White Co, TN Offers 30 Days off For B/C Fix

[calamity]

lol...a plan I can definitely get behind that the ALCU is up in arms about.

Tennessee County Offers Inmates Shorter Sentences If They Get A Vasectomy | HuffPost

A jail in White County, Tennessee, is offering reduced sentences to inmates who agree to a vasectomy or birth control implant, ABC 15 reported Wednesday.

Inmates who volunteer are rewarded with 30 days less jail time under an order signed in May by Judge Sam Benningfield. The judge told ABC 15 he hopes the procedures, provided for free by the Tennessee Department of Health, will reduce the number of repeat offenders who can’t afford child support.

So far, 32 women have gotten the implant, and 38 men are waiting to have their vasectomies.

 

[SocialD]

lol...a plan I can definitely get behind that the ALCU is up in arms about.

Tennessee County Offers Inmates Shorter Sentences If They Get A Vasectomy | HuffPost

yea the ACLU says its unconstitutional but this is voluntary its not compulsory.

 

[Simon W. Moon]

yea the ACLU says its unconstitutional but this is voluntary its not compulsory.

What grounds did they give for it being unConstitutional?

 

[katzgar]

lol...a plan I can definitely get behind that the ALCU is up in arms about.

Tennessee County Offers Inmates Shorter Sentences If They Get A Vasectomy | HuffPost

now we know how OJ got out

 

[SocialD]

What grounds did they give for it being unConstitutional?

that article just says
'In Tennessee, the inmates are voluntarily undergoing the procedure ― but the American Civil Liberties Union said the program still violates the Constitution.'

no reason given.

 

[Simon W. Moon]

that article just says
'In Tennessee, the inmates are voluntarily undergoing the procedure ― but the American Civil Liberties Union said the program still violates the Constitution.'
no reason given.

Maybe the voluntariness of it is irrelevant to their objections

 

[justabubba]

What grounds did they give for it being unConstitutional?

could this be a form of coercion
where the captive audience remains captive for a longer period if they refuse to agree to the procedure by being non-compliant

 

[Simon W. Moon]

could this be a form of coercion
where the captive audience remains captive for a longer period if they refuse to agree to the procedure by being non-compliant

fair enough

 

[justabubba]

fair enough

my personal view is this alternative results in the greater good for the incarcerated person and especially for society
so, this is one time i cannot support the ACLU's actions
this is one small step toward breaking the cycle of poverty

 

[RabidAlpaca]

lol...a plan I can definitely get behind that the ALCU is up in arms about.

yea the ACLU says its unconstitutional but this is voluntary its not compulsory.

How can something be "voluntary" if it's accompanied with "Do what we tell you or we'll keep you locked in a cage longer."?

If I locked you in my basement until you let me give you a vasectomy would you still think it's voluntary?

 

[apdst]

What grounds did they give for it being unConstitutional?

The ACLU isn't interested in actually defending The Comstitution. It's all about pushing a political agenda.

 

[SenorXm/Sirius]

Birth Control, on the tax payers dime? Cons should be up and arms 100% against this.

 

[calamity]

How can something be "voluntary" if it's accompanied with "Do what we tell you or we'll keep you locked in a cage longer."?

If I locked you in my basement until you let me give you a vasectomy would you still think it's voluntary?

That not what they are doing. The prisoners are being given a deal which lets them out sooner than their original sentence called for. It's a bit like parole in that the state releases a prisoner before his sentence is complete, but he forfeits a host of constitutional protections to get early release.

 

[calamity]

my personal view is this alternative results in the greater good for the incarcerated person and especially for society
so, this is one time i cannot support the ACLU's actions
this is one small step toward breaking the cycle of poverty

It's strictly voluntary too. The prisoner can turn down the deal, and he still gets out in 30 days as original sentence called for. ACLU will lose this case.

 

[RabidAlpaca]

That not what they are doing. The prisoners are being given a deal which lets them out sooner than their original sentence called for. It's a bit like parole in that the state releases a prisoner before his sentence is complete, but he forfeits a host of constitutional protections to get early release.

