What's Conservative About Capitalism (1 Viewer)

[phattonez]

Really think about this for a while. Conservatism means holding to the values that your ancestors held. What part of unchecked greed and a lack of moral beliefs other than non-aggression do you think coincides with the values that your ancestors held? This fanatical love for free markets certainly isn't a value of my ancestors. Private property absolutely, but that doesn't mean the unlimited ability to do whatever you want with your property to the detriment of your neighbors.

 

[Bootz]

Really think about this for a while. Conservatism means holding to the values that your ancestors held. What part of unchecked greed and a lack of moral beliefs other than non-aggression do you think coincides with the values that your ancestors held? This fanatical love for free markets certainly isn't a value of my ancestors. Private property absolutely, but that doesn't mean the unlimited ability to do whatever you want with your property to the detriment of your neighbors.

when do you believe capitalism developed? and where?

 

[Tigerace117]

Really think about this for a while. Conservatism means holding to the values that your ancestors held. What part of unchecked greed and a lack of moral beliefs other than non-aggression do you think coincides with the values that your ancestors held? This fanatical love for free markets certainly isn't a value of my ancestors. Private property absolutely, but that doesn't mean the unlimited ability to do whatever you want with your property to the detriment of your neighbors.

What part of slaughtering your neighbors and fanatical hatred of anyone who isn't exactly like you is "moral" in your delusions?

 

[phattonez]

What part of slaughtering your neighbors and fanatical hatred of anyone who isn't exactly like you is "moral" in your delusions?

I see you wasted no time in going straight for the straw man.

 

[phattonez]

when do you believe capitalism developed? and where?

The idea that the just price is whatever two parties agreed upon is central to capitalistic thinking since it allows for exploitation and blatant manipulation by those with more economic power. This has been going on for centuries now.

 

[TobyOne]

One big man of straw. Congrats. Very impressive.

Really think about this for a while. Conservatism means holding to the values that your ancestors held. What part of unchecked greed and a lack of moral beliefs other than non-aggression do you think coincides with the values that your ancestors held? This fanatical love for free markets certainly isn't a value of my ancestors. Private property absolutely, but that doesn't mean the unlimited ability to do whatever you want with your property to the detriment of your neighbors.

 

[phattonez]

One big man of straw. Congrats. Very impressive.

You don't think that's a fair definition of conservatism? How would you define it?

 

[Bootz]

The idea that the just price is whatever two parties agreed upon is central to capitalistic thinking since it allows for exploitation and blatant manipulation by those with more economic power. This has been going on for centuries now.

Actually, that is called mercantilism. Trade amongst and or the wealthy. Capitalism focused on the broader market of human needs versus human luxury. Then government stepped in with regulations and taxes and reversed coarse.

 

[Bootz]

You don't think that's a fair definition of conservatism? How would you define it?

your definition of conservatism is like picking a word out of the dictionary and saying that is the only word.

what conservatism would be is restraint on government, limits on government power and a focus on individual rights.

economics in those times may have been called the general welfare. but the revolution was about liberty not economics.

 

[phattonez]

Actually, that is called mercantilism. Trade amongst and or the wealthy. Capitalism focused on the broader market of human needs versus human luxury. Then government stepped in with regulations and taxes and reversed coarse.

You think there's no exploitation in capitalism? Companies don't exploit the 3rd world paying laborers there less than $1 per hour?

Sent from my HTC phone. Instaurare omnia in Christo.

 

[phattonez]

your definition of conservatism is like picking a word out of the dictionary and saying that is the only word.

what conservatism would be is restraint on government, limits on government power and a focus on individual rights.

economics in those times may have been called the general welfare. but the revolution was about liberty not economics.

Then what do we call the ideology of those who hold to what their parents believed? Those who want to conserve the values of their ancestors?

What you describe is more accurately called individualism.

Sent from my HTC phone. Instaurare omnia in Christo.

 

[Bootz]

You think there's no exploitation in capitalism? Companies don't exploit the 3rd world paying laborers there less than $1 per hour?

Sent from my HTC phone. Instaurare omnia in Christo.

if a woman that is pretty says to an ugly man I will spend the night with you for 1000 dollars, is that exploitation? what about 10,000? what about 100,000?

if the man pays it is he being exploited?

the whole notion of exploitation is invalid. two people engaging in mutually beneficial behavior is synergy not exploitation.

 

[Renae]

Really think about this for a while. Conservatism means holding to the values that your ancestors held. What part of unchecked greed and a lack of moral beliefs other than non-aggression do you think coincides with the values that your ancestors held? This fanatical love for free markets certainly isn't a value of my ancestors. Private property absolutely, but that doesn't mean the unlimited ability to do whatever you want with your property to the detriment of your neighbors.

Since you talk about strawman later in the thread, how about the one you started the thead with. What a waste of time this thread is.

