefore, if I find you in a dark alley and kill you and take your wallet, that's not sin, since it does not exist. As a matter of fact, since I'm an animal, it's healthy for me to act as an animal.

Christianity states that there is a God, there is sin, there are laws that govern my behavior.

Which nation would you rather live in, one in which men act as animals, or one in which men act in ways that are governed by law?
Are you saying that the only reason that you don't go out and rape women or kill people is because you're religious? It's a nonsensical proposition, that atheists are any more or less "moral" than theists. In fact, the atheist divorce rate is significantly lower than any religious group in America, and atheists are not statistically any more likely to commit crimes than theists.

Even if your argument were true, it is a blatant appeal to the consequences of a belief. Even if being religious had advantages, that does not make it necessarily true.
 

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Upstart said:
If athiesm is not a religion, then religion is sanity. Atheism dictates that since there is no God, then I am an animal. Since I am an animal, I cannot do wrong, since there is no God and since there is no God there is no sin. Therefore, if I find you in a dark alley and kill you and take your wallet, that's not sin, since it does not exist. As a matter of fact, since I'm an animal, it's healthy for me to act as an animal.

Christianity states that there is a God, there is sin, there are laws that govern my behavior.

Which nation would you rather live in, one in which men act as animals, or one in which men act in ways that are governed by law?
So you claim that religious people act more moral than less religious people? Less murders/abortions?
 

FluffyNinja

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FinnMacCool said:
I know I'm going to get my head bitten off about this but here we go. I've been going to Catholic private schools for 8 years and I can tell you first hand that forcing down religious values on people doesn't do any good, even if they actually believe what their religion teaches. Christianity, and any other religion, is just an excuse; an excuse, and an explanation. This is why twenty different religion arose out of certain cultures, which explains why I would be a Hindu with an absolute believe in about a thousand Gods if I lived in India as opposed to me fanatically believing in a chrstian God here in america. If a bible is the absolute truth then surely the other books must be absolute truths as well? What a vicious cycle of religion! And meanwhile, people go to church and be bored so they can go away and feel better about themselves, as if that makes them anymore morally correct then others. Morality isn't defined by religion but by common human instinct. Religion is a helpful way of dictating this, which is why so many christians commit sins though they fanatically believe in God. If one is willing to simply throw out all this religious vomit, then you can actually see the truth.
First, I don't believe that you understand the true philosophical aspect of religion. Religion is much more than simply a morality compass or guide for what is right/wrong, good/evil, etc.

Let me say that I am a Christian. I have never attempted to "push" my sense of values onto others. Nor do I believe that my religion is the "One True Religion." Many non-Christians have the misconception that ALL Christians believe this -- not so. I believe that "SOMETHING" must give us our conscience -- our "moral guide" if you will. It seems strange to me that humans appear to be the only species on a planet of millions of species that has a conscience.

While I agree that there is no way to prove the existence of a supreme being, Science has never offered me proof that there wasn't. Science has never provided me a reason WHY or a concrete explanation of HOW homo sapiens are the only species among millions that developed a conscience.
I hated church as a young lad and even swore that I'd never FORCE my own children to attend. Even now, as and adult with two beautiful children, I catch myself questioning sometimes the validity of my beliefs; but then my heart usually softens and I remember that one aspect of my religion that you, and others like you, seem to miss................. FAITH.

You see, most religions, whether it's Christianity, Hinduism, Islam, or Jedi, are FAITH BASED. And to me, the most important aspect of any religion is that that FAITH in an after-life gives HOPE to millions upon millions of humans. Religion also gives MEANING or PURPOSE to one's life. It gives one at least the "INCENTIVE" to try and do the right thing.

If you understand this, then allow me to ask some simple questions, and remember, I don't try to force my beliefs or guilt trips onto others. I've always wanted to know why someone would go out of their way to try and tear down the belief system of another? What would make a person take joy in removing someone else's HOPE even if that someone else has done nothing to force their beliefs on others? Why does it seem to bother so many atheists that people are happy, have hope, have found meaning in their lives or have a found a non-destructive moral guide by which to live their lives?

God Bless (oops, am I allowed to say the "G-word" here? -- just kidding)
 

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FinnMacCool said:
It can only lead to bad things if we repress our own human nature.

