What happens after death?

[tosca1]

Wrong...the thief is still in the grave, awaiting the resurrection...Jesus himself said...

"Moreover, no man has ascended into heaven but the one who descended from heaven, the Son of man." John 3:13

AND, HELLO?............................. WHO'S TALKING IN JOHN 13?

WHO?




John 13

Jesus Teaches Nicodemus​

3 Now there was a Pharisee, a man named Nicodemus who was a member of the Jewish ruling council. 2 He came to Jesus at night and said, “Rabbi, we know that you are a teacher who has come from God. For no one could perform the signs you are doing if God were not with him.”


3 Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again.[a]”


4 “How can someone be born when they are old?” Nicodemus asked. “Surely they cannot enter a second time into their mother’s womb to be born!”


5 Jesus answered, “Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit. 6 Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit[b] gives birth to spirit. 7 You should not be surprised at my saying, ‘You[c] must be born again.’ 8 The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit.”


9 “How can this be?” Nicodemus asked.


10 “You are Israel’s teacher,” said Jesus, “and do you not understand these things?
11 Very truly I tell you, we speak of what we know, and we testify to what we have seen, but still you people do not accept our testimony.
12 I have spoken to you of earthly things and you do not believe; how then will you believe if I speak of heavenly things?

13 No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven—the Son of Man.
14 Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up,
15 that everyone who believes may have eternal life in him.”





DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE ROLE OF THE MESSIAH, Elvira?
Do you understand the New Testament?
By the looks of it..............................................YOU DON'T!




JESUS WAS STILL GOING AROUND, PREACHING in JOHN 13!
HE HADN'T DIED FOR MANKIND YET.......................THEREFORE, NO ONE HAS EVER GONE TO HEAVEN.........YET!

HELLO? Are you getting this? I've already gone over that fact with you!




Heaven wasn't available until the Messiah had fulfilled what He came to do!

HE HAD TO DIE FIRST!

That's what He meant when He said...................................... "It's finished."
MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!

 

[Daisy]

AND, HELLO?............................. WHO'S TALKING IN JOHN 13?

WHO?




John 13

Jesus Teaches Nicodemus​

3 Now there was a Pharisee, a man named Nicodemus who was a member of the Jewish ruling council. 2 He came to Jesus at night and said, “Rabbi, we know that you are a teacher who has come from God. For no one could perform the signs you are doing if God were not with him.”


3 Jesus replied, “Very truly I tell you, no one can see the kingdom of God unless they are born again.[a]”


4 “How can someone be born when they are old?” Nicodemus asked. “Surely they cannot enter a second time into their mother’s womb to be born!”


5 Jesus answered, “Very truly I tell you, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless they are born of water and the Spirit. 6 Flesh gives birth to flesh, but the Spirit[b] gives birth to spirit. 7 You should not be surprised at my saying, ‘You[c] must be born again.’ 8 The wind blows wherever it pleases. You hear its sound, but you cannot tell where it comes from or where it is going. So it is with everyone born of the Spirit.”


9 “How can this be?” Nicodemus asked.


10 “You are Israel’s teacher,” said Jesus, “and do you not understand these things?
11 Very truly I tell you, we speak of what we know, and we testify to what we have seen, but still you people do not accept our testimony.
12 I have spoken to you of earthly things and you do not believe; how then will you believe if I speak of heavenly things?

13 No one has ever gone into heaven except the one who came from heaven—the Son of Man.
14 Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the wilderness, so the Son of Man must be lifted up,
15 that everyone who believes may have eternal life in him.”





DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE ROLE OF THE MESSIAH, Elvira?
Do you understand the New Testament?
By the looks of it..............................................YOU DON'T!




JESUS WAS STILL GOING AROUND, PREACHING in JOHN 13!
HE HADN'T DIED FOR MANKIND YET.......................THEREFORE, NO ONE HAS EVER GONE TO HEAVEN.........YET!

HELLO? Are you getting this? I've already gone over that fact with you!




Heaven wasn't available until the Messiah had fulfilled what He came to do!

HE HAD TO DIE FIRST!

That's what He meant when He said...................................... "It's finished."
MISSION ACCOMPLISHED!

And it's still not available to the thief or anyone else with the hope of paradise on earth...Jesus used the same Greek word, paradeisos, as the Hebrew word used in Genesis, gan...so the thief has the hope of paradise on earth, as most of us do...that will be after the resurrection on the last day...