 

[phattonez]

if a woman that is pretty says to an ugly man I will spend the night with you for 1000 dollars, is that exploitation? what about 10,000? what about 100,000?

Yes, it's all exploitation. She's preying on the weak will of the man, and he's being taken advantage of it. Additionally, as often happens in these cases, she's also being exploited by the pimp. She's probably poor herself and got taken in by the prospect of making large sums of money. There's exploitation all around in this scenario.

the whole notion of exploitation is invalid. two people engaging in mutually beneficial behavior is synergy not exploitation.

When a guy pays $100 for his heroin addiction, in no way can that be called "synergy". That's a drug dealer taking advantage of the drug addict.

 

[Neomalthusian]

Really think about this for a while. Conservatism means holding to the values that your ancestors held.

Start by defining "conservatism" in a simplistic and strange way.

What part of unchecked greed and a lack of moral beliefs other than non-aggression do you think coincides with the values that your ancestors held?

Then equate "capitalism" with "unchecked greed and lack of moral beliefs."

This fanatical love for free markets

Then further describe capitalism as "fanatical love" for free markets.


You should try asking an honest question.

 

[phattonez]

Since you talk about strawman later in the thread, how about the one you started the thead with. What a waste of time this thread is.

What straw man did I start with? You, like Bootz, are conflating individualism and conservatism.

 

[phattonez]

Start by defining "conservatism" in a simplistic and strange way.

This seems like a totally fair definition of conservatism. What exactly are we trying to conserve if not the values of our ancestors?

Then equate "capitalism" as "unchecked greed and lack of moral beliefs."

Find me a capitalist who doesn't agree with the sentiment, "greed is good".

https://organizationsandmarkets.com/2009/05/30/you-go-gordon-gekko/

Then further describe capitalism as "fanatical love" for free markets.

You should try asking an honest question.

Capitalists don't want free markets?

Do you even know what capitalism is?

 

[Neomalthusian]

This seems like a totally fair definition of conservatism. What exactly are we trying to conserve if not the values of our ancestors?

Find me a capitalist who doesn't agree with the sentiment, "greed is good".

https://organizationsandmarkets.com/2009/05/30/you-go-gordon-gekko/

Capitalists don't want free markets?

Do you even know what capitalism is?

Try out some intellectual honesty. Asking a question that itself is loaded with overly biased and simplistic assumptions as to the meaning of the words you're referring to doesn't cut it.

 

[phattonez]

Try out some intellectual honesty. Asking a question that itself is loaded with overly biased and simplistic assumptions as to the meaning of the words you're referring to doesn't cut it.

What's the difference between conservatism and individualism?

 

[Tigerace117]

I see you wasted no time in going straight for the straw man.

There's no "straw man" involved. You have praised fascism for supposedly "ending decadence". What is supposedly so moral about your beliefs?

 

[phattonez]

There's no "straw man" involved. You have praised fascism for supposedly "ending decadence". What is supposedly so moral about your beliefs?

Can we stick to the thread topic? Don't hijack it with your pet issues.

Sent from my HTC phone. Instaurare omnia in Christo.

 

[Tigerace117]

Can we stick to the thread topic? Don't hijack it with your pet issues.

Sent from my HTC phone. Instaurare omnia in Christo.

Oh, if you are going to complain about one ideology, the ideology that you yourself hold up as praiseworthy is just as relevant to the discussion.

Why should anyone take your complaints about one ideology seriously when your own is patently worse?

 

[Bootz]

Yes, it's all exploitation. She's preying on the weak will of the man, and he's being taken advantage of it. Additionally, as often happens in these cases, she's also being exploited by the pimp. She's probably poor herself and got taken in by the prospect of making large sums of money. There's exploitation all around in this scenario.



When a guy pays $100 for his heroin addiction, in no way can that be called "synergy". That's a drug dealer taking advantage of the drug addict.

is a farmer charging a person for food exploitation? how about the government charging people for water?

 

[Nap]

Really think about this for a while. Conservatism means holding to the values that your ancestors held. What part of unchecked greed and a lack of moral beliefs other than non-aggression do you think coincides with the values that your ancestors held? This fanatical love for free markets certainly isn't a value of my ancestors. Private property absolutely, but that doesn't mean the unlimited ability to do whatever you want with your property to the detriment of your neighbors.

Because it is what the country was founded on and it is in those principles that conservatives wish to preserve.

To take from one because it is thought that his own industry and that of his father's has acquired too much, in order to spare to others, who, or whose fathers have not exercised equal industry and skill, is to violate arbitrarily the first principle of association-the guarantee to every one of a free exercise of his industry and the fruits acquired by it.

Thomas Jefferson

 

[phattonez]

is a farmer charging a person for food exploitation? how about the government charging people for water?

Selling a banana for $1 probably isn't. Selling a banana to a starving man for $10 is.