Why Eve? Why not Adam?

[tosca1]

If A&E shared DNA, then they are either clones or siblings. That gets weird when it comes to procreation. Not to mention 2 people does not make a viable population. We would have gone extinct as a species.

here we go again with you, Gordy.
Obviously, their dna isn't exactly the same since Adam is male and Eve was created female!

Genetic 'Adam' and 'Eve' Uncovered

Both men and women can trace their origins to a man and a woman who lived about 135,000 years ago.

www.livescience.com

 

[tosca1]

They were given an order. Nothing more

VERY WRONG! BIG-TIME!



Genesis 2
15 The Lord God took the man and put him in the Garden of Eden to work it and take care of it.


Genesis 1:28
God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”


It takes knowledge to do those!

 

[tosca1]

If they had knowledge, the eating from the tree of knowledge would have had no effect.

@Elora



You can do an act with the knowledge of doing it, but that doesn't necessarily mean that you understand exactly what you have done.

I'm thinking of criminal offenses. A simple ignorant man kills someone.
He knew he killed a person. But, he doesn't understand if he committed manslaughter or murder of the first degree.

 

[tosca1]

You ignore the fact that Adam and Eve were perfect, with perfect genes...

@Gordy327



Sorry. Nowhere does it says in the Bible that they were created perfect.
The fact that they'd fallen into temptation and ushered in the first sin - which had doomed mankind - is evidence that they were not.

There is only one perfect man: Jesus.

 

[Arlette]

Irrelevant!


furthermore, it's a close-minded statement by Richard Dawkins!

Lol - he of all people should know better after he wrote that infamous GOD DELUSION - he surely was satisfied to have written what was called a "sophomoric book" by many critics -
writing about a subject without really understanding it!




Imagine someone holding forth on biology whose only knowledge of the subject is the Book of British Birds, and you have a rough idea of what it feels like to read Richard Dawkins on theology.

Terry Eagleton · Lunging, Flailing, Mispunching: Richard Dawkins

www.lrb.co.uk

Second, unlike the new atheists, I take scholarship seriously. I have written that The God Delusion made me ashamed to be an atheist and I meant it. Trying to understand how God could need no cause, Christians claim that God exists necessarily. I have taken the effort to try to understand what that means.
Dawkins and company are ignorant of such claims and positively contemptuous of those who even try to understand them, let alone believe them.
Thus, like a first-year undergraduate, he can happily go around asking loudly, "What caused God?" as though he had made some momentous philosophical discovery.
There are a lot of very bright and well informed Christian theologians. We atheists should demand no less.

Michael RUSE: "Dawkins et al.

Michael RUSE: "Dawkins et al. bring us into disrepute" "As a professional philosopher my first question naturally is: "What or who is an atheist?" If you mean someone who absolutely and utterly ...

agnostic.com

See?

Tell me more about being close minded

 

[Daisy]

Adam was created perfect/without sin...he made the choice to disobey/sin and lost the hope of everlasting life for him and all his off-spring...Adam had failed to let love for God and right principle motivate him to be obedient to God above all...like Adam, Jesus was a perfect man, so in harmony with His own justice, Jehovah could accept Jesus’ sacrifice as “a corresponding ransom” to buy back Adam’s descendants....his ransom sacrifice would restore to humans the life prospects that the first Adam had forfeited...

"Nevertheless, death ruled as king from Adam down to Moses, even over those who had not sinned in the same way that Adam transgressed, who bears a resemblance to the one who was to come." Romans 5:14

"For there is one God, and one mediator+ between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus, who gave himself a corresponding ransom for all—this is what is to be witnessed to in its own due time." 1 Timothy 1:5,6

Only 2 perfect men have ever lived on this earth...one disobeyed, the other remained obedient until death...

"The first man is from the earth and made of dust; the second man is from heaven." 1 Corinthians 15:47

 

[Arlette]

VERY WRONG! BIG-TIME!



Genesis 2
15 The Lord God took the man and put him in the Garden of Eden to work it and take care of it.


Genesis 1:28
God blessed them and said to them, “Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish in the sea and the birds in the sky and over every living creature that moves on the ground.”


It takes knowledge to do those!

Your God is just a punchline today. Thoughts and prayers

 

[devildavid]

Adam was created perfect/without sin...he made the choice to disobey/sin and lost the hope of everlasting life for him and all his off-spring...Adam had failed to let love for God and right principle motivate him to be obedient to God above all...like Adam, Jesus was a perfect man, so in harmony with His own justice, Jehovah could accept Jesus’ sacrifice as “a corresponding ransom” to buy back Adam’s descendants....his ransom sacrifice would restore to humans the life prospects that the first Adam had forfeited...