"This is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose none out of all those whom he has given me, but that I should resurrect them on the last day. For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who recognizes the Son and exercises faith in him should have everlasting life, and I will resurrect him on the last day.”" John 6:39,40

No man can come to me unless the Father, who sent me, draws him, and I will resurrect him on the last day." John 6:44

"Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood has everlasting life, and I will resurrect him on the last day;" John 6:54

 

[Manc Skipper]

And it's still not available to the thief or anyone else with the hope of paradise on earth...Jesus used the same Greek word, paradeisos, as the Hebrew word used in Genesis, gan...so the thief has the hope of paradise on earth, as most of us do...that will be after the resurrection on the last day...

"This is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose none out of all those whom he has given me, but that I should resurrect them on the last day. For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who recognizes the Son and exercises faith in him should have everlasting life, and I will resurrect him on the last day.”" John 6:39,40

No man can come to me unless the Father, who sent me, draws him, and I will resurrect him on the last day." John 6:44

"Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood has everlasting life, and I will resurrect him on the last day;" John 6:54

Only cannibal zombies need apply?

 

[calamity]

Only cannibal zombies need apply?

It's weird how they don't see that.

 

[Manc Skipper]

I can only speculate that being dead is pretty much the same as before you were born.

 

[calamity]

I can only speculate that being dead is pretty much the same as before you were born.

In some sci-fi books, they download the information stored in a dying brain onto a computer and supposedly "life" goes on. I always find myself wondering how plausible that is in reality, even if we had the technology. It's not an easy thought experiment to resolve.

 

[ASHES]

In some sci-fi books, they download the information stored in a dying brain onto a computer and supposedly "life" goes on. I always find myself wondering how plausible that is in reality, even if we had the technology. It's not an easy thought experiment to resolve.

Reminds me of the movie The 6th Day. Even when a person's consciousness and memories were transferred into a new clone, it is an entirely new person with their own ideas and motivations from the original, diverging from when the last backup was made.

 

[tosca1]

And it's still not available to the thief or anyone else with the hope of paradise on earth...Jesus used the same Greek word, paradeisos, as the Hebrew word used in Genesis, gan...so the thief has the hope of paradise on earth, as most of us do...that will be after the resurrection on the last day...

"This is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose none out of all those whom he has given me, but that I should resurrect them on the last day. For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who recognizes the Son and exercises faith in him should have everlasting life, and I will resurrect him on the last day.”" John 6:39,40

No man can come to me unless the Father, who sent me, draws him, and I will resurrect him on the last day." John 6:44

"Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood has everlasting life, and I will resurrect him on the last day;" John 6:54

SO IT SHALL BE!


Giving me those verses doesn't do anything!
They don't negate, or contradict what I posted!


That's why I'm wondering if you really understand the Bible. If you can't understand what posted - so simply stated -
how can you be credible at all with anything you say? How can you understand the Scriptures?




Elvira - what did I say I'd think would happen? Refer to my first post which you've responded to.
Post #82.

HERE:

I think, those who believe in Christ, their souls are taken to heaven.
I'm thinking of the thief who was crucified with Him. He took the thief with Him at the moment of death.

Maybe - at the time of Resurrection, our earthly bodies are resurrected and reunited with our souls.



Then you started bringing up....................... HELL!


Post #125

I didn't say anything about hell.....................................yet.


All I said is that I think, the soul of the faithful goes to heaven when he dies (to await the Resurrection of the dead), and on that day,
I think earthly bodies resurrect and are reunited with their souls.



Now, in addition to that, here's what I think:

Christ will separate the faithful from the rest.
Judgment and sentencing will commence.
The unsaved will serve their sentence for eternity - body and soul.


Another "judgment" will be done for the faithful in terms of............................ REWARDS!
There will be rewards handed out!


The faithful would then be with Christ, populating the NEW EARTH.

What happens after death?

Of course the bible doesn't say just one thing about death, but Elvira is laser focused on the one passage that can be interpreted to confirm her beliefs. Please enlighten us and I will prove you wrong...

debatepolitics.com

I think, the soul of the faithful goes to heaven when he dies
................................to await the Resurrection of the dead.


on that day, I think .................
.....................earthly bodies resurrect, and are reunited with their souls.

 

[tosca1]

And it's still not available to the thief or anyone else with the hope of paradise on earth...Jesus used the same Greek word, paradeisos, as the Hebrew word used in Genesis, gan...so the thief has the hope of paradise on earth, as most of us do...that will be after the resurrection on the last day...

"This is the will of him who sent me, that I should lose none out of all those whom he has given me, but that I should resurrect them on the last day. For this is the will of my Father, that everyone who recognizes the Son and exercises faith in him should have everlasting life, and I will resurrect him on the last day.”" John 6:39,40

No man can come to me unless the Father, who sent me, draws him, and I will resurrect him on the last day." John 6:44

"Whoever feeds on my flesh and drinks my blood has everlasting life, and I will resurrect him on the last day;" John 6:54

Since you brought up John 6.........did you read farther down?



