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Why Create and Punish An Imperfect Being?

The Baron said:
I do. I think God has a plan for all of us and I'm still trying to find mine.
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That brings up another interesting conversation. Should we be trying to FIND God's plan for us, or will it be revealed to us by our future actions and our future encounters in life?
 
RabidAlpaca said:
The Bible very clearly states that we don't bear the sins of our ancestors.
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Nor are we held accountable for the sins of others.

And at the Fall, there was a lot going on. When sin entered the world it changed everything, including our own nature in which we now all have a propensity to sin.
RabidAlpaca said:

Ezekiel 18:
The soul who sins is the one who will die. The son will not share the guilt of the father, nor will the father share the guilt of the son. The righteousness of the righteous man will be credited to him, and the wickedness of the wicked will be charged against him.
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And this verse is why we have Article 3, Section 3 of our Constitution:
“The Congress shall have power to declare the punishment of treason, but no attainder [capital punishment] of treason shall work corruption of blood or forfeiture except during the life of the person attainted.”
RabidAlpaca said:
You throw that all out with your crazy and sadistic theory that god is a masochistic asshole who will punish billions for the actions of 2 people.
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It's not my theory.
RabidAlpaca said:
Can I safely assume you'd have no issue if the US government locked you up for the rest of your life in a prison cell for a crime someone else committed? He's your fellow human, so you're responsible for his actions right?
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See Article 3, Section 3 above.

Also, maybe this will help.
 
donhughesmusic said:
That brings up another interesting conversation. Should we be trying to FIND God's plan for us, or will it be revealed to us by our future actions and our future encounters in life?
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If there is a set plan, what's the point in living? I don't believe there is an individual plan for each human being...that would forfeit free will...

Consider how man is made. The Scriptures say that God created man in God’s own image, that is, in God’s likeness. Thus, humans have the ability to reflect God’s qualities. (Genesis 1:26) Humans have been given the gift of free will and can choose to love God and stick to him by doing what is right in his eyes. (Deuteronomy 30:19, 20) If God coerced people into following a certain course, would he not be nullifying the gift of free will? Why, humans would be reduced to nothing more than machines, doing exactly what they were programmed to do! The same would be true if fate, or Kismet, dictated what we do and everything that happens to us. How glad we can be that God dignifies us by allowing us to choose our own course!
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2014483
 
The Baron said:
Adam & Eve did not have a fallen nature. They were free not to sin. This is no longer an option.
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Apparently it's always been an option... since they sinned.
 
quip said:
Why didn't He simply instill loyalty into His creation?
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Speaking of which, what's the difference between freewill and the basic will?
 
quip said:
Why didn't He simply instill loyalty into His creation?
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Elora said:
If God coerced people into following a certain course, would he not be nullifying the gift of free will? Why, humans would be reduced to nothing more than machines, doing exactly what they were programmed to do! The same would be true if fate, or Kismet, dictated what we do and everything that happens to us. How glad we can be that God dignifies us by allowing us to choose our own course!
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2014483
Click to expand...
 
Elora said:
If there is a set plan, what's the point in living? I don't believe there is an individual plan for each human being...that would forfeit free will...

Consider how man is made. The Scriptures say that God created man in God’s own image, that is, in God’s likeness. Thus, humans have the ability to reflect God’s qualities. (Genesis 1:26) Humans have been given the gift of free will and can choose to love God and stick to him by doing what is right in his eyes. (Deuteronomy 30:19, 20) If God coerced people into following a certain course, would he not be nullifying the gift of free will? Why, humans would be reduced to nothing more than machines, doing exactly what they were programmed to do! The same would be true if fate, or Kismet, dictated what we do and everything that happens to us. How glad we can be that God dignifies us by allowing us to choose our own course!
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2014483
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Not if we're forever damned for using our freewill to stray from an undisclosed, narrow path.
I'd rather exist as an automaton.
 
RabidAlpaca said:
The Bible very clearly states that we don't bear the sins of our ancestors.

Ezekiel 18:
The soul who sins is the one who will die. The son will not share the guilt of the father, nor will the father share the guilt of the son. The righteousness of the righteous man will be credited to him, and the wickedness of the wicked will be charged against him.