They're coercing vulnerable people they have locked in a cage and are desperate into getting sterilized by the state. It's sick and certainly can not be called voluntary. Voluntary would be offering them the procedure for free after they get out.

 

[vegas giants]

That not what they are doing. The prisoners are being given a deal which lets them out sooner than their original sentence called for. It's a bit like parole in that the state releases a prisoner before his sentence is complete, but he forfeits a host of constitutional protections to get early release.

How about some other deals

Early release for

Acceptance of religious vows
Tattoos on the forehead labeling their crimes
Agreeing to beatings for their crimes

 

[Vox]

Let the ACLU take this to the Trump Supreme Court.

Make my day.

If ONLY we could get this going in Chicago, Detroit and other big cities.

It could be worked into the plea bargaining system.

:mrgreen:

 

[calamity]

They're coercing vulnerable people they have locked in a cage and are desperate into getting sterilized by the state. It's sick and certainly can not be called voluntary. Voluntary would be offering them the procedure for free after they get out.

lol...they are giving them 30 days off their original sentence. You're strawmanning the **** out of this, RA.

 

[calamity]

How about some other deals

Early release for

Acceptance of religious vows
Tattoos on the forehead labeling their crimes
Agreeing to beatings for their crimes

Early release: consent to search and seizure, report to parole officer, drug testing on demand, no internet, receive mental health counseling, go to AA, stay out of paces that serve alcohol, no guns...the list of things prisoners seeking early release agree to do is already pretty long.

 

[RabidAlpaca]

lol...they are giving them 30 days off their original sentence. You're strawmanning the **** out of this, RA.

How can I strawman your statement about it being voluntary when you said it was voluntary? Negotiating with someone you have in a cage is not a situation where free will can exist for the captive. We're not talking about checking in with a parole officer, we're talking about sterilization of vulnerable people by the government.

It's strictly voluntary too. The prisoner can turn down the deal, and he still gets out in 30 days as original sentence called for. ACLU will lose this case.

 

[vegas giants]

Early release: consent to search and seizure, report to parole officer, drug testing on demand, no internet, receive mental health counseling, go to AA, stay out of paces that serve alcohol, no guns...the list of things prisoners seeking early release agree to do is already pretty long.

So then my list is ok too. Right?

 

[calamity]

How can I strawman your statement about it being voluntary when you said it was voluntary? Negotiating with someone you have in a cage is not a situation where free will can exist for the captive.

Few strawmen are more obvious that this:

How can something be "voluntary" if it's accompanied with "Do what we tell you or we'll keep you locked in a cage longer."?

If I locked you in my basement until you let me give you a vasectomy would you still think it's voluntary?

And, this is pretty close to taking second place.

They're coercing vulnerable people they have locked in a cage and are desperate into getting sterilized by the state. It's sick and certainly can not be called voluntary. Voluntary would be offering them the procedure for free after they get out.

No one in county jail for a 90 to 180 day sentence is "locked in a cage" and desperate. Co lock-up is a freaking cake walk. It's usually an open-floor dormitory environment with three square meals, TV, lots of social interaction and several hours of recreation time. It's certainly not solitary or like sitting on death row. :roll:

 

[calamity]

So then my list is ok too. Right?

It all depends. Some deals obviously would be unconstitutional for reasons that the other deals were not. "We'll let you out if you cut off your dick." Probably is not. "We'll let you out if you submit weekly to sexual evaluations and professional mind-****ing." Certainly is.

One reason the female option is the implant instead of the tubule libation is that TL falls into the former category whereas the implant does not. Where does a vasectomy fall? Who knows?

 

[vegas giants]

It all depends. Some deals obviously would be unconstitutional for reasons that the other deals were not. "We'll let you out if you cut off your dick." Probably is not. "We'll let you out if you submit weekly to sexual evaluations and professional mind-****ing." Certainly is.

One reason the female option is the implant instead of the tubule libation is that TL falls into the former category whereas the implant does not. Where does a vasectomy fall? Who knows?

Sounds like a whole lot of your personal opinion

 

[calamity]

Sounds like a whole lot of your personal opinion

Imagine that....