John 6

47 Very truly I tell you, the one who believes has eternal life.
48 I am the bread of life.
49 Your ancestors ate the manna in the wilderness, yet they died.
50 But here is the bread that comes down from heaven, which anyone may eat and not die.
51 I am the living bread that came down from heaven. Whoever eats this bread will live forever. This bread is my flesh, which I will give for the life of the world.”


52 Then the Jews began to argue sharply among themselves, “How can this man give us his flesh to eat?”

53 Jesus said to them, “Very truly I tell you, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you.
54 Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.
55 For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink.
56 Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me, and I in them.
57 Just as the living Father sent me and I live because of the Father, so the one who feeds on me will live because of me.
58 This is the bread that came down from heaven. Your ancestors ate manna and died, but whoever feeds on this bread will live forever.”
59 He said this while teaching in the synagogue in Capernaum.

63 The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you—
they are full of the Spirit and life.




Lol! THE SPIRIT!



64 Yet there are some of you who do not believe.”
For Jesus had known from the beginning which of them did not believe and who would
betray him.

65 He went on to say, “This is why I told you that no one can come to me unless the Father has
enabled them.”




There's the referral to the TRINITY again!

Could it be JW is among those who do not believe and are betraying Christ......... because they're contradicting what He had preached?
Isn't it, JW even pegged down Jesus as nothing more but another created ANGEL?




That's why I'm wondering if you really understand the Bible. If you can't understand what posted - so simply stated -
how can you be credible at all with anything you say? How can you understand the Scriptures?

 

[calamity]

Reminds me of the movie The 6th Day. Even when a person's consciousness and memories were transferred into a new clone, it is an entirely new person with their own ideas and motivations from the original, diverging from when the last backup was made.

Yeah...I sort of see that happening more than not.

 

[calamity]

SO IT SHALL BE!


Giving me those verses doesn't do anything!
They don't negate, or contradict what I posted!


That's why I'm wondering if you really understand the Bible. If you can't understand what posted - so simply stated -
how can you be credible at all with anything you say? How can you understand the Scriptures?




Elvira - what did I say I'd think would happen? Refer to my first post which you've responded to.
Post #82.

HERE:

I think, those who believe in Christ, their souls are taken to heaven.
I'm thinking of the thief who was crucified with Him. He took the thief with Him at the moment of death.

Maybe - at the time of Resurrection, our earthly bodies are resurrected and reunited with our souls.



Then you started bringing up....................... HELL!


Post #125

I didn't say anything about hell.....................................yet.


All I said is that I think, the soul of the faithful goes to heaven when he dies (to await the Resurrection of the dead), and on that day,
I think earthly bodies resurrect and are reunited with their souls.



Now, in addition to that, here's what I think:

Christ will separate the faithful from the rest.
Judgment and sentencing will commence.
The unsaved will serve their sentence for eternity - body and soul.


Another "judgment" will be done for the faithful in terms of............................ REWARDS!
There will be rewards handed out!


The faithful would then be with Christ, populating the NEW EARTH.

What happens after death?

Of course the bible doesn't say just one thing about death, but Elvira is laser focused on the one passage that can be interpreted to confirm her beliefs. Please enlighten us and I will prove you wrong...

debatepolitics.com

I think, the soul of the faithful goes to heaven when he dies
................................to await the Resurrection of the dead.


on that day, I think .................
.....................earthly bodies resurrect, and are reunited with their souls.

Lol...Scripture Wars.

 

[tosca1]

I think....those who died unsaved - their souls could be roaming around?


Meh - Could that be why some have had near-death experience........................ without seeing any "LIGHT"?
Could that be an indication that they aren't qualified to await the Resurrection in heaven?



Maybe, God protects the souls of the faithful, that's why they go to Heaven?
The unsaved souls that await the resurrection roaming around, could be easy prey for the devil?
They can be used by the devil, as they await the Resurrection?
Thus we hear about "evil spirits?"

 

[tosca1]

Lol...Scripture Wars.

Lol you know Elvira.
You are NOT allowed to THINK anything that doesn't conform to her false narrative!


You can't voice out your contemplative thoughts ....without her jumping on you....and "correcting" you with
..........................FAKE JW TEACHINGS!


JW must think force-feeding works! They haven't heard of...................... puking!