See? See?! That's exactly what I said you believe if you are athiestic.

And I did not say that this only started when Christianity was removed from schools, I said it became a major thing. And it's true.
 

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In answer to the question which is the title of this thread... Religion is based on the process of non thinking otherwise know as 'Faith'.
I cannot rate Prof Richard Dawkins two programmes 'The root of all evil' in highly enough. He discusses the process of 'non thinking'... otherwise known as 'faith' along with the virus like properties of religion & just how the process of indoctrination ocurrs in children, in much depth.
Children trust adults & offspring trust parents because they need learned behaviour to survive. At a young age they haven't developed the power of rational thought so they don't have what becomes in effect the immune system to overcome mind virus's. The child's brain is still largely softwired. Priests gradually programme childrens brains to believe fantasy as fact.
I myself see this indoctrination process as tantamount to a form of non invasive lobotomisation.
They show the holy city. Jeez what a cesspool of tribalism & religious insanity. People taking photgraphs of a freakin wall :shock:
The programmes are being hosted here.
http://www.debatepolitics.com/showthread.php?t=7485&highlight=dawkins
Well worth watching & they should be shown in all schools as part of the curriculum.
 
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FluffyNinja

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robin said:
In answer to the question which is the title of this thread... Religion is based on the process of non thinking otherwise know as 'Faith'.
I cannot rate Prof Richard Dawkins two programmes 'The root of all evil' in highly enough. He discusses the process of 'non thinking'... otherwise known as 'faith' along with the virus like properties of religion & just how the process of indoctrination ocurrs in children, in much depth.
Children trust adults & offspring trust parents because they need learned behaviour to survive. At a young age they haven't developed the power of rational thought so they don't have what becomes in effect the immune system to overcome mind virus's. The child's brain is still largely softwired. Priests gradually programme childrens brains to believe fantasy as fact.
I myself see this indoctrination process as tantamount to a form of non invasive lobotomisation.
They show the holy city. Jeez what a cesspool of tribalism & religious insanity. People taking photgraphs of a freakin wall :shock:
The programmes are being hosted here.
http://www.debatepolitics.com/showthread.php?t=7485&highlight=dawkins
Well worth watching & they should be shown in all schools as part of the curriculum.
The majority of Humans belong to some form of FAITH-BASED religion. Many of these people adopted their regious beliefs during adulthood which would imply that they were not indoctrinated as children. You make it sound as ALL who follow FAITH-BASED religions were dragged kicking and screaming against their wills. Be careful with generalizations and stereotyping.:roll:
 

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FinnMacCool said:
However, according to christianity, sex is evil. QUOTE]

It is 180 degrees opopsite - ECCLESIASTES is followed by my next favorite poem SONG OF SONGS. It will make excited a lot more than "Shake oyur booties".
 

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Upstart said:
See? See?! That's exactly what I said you believe if you are athiestic.

And I did not say that this only started when Christianity was removed from schools, I said it became a major thing. And it's true.

you're pretty shallow...


I don't see any point you're trying to make. Its just a blunt attack at any atheist on the board as I see it.
 

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FluffyNinja said:
The majority of Humans belong to some form of FAITH-BASED religion. Many of these people adopted their regious beliefs during adulthood which would imply that they were not indoctrinated as children. You make it sound as ALL who follow FAITH-BASED religions were dragged kicking and screaming against their wills. Be careful with generalizations and stereotyping.:roll:
Not the majority. The majority are agnostic or aetheist. Also I dispute the proportion that only become religious when adult. Most when children or adolescent. Also it can be no coincidence that they invariably take up the endemic religion of their country which shows one way or another they are a product of their environments. No one said screaming & kicking. In effect I said the opposite didn't I if you think about it.
 

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FinnMacCool said:
I've been okay with this knowledge, cause I don't feel absurdism neccesarly means that 'life is bad' or 'life is meaningless.' What is the meaning of life the Universe and everything? it is asked in the book.
What's that supposed to mean? Nothing! Well what it really means is that the universe is irrational and cannot be explained.
You are following ECCLESIASTIS almost word by word !!! Astonishing!
Why don't you find just 15 minutes and read just 4 pages.
 
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