You throw that all out with your crazy and sadistic theory that god is a masochistic asshole who will punish billions for the actions of 2 people. Can I safely assume you'd have no issue if the US government locked you up for the rest of your life in a prison cell for a crime someone else committed? He's your fellow human, so you're responsible for his actions right?
Click to expand...
Exodus 20:5 "For I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me.

This though refers to this life, not the life after.
 
The Baron said:
Nor are we held accountable for the sins of others.

And at the Fall, there was a lot going on. When sin entered the world it changed everything, including our own nature in which we now all have a propensity to sin.

And this verse is why we have Article 3, Section 3 of our Constitution:
“The Congress shall have power to declare the punishment of treason, but no attainder [capital punishment] of treason shall work corruption of blood or forfeiture except during the life of the person attainted.”

It's not my theory.

See Article 3, Section 3 above.

Also, maybe this will help.
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It's these perverted and ridiculous view points that we all need to be punished for the actions of others that greatly contribute to the death of your religion. More and more people are rejecting this hateful ideology and deciding to just live their lives to be happy instead of being vindictive assholes like many Christians have become. I'm so glad to see your churches getting emptier and emptier every year. I'm not responsible for anyone else's actions but my own.

Exquisitor said:
Exodus 20:5 "For I the Lord thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them that hate me.

This though refers to this life, not the life after.
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Yes, the bible is chock full of contradictions.
 
quip said:
Not if we're forever damned for using our freewill to stray from an undisclosed, narrow path.
I'd rather exist as an automaton.
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Choices have consequences...that's a fact...
 
Jacksprat said:
Why does God have human gender?
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Is God Male or Female?

Just as assigning human features to God is not to be understood literally, use of the masculine gender to describe God should not be taken literally. Gender distinction is unique to physical creatures and is a linguistic device that reflects the limitations of human language to capture fully the essence of Almighty God, Jehovah.

The Bible’s use of the designation “Father” helps us to understand that our Creator can be compared to a loving, protective, and caring human father. (Matthew 6:9) This does not mean that we are to view God, or even other spirit creatures in heaven, as being male or female. Gender, in the sense of sex, is not a characteristic of their nature. Interestingly, the Bible indicates that those who are called to be joint heirs with Christ in his heavenly Kingdom do not expect to retain their human gender when they are glorified as spirit sons of God. The apostle Paul reminded them that “there is neither male nor female” within their ranks when they become glorified spirit sons of God. They are also figuratively described as “the bride” of the Lamb, Jesus Christ. All of this illustrates how human features as ascribed to God—as well as to his only-begotten Son, Jesus, and other spirit creatures—should not be understood literally.—Galatians 3:26, 28; Revelation 21:9; 1 John 3:1, 2.

Correctly understanding the male role, Bible writers employed the masculine gender when referring to God. They saw in man, properly fulfilling his role, an appropriate reflection of Jehovah’s loving, fatherly interest in his earthly children.—Malachi 3:17; Matthew 5:45; Luke 11:11-13.
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/102008370?q=God+is+masculine&p=sen
 
donhughesmusic said:
Why would God punish you for sins that he himself gave you the ability to do knowing he was creating an imperfect being? Practically, wouldn't he have not given you the ability to sin? Isn't it the same thing as a carpenter knowingly building a faulty house, then blaming the home buyers for the house collapsing?
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Very good point! (y)(y)
 
RabidAlpaca said:
It's these perverted and ridiculous view points that we all need to be punished for the actions of others that greatly contribute to the death of your religion.
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Have you ever sinned?

Yes?

Then you will be held accountable for your actions. I wouldn't worry about people that lived a thousands of years ago.
RabidAlpaca said:
More and more people are rejecting this hateful ideology and deciding to just live their lives to be happy instead of being vindictive assholes like many Christians have become.
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Vindictive assholes?

How so?
RabidAlpaca said:
I'm so glad to see your churches getting emptier and emptier every year. I'm not responsible for anyone else's actions but my own.
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At least we agree on something.
RabidAlpaca said:
Yes, the bible is chock full of contradictions.
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No, it's not.
 
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