"Nevertheless, death ruled as king from Adam down to Moses, even over those who had not sinned in the same way that Adam transgressed, who bears a resemblance to the one who was to come." Romans 5:14

"For there is one God, and one mediator+ between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus, who gave himself a corresponding ransom for all—this is what is to be witnessed to in its own due time." 1 Timothy 1:5,6

Only 2 perfect men have ever lived on this earth...one disobeyed, the other remained obedient until death...

"The first man is from the earth and made of dust; the second man is from heaven." 1 Corinthians 15:47

It's just a children's story.

 

[Daisy]

It's just a children's story.

The Bible makes it clear...Adam was a historical person...

 

[tosca1]

Tell me more about being close minded

You tell me. You're the one who gave this hypocritical close-minded source!


"What worries me about religion is that it teaches people to be satisfied with not understanding the world we live in."

Richard Dawkins


I say hypocritical - since a philosopher-wanna-be, he's satisfied about writing on a subject he doesn't understand, never mind the world we live in!

 

[tosca1]

Your God is just a punchline today. Thoughts and prayers

Looking like it's you, who's the punchline for several posts now.
Why do you think I'm amused by them!

You're the one who keeps on giving silly "one-liners"...................................... without even realizing what you say APPROPRIATELY APPLIES TO YOU!
It's kinda like watching someone throwing a pie at somebody, but the pie comes back to her................................................. and, she doesn't know enough to duck when it does!


Not to mention giving us a full display of your very, very limited knowledge of the Bible.

 

[tosca1]

Adam was created perfect/without sin...

That's a different context! That's like saying all newborn are created perfect.

However - we can't say he was created in the sense that Jesus is perfect.
Jesus is UNBLEMISHED! Jesus didn't fall into temptation - that's the huge difference here between Him and A&E.
That's what makes Jesus, perfect: SINLESS.
That couldn't apply to Adam and Eve.

 

[tosca1]

...Adam had failed to let love for God and right principle motivate him to be obedient to God above all...

...whereas, that was never a problem for Jesus. He obeyed God all the way to His physical death.

like Adam, Jesus was a perfect man, so in harmony with His own justice,

Where are you getting this?
Nowhere does it says Adam was "so in harmony with his own justice."

We have to ask, what was the motivation for Adam to have disobeyed God?

Jehovah could accept Jesus’ sacrifice as “a corresponding ransom” to buy back Adam’s descendants....his ransom sacrifice would restore to humans the life prospects that the first Adam had forfeited...

"Nevertheless, death ruled as king from Adam down to Moses, even over those who had not sinned in the same way that Adam transgressed, who bears a resemblance to the one who was to come." Romans 5:14

Romans 5
14 Nevertheless death reigned from Adam until Moses, even over those who had not sinned in the likeness of the [j]violation committed by Adam, who is a [k]type of Him who was to come.





Adam's sin was different from the sin of all others who lived after him until the time of Moses and the law. As Paul wrote in the previous verse, sin is not counted against those who do not break God's law (or direct command).
From the time of Adam until the time of Moses, God did not give many direct commands to humanity, at large. In that way, those people were not "lawbreakers."
Still, sin existed. Every person was born into it, born with a sinful nature. People lied, stole, murdered, committed adultery, did what was wrong.
Though they did not sin in a direct violation of God's written command, they still suffered the consequence of Adam's sin, the sin they were born into. They all died. Paul puts it poetically: Death reigned.

Adam's sin was unique, in that sense, since he did break God's direct command.

Now, strangely, Paul describes Adam as a "type" of the one who was to come, meaning Jesus.
He does not mean that Adam and Jesus shared Christ-like qualities. Paul will clarify this comparison in the following verses.

What does Romans 5:14 mean? | BibleRef.com

Nevertheless death reigned from Adam until Moses, even over those who had not sinned in the likeness of the violation committed by Adam, who is a type of Him who was to come. - What is the meaning of Romans 5:14?

www.bibleref.com

Romans 5
15 But [l]the gracious gift is not like the offense. For if by the offense of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, overflow to the many.


In the previous verse, Paul described Adam as a "type" of Christ. This doesn't mean that Adam had Christ-like qualities, but that they were alike in that their choices affected many, many people.
One single action by Adam brought death to all who came after him. Adam broke God's command, bringing both sin and the resulting death into the world.

Now Paul says that the free gift, Jesus' choice, is not like Adam's sin.
What is the free gift? It is the action Christ took by dying in our place for our sin on the cross. The free gift brings salvation from death, rescue from the wrath of God, in judgment on sin.

Adam's action brought death to many people.
Jesus' action brought the grace of God to many people.