 

[AARguy]

As I get older this becomes an important question. Its a very personal thing and no one has all the answers. Personally, I see too much "order" in the universe to think there is no rhyme or reason to it. Sister Mary Rosary Beads gave us an analogy for the rationality of believing in a God. She described an ignorant native of some remote place looking down on the trail and seeing a stopwatch. He might not know what it is, but he can tell it didn't just appear. It was MADE. Look up into the sky some night... its like that. I am an engineer and often reflect on the wonder of things like Thermodynamics and such. It can't be by accident.

So I expect that when we die we simply start a new phase of existence that will be totally new and different. I do believe we will be judged on our performance in this life and placed in an appropriate category. I think I've done ok. I figure I'll be placed in a good part of town... hopefully with my wife... to face the next phase and hopefully fun. I assume my ex wife will be on the other side of the railroad tracks slinging burgers in a greasy diner, facing days of unhappiness.

 

[watsup]

SO IT SHALL BE!


Giving me those verses doesn't do anything!
They don't negate, or contradict what I posted!


That's why I'm wondering if you really understand the Bible. If you can't understand what posted - so simply stated -
how can you be credible at all with anything you say? How can you understand the Scriptures?




Elvira - what did I say I'd think would happen? Refer to my first post which you've responded to.
Post #82.

HERE:

I think, those who believe in Christ, their souls are taken to heaven.
I'm thinking of the thief who was crucified with Him. He took the thief with Him at the moment of death.

Maybe - at the time of Resurrection, our earthly bodies are resurrected and reunited with our souls.



Then you started bringing up....................... HELL!


Post #125

I didn't say anything about hell.....................................yet.


All I said is that I think, the soul of the faithful goes to heaven when he dies (to await the Resurrection of the dead), and on that day,
I think earthly bodies resurrect and are reunited with their souls.



Now, in addition to that, here's what I think:

Christ will separate the faithful from the rest.
Judgment and sentencing will commence.
The unsaved will serve their sentence for eternity - body and soul.


Another "judgment" will be done for the faithful in terms of............................ REWARDS!
There will be rewards handed out!


The faithful would then be with Christ, populating the NEW EARTH.

What happens after death?

Of course the bible doesn't say just one thing about death, but Elvira is laser focused on the one passage that can be interpreted to confirm her beliefs. Please enlighten us and I will prove you wrong...

debatepolitics.com

I think, the soul of the faithful goes to heaven when he dies
................................to await the Resurrection of the dead.


on that day, I think .................
.....................earthly bodies resurrect, and are reunited with their souls.

You "think" a lot of things. Big deal.

 

[SayMyName]

In the end, it really does not matter what you believed in life. You will be dead and gone. Live presently, a good life. Harm no one, just in case. Live well, just in case.

 

[AARguy]

You "think" a lot of things. Big deal.

Thinking is good. You should try it.

 

[Dragonfly]

As I get older this becomes an important question. Its a very personal thing and no one has all the answers. Personally, I see too much "order" in the universe to think there is no rhyme or reason to it. Sister Mary Rosary Beads gave us an analogy for the rationality of believing in a God. She described an ignorant native of some remote place looking down on the trail and seeing a stopwatch. He might not know what it is, but he can tell it didn't just appear. It was MADE. Look up into the sky some night... its like that. I am an engineer and often reflect on the wonder of things like Thermodynamics and such. It can't be by accident.

So I expect that when we die we simply start a new phase of existence that will be totally new and different. I do believe we will be judged on our performance in this life and placed in an appropriate category. I think I've done ok. I figure I'll be placed in a good part of town... hopefully with my wife... to face the next phase and hopefully fun. I assume my ex wife will be on the other side of the railroad tracks slinging burgers in a greasy diner, facing days of unhappiness.

When we're young and suffer a loss of a loved one/pet/whatever, the concept of a heaven/paradise where the deceased have gone to party for all eternity is a very soothing and comforting idea to accept.

As we get older and face our own mortality, that same concept of everlasting paradise sure sounds delightful and pleasant. Meeting those we lost before. Hanging out with Jimi Hendrix and John Bonham. Getting busy with Marilyn Monroe. Having wings and being able to fly through time and clouds and stuff. Maybe playing some "ghostly" tricks on those still alive on Earth.

All of it's a coping mechanism for death, and/or the limited and finite time we have in life.

As for your "watch maker" stuff...that's all been answered in other threads. No need to go down that path here. Not in this thread.

 

[AARguy]

When we're young and suffer a loss of a loved one/pet/whatever, the concept of a heaven/paradise where the deceased have gone to party for all eternity is a very soothing and comforting idea to accept.

As we get older and face our own mortality, that same concept of everlasting paradise sure sounds delightful and pleