Who Wants To Commit Genocide?

[Absentglare]

To note: it is not accurate to say there was *never a geographic country called Israel. It is simply that such was destroyed millenia prior to the conclusion of WWI and the indigenous population was largely scattered across the Mediterranean and into Europe towards the end of the First Century AD.

Following WW II, the UN did indeed create a partition that divided the lands between a new state of Israel and new Arab states - and Israel accepted this partition and the Arabs didn't, and invaded.

Yes; the UN decided to Israel should take half the land. That the Arabs would lose half the land. This happened because the West didn’t want to accept Jewish WW2 refugees so they gave them someone else’s land in the Middle East.

Naturally the Arabs didn’t like the deal.

 

[NolanVoyd]

This is incorrect.

No, its correct.

International aid groups, the UN, even israeli holocust scholars acknowledge the fact .

Israel is not committing a genocide,

the denial of reality is pathetic.

which is why those who accuse Israel of doing so reliably have to change their definitions of "Genocide" to something like "Urban Combat".

False.

Israel committing genocide in Gaza, world's leading experts say

The world's leading association of genocide scholars cited several actions by Israel, including attacks on the healthcare sector and the killing of children.

www.bbc.com

“I’m a Genocide Scholar. I Know It When I See It”: Prof. Omer Bartov on the Growing Consensus on Gaza​

In the meantime:

Israel has the capability to commit genocide if it wanted to, but not the intent.

Israel is actively doing it.

 

[ajn678]

Just because you SAY it’s not a fact changes nothing. There were “Palestinian territories” which is a description of the land on which the Palestinians were squatting.
I suggest you do some reading and learn some history of the region.

I guarantee I know vastly more about the region than you and your lineage combined will ever know.

 

[ajn678]

All blacks are Antifa.
All illegals are rapists.
All Haitians eat cats and dogs.
All Jews are part of the Globalist movement.
All Drag Queens groom kids.
All gay people suffer from mental illness.
All women cackle. Especially black ones.
All Canadians love eating poutine.

I am running out of ideas, got any more tropes you want to present us??

All of the Canadian ones are true.

 

[Ethel2]

I guarantee I know vastly more about the region than you and your lineage combined will ever know.

Oh-then I’ll certainly defer to your obviously superior intellect

 

[multivita-man]

Would you bet your life it didn’t happen?

I'm not saying that there were zero atrocities. I mean it's obvious Hamas killed a lot of people, including civilians. Only pointing out that the events of October 7th, 2023 were exaggerated and used as a pretext to commit atrocities on a much larger scale.

Also pointing out that Israel is a rogue state and completely unbound by international law.

 

[cpwill]

I wasn’t the one to split the hair - it was @Ethel2 who was saying nations aren’t countries as early as post 23…and then into the 40’s posts….in case you didn’t see them.

That's fair. I did not go back through the full thread

 

[Felis Leo]

Israel. By a country mile.

The overwhelming majority of Israelis believe there are no innocents in Gaza. You would have to go back in time and conduct polling Nazi Germany and ask about Jews and Slavs, or Imperial Japan and ask about Chinese or Koreans to find that level of depraved indifference in a civilian population against the people their country has invaded. Perhaps similar opinion polls were conducted in the United States during the mid to late 1800s among white Americans to gather people's views on how American Indians were treated would have yielded similar results.

 

[The Mark]

None of them. No one actually ever *owns* land. Land ownership is always transitory. When I say there never was a Palestine I mean there never was a COUNTRY called Palestine.

Yeah, but...literally all the countries only exist because a bunch of people banded together and decided they did. Usually with some violence involved.

 

[jmotivator]

The war in Gaza isn't a genocide. A high estimates of deaths, both civilian and militia, in Gaza is 70,000, with about half of that being military aged men.

70,000 of a population of 2.2 million. That compared to 66% of European Jews that died in the Holocaust.

If Israel wanted a genocide they wouldn't drop leaflets on areas announcing future bombings. If Hamas didn't want dead civilians they would force people to stay in buildings targeted by Israel.

"Genocide" isn't even the right word, it's just a lazy way to speak. The Nazis actually thought they were cleaning the genetic code of Europe, so they were specifically committing genocide. Hamas' declared desire to kill all Jews is aspirin to commit genocide. "Ethnic Cleaning" might come closer if you assume that Israel is indiscriminately targeting civilians... which they aren't.

Nobody is going to care about Gaza now that they can't throw baseless accusations at Israel the for the same reason that the Jew haters can't work up any care for the Ethnic cleansing in Nigeria because the perpetrators are Muslim and the victims are Christians. They don't care is they can't make Jews the villains.

 

[Tigerace117]

The war in Gaza isn't a genocide. A high estimates of deaths, both civilian and militia, in Gaza is 70,000, with about half of that being military aged men.

70,000 of a population of 2.2 million. That compared to 66% of European Jews that died in the Holocaust.

If Israel wanted a genocide they wouldn't drop leaflets on areas announcing future bombings. If Hamas didn't want dead civilians they would force people to stay in buildings targeted by Israel.

"Genocide" isn't even the right word, it's just a lazy way to speak. The Nazis actually thought they were cleaning the genetic code of Europe, so they were specifically committing genocide. Hamas' declared desire to kill all Jews is aspirin to commit genocide. "Ethnic Cleaning" might come closer if you assume that Israel is indiscriminately targeting civilians... which they aren't.

Nobody is going to care about Gaza now that they can't throw baseless accusations at Israel the for the same reason that the Jew haters can't work up any care for the Ethnic cleansing in Nigeria because the perpetrators are Muslim and the victims are Christians. They don't care is they can't make Jews the villains.

Fun fact: going “some of the people we murdered were between the ages of 18 and 60!” is not, in fact, an excuse for genocide.

Israel absolutely carried out indiscriminate air strikes, so your narrative fails on that level as well.

The seething hatred American conservatives have for Muslims, as it turns out, doesn’t negate international law.

 

[jmotivator]

Fun fact: going “some of the people we murdered were between the ages of 18 and 60!” is not, in fact, an excuse for genocide.

Never said it was, nor is what was happening in Gaza a Genocide.

What I'm saying by pointing out the high number of military aged men in the Gaza casualty list is that the number of civilian casualties, already average to low for urban combat, is inflated by counting militants among the civilian casualties.

Israel absolutely carried out indiscriminate air strikes, so your narrative fails on that level as well.

False. Israel dropped leaflets on bombing targets, and selected bombing targets for the warfighting resources contained withing, or under the structure. The reason there were civilians in those building at all was because Hamas demanded they stay and die there.

The seething hatred American conservatives have for Muslims, as it turns out, doesn’t negate international law.

LOL. Your casual bigotry that assumes that all Muslims are indistinguishable from Hamas terrorists is astounding...

 

[Tigerace117]

Never said it was, nor is what was happening in Gaza a Genocide.

What I'm saying by pointing out the high number of military aged men in the Gaza casualty list is that the number of civilian casualties, already average to low for urban combat, is inflated by counting militants among the civilian casualties.



False. Israel dropped leaflets on bombing targets, and selected bombing targets for the warfighting resources contained withing, or under the structure. The reason there were civilians in those building at all was because Hamas demanded they stay and die there.



LOL. Your casual bigotry that assumes that all Muslims are indistinguishable from Hamas terrorists is astounding...

The ICC clearly disagrees, seeing as Netanyahu is a wanted war criminal.

Someone being between the ages of 18 and 60 doesn’t make them a “militant”, in case you hadn’t noticed. Even if the “true” death toll was only half of what is being reported Israel still would have killed tens of thousands of innocent civilians.

Israel’s “warfighters” make extensive use of human shields, as they have freely admitted, so the pretense they are worried about not harming civilians is laughable.

American conservatives and the “Jewish state” routinely call Palestinian civilians “Hamas” in order to “excuse” their murder. We’ve seen it hundreds of times at this point.

Y’all aren’t fooling anyone.

 

[jmotivator]

The ICC clearly disagrees, seeing as Netanyahu is a wanted war criminal.

The ICC is a toothless group of Antisemitic goons.

Someone being between the ages of 18 and 60 doesn’t make them a “militant”, in case you hadn’t noticed. Even if the “true” death toll was only half of what is being reported Israel still would have killed tens of thousands of innocent civilians.

MALES between the ages of 18 and 49 are militant age, yes. Why do you suppose that 50% of the casualties of "civilians" are the population that Hamas recruits to fight in their militias?

For a population where about half are under the age of 18 and over half of the population is female, it sure is odd that 50% of the "civilian" deaths reported by Hamas are from the demographic actually fighting the war.

Israel’s “warfighters” make extensive use of human shields, as they have freely admitted, so the pretense they are worried about not harming civilians is laughable.

Nope. That is HAMAS that does that. They build their tunnels under civilian buildings and force them to stay in the buildings and be bombed.

Here's the NATO report produced during the Obama administration that details Hamas' use of human shields.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

American conservatives and the “Jewish state” routinely call Palestinian civilians “Hamas” in order to “excuse” their murder. We’ve seen it hundreds of times at this point.

Nope We call Hamas Hamas and civilians civilians. We only question who is and isn't Hamas because Hamas isn't a regular army and doesn't wear uniforms, a requirement by the GC meant to specifically allow combatants to differentiate civilians from combatants. They don't wear uniforms in the hopes that they get civilians killed. It's their MO.

Y’all aren’t fooling anyone.

Just stating facts.

 

[cpwill]

Israel. By a country mile.

Were that true, Israel would not have instantly agreed to the ceasefire, and hit the streets in mass celebration of the return of the hostages and ending of major combat operations. If Israel actually intended to commit Genocide, they would have instead pursued Genocide.

Respectfully, this hypothesis was tested, and utterly failed. "Genocide" does not mean "War I Don't Like" or "War In Which Civilians Die".

 

[NolanVoyd]

What I'm saying by pointing out the high number of military aged men in the Gaza casualty list is that the number of civilian casualties, already average to low for urban combat, is inflated by counting militants among the civilian casualties.

Thats false, the civilian casualties are EXTREMELY high. Even for urban combat.

Based on a variety of sources, including leaked Israeli military intelligence, reports from human rights groups, and academic studies, the civilian casualty rate in Gaza is extremely high, with some analyses suggesting civilians constitute 80% or more of the total deaths. This rate is considered exceptionally high even when compared to modern urban combat.

Google Search

Revealed: Israeli military’s own data indicates civilian death rate of 83% in Gaza war​

Revealed: Israeli military’s own data indicates civilian death rate of 83% in Gaza war

Figures from classified IDF database listed 8,900 named fighters as dead or probably dead in May, as overall death toll reached 53,000

www.theguardian.com

 

[Sweden]

Irrelevant. There is a Palestine today.

Can you define its borders and count its "citizens"?

 

[Allan]

Can you define its borders and count its "citizens"?

The borders are defined.

 

[NolanVoyd]

There is no Palestine. There never was a Palestine.

1869




1895

 

[Sweden]

The borders are defined.

Who by? What are they? Describe them please.

 

[Felis Leo]

Were that true, Israel would not have instantly agreed to the ceasefire, and hit the streets in mass celebration of the return of the hostages and ending of major combat operations. If Israel actually intended to commit Genocide, they would have instead pursued Genocide.

Israel is continuing military operations and cutting agreed upon aid into Gaza. After closing down the GHF, the figleaf mercenary organization they controlled.

Respectfully, this hypothesis was tested, and utterly failed. "Genocide" does not mean "War I Don't Like" or "War In Which Civilians Die".

Did I say genocide means a war in which civilians die? Genocide refers to the acts typically though not always by a state intended to kill a distinct people, in whole or in part.

Cutting off food and medical supplies to civilians and purposefully targeting infrastructure including nearly every hospital in Gaza is what makes Israel genocidal. Bombing entire neighborhoods killing and wounding hundreds on the pretext that there was a terrorist somewhere in their midst without evidence makes Israel genocidal. Gunning down starving people lining up for food aid makes Israel genocidal. Refusing to allow foreign journalists and humanitarian aid organizations into Gaza while the mass-murder campaign was ongoing, even in the "safe" zones makes Israel genocidal. All while Israeli government leaders up to and including their Prime Minister calling the Palestinians of Gaza "Amalek," the tribe of people the Israelites exterminated down to the last child in the Bible evidences their genocidal intent.

 

[Tigerace117]

The ICC is a toothless group of Antisemitic goons.



MALES between the ages of 18 and 49 are militant age, yes. Why do you suppose that 50% of the casualties of "civilians" are the population that Hamas recruits to fight in their militias?

For a population where about half are under the age of 18 and over half of the population is female, it sure is odd that 50% of the "civilian" deaths reported by Hamas are from the demographic actually fighting the war.


Nope. That is HAMAS that does that. They build their tunnels under civilian buildings and force them to stay in the buildings and be bombed.

Here's the NATO report produced during the Obama administration that details Hamas' use of human shields.

https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf

Nope We call Hamas Hamas and civilians civilians. We only question who is and isn't Hamas because Hamas isn't a regular army and doesn't wear uniforms, a requirement by the GC meant to specifically allow combatants to differentiate civilians from combatants. They don't wear uniforms in the hopes that they get civilians killed. It's their MO.



Just stating facts.

Thanks for demonstrating why the term “anti-semitism” has no meaning. I get that America is inherently horrified by any organization that would dare try and hold it and its pals accountable for the atrocities they continue to commit, but blind denial doesn’t change the facts.

…..because there are a lot of young people in Gaza, because there are a lot of people in the world between the ages of eighteen and fifty, and because Israel’s attacks have been utterly indiscriminate?

But way to demonstrate how Palestinian civilians are regularly labeled “Hamas” without a shred of evidence.

Uh….no, multiple sources on both sides of the conflict have confirmed Israel uses human shields as a matter of policy

How Israel Uses Palestinian Detainees as Human Shields

An investigation into an Israeli tactic in Gaza, and what it reveals about the nature of the war there.

www.nytimes.com

How Israel’s Army Uses Palestinians as Human Shields in Gaza (Published 2024)

Israeli soldiers and Palestinian former detainees say troops have regularly forced captured Gazans to carry out life-threatening tasks, including inside Hamas tunnels.

www.nytimes.com

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2024/11/03/israel-gaza-human-shields-palestinians-idf/

https://www.cnn.com/2024/10/24/middleeast/palestinians-human-shields-israel-military-gaza-intl/index.html

Israeli use of human shields in Gaza was systematic, soldiers and former detainees tell the AP

Several Palestinians and Israeli soldiers say troops are systematically forcing Palestinians to act as human shields in Gaza, sending them into buildings and tunnels to check for bombs and gunmen.

apnews.com

Nope, you call anyone Israel kills “Hamas”. You literally do so in this post.

And pretending America gives a shit about the Geneva Convention is ****ing hilarious.

 

[Allan]

Who by?

By the 157 countries that recognize Palestine.

 

[Sweden]

By the 157 countries that recognize Palestine.

Let's start withe the UK. Starner's government has recognised 'Palestine' but has NOT defined ts borders. The 'recognition' was a meaningless gesture to appease Labour's Muslim voters.

 

[iliveonramen]

Palestinians don't support Hamas...Hamas took over the Gaza strip in 2007 using violence and used violence after the ceasefire to assert continued control.