This free gift of God's grace brings the opportunity for life, for salvation, to everyone. All who trust in Christ will receive this gift, rather than facing death because of Adam's introduction of sin into the world.

What does Romans 5:15 mean? | BibleRef.com

But the gracious gift is not like the offense. For if by the offense of the one the many died, much more did the grace of God and the gift by the grace of the one Man, Jesus Christ, overflow to the many. - What is the meaning of Romans 5:15?

www.bibleref.com

 

[tosca1]

"For there is one God, and one mediator+ between God and men, a man, Christ Jesus, who gave himself a corresponding ransom for all—this is what is to be witnessed to in its own due time." 1 Timothy 1:5,6

Jesus had to give Himself as the corresponding ransom because of the sin that doomed mankind.
Who had caused that doom? Adam.

Only 2 perfect men have ever lived on this earth...one disobeyed, the other remained obedient until death...

Therefore, the one who disobeyed............................ couldn't have been as perfect as the One who obeyed.

"The first man is from the earth and made of dust; the second man is from heaven." 1 Corinthians 15:47

Adam is made of dust - from this earth.
Jesus is not.




The "resemblance" mentioned, isn't what you think it means.
All those verses you gave show Adam does not share Christ-like qualities.

 

[devildavid]

Jesus had to give Himself as the corresponding ransom because of the sin that doomed mankind.
Who had caused that doom? Adam.






Therefore, the one who disobeyed............................ couldn't have been as perfect as the One who obeyed.





Adam is made of dust - from this earth.
Jesus is not.




The "resemblance" mentioned, isn't what you think it means.
All those verses you gave show Adam does not share Christ-like qualities.

What rule required Jesus to suffer and die as a ransom?

 

[Gordy327]

@Gordy327



Sorry. Nowhere does it says in the Bible that they were created perfect.
The fact that they'd fallen into temptation and ushered in the first sin - which had doomed mankind - is evidence that they were not.

There is only one perfect man: Jesus.

I'm not the one making the claim they were perfect. The story itself is just a myth anyway.

 

[Gordy327]

The Bible makes it clear...Adam was a historical person...

By that Logic, Harry Potter is a real person because a book simply says so.

 

[Gordy327]

here we go again with you, Gordy.
Obviously, their dna isn't exactly the same since Adam is male and Eve was created female!

Genetic 'Adam' and 'Eve' Uncovered

Both men and women can trace their origins to a man and a woman who lived about 135,000 years ago.

www.livescience.com

It doesn't have to be exactly the same. It would still be close enough for genetic abnormalities or recessive traits to emerge. It would be like siblings reproducing together.

 

[HK.227]

What a convoluted narrative!

F O C U S.

We're talking about GENESIS 3 - from the BIBLE!
That doesn't address the OP.

Sure it does.
There once was a story. Then someone came along who didn't like the old story. So they made a new story and reinterpreted elements of the old story to fit with the new story. The end.

 

[tosca1]

I'm not the one making the claim they were perfect. The story itself is just a myth anyway.

I gave you notice so that you'd see my response to Elora. That's all.
I butted into the discussion going on between you two.

 

[tosca1]

It doesn't have to be exactly the same. It would still be close enough for genetic abnormalities or recessive traits to emerge. It would be like siblings reproducing together.

Lol - did you read the article I gave you? About dna?

 

[tosca1]

Sure it does.
There once was a story. Then someone came along who didn't like the old story. So they made a new story and reinterpreted elements of the old story to fit with the new story. The end.

Personal opinions don't count in a serious discussion, you know. Unless you back it up with something credible.
Well - I don't want to waste time on silly, piddly opinions.....

...................bye for now.

 

[Gordy327]

Lol - did you read the article I gave you? About dna?

I am familiar with DNA. I am also familiar with potential genetic issues that can arise from relations with close genetic couples.

 

[Gordy327]

I gave you notice so that you'd see my response to Elora. That's all.
I butted into the discussion going on between you two.

Yes, I realize that. No worries though. I just wanted to make my position clear.

 

[HK.227]

Personal opinions don't count in a serious discussion, you know. Unless you back it up with something credible.
Well - I don't want to waste time on silly, piddly opinions.....

...................bye for now.

That's the whole point, sweetie. The book you consider uniquely perfect is barely 1700 years old, and the editing was overseen by a pagan with political issues to consider.
Serious discussion takes that into consideration. Serious discussion also takes into account older versions of texts which the current version was based on. What people believed before and how faith has changed. What the common roots are, how the whole changing belief systems thing works, and what we can learn from that about ourselves as a species.

Never mind. While ignorance is excusable, the way you address people you disagree with clearly suggests lack of manners. However, people's time is a valuable commodity, and since you are clearly never going to give me anything worthwhile in return for mine...
/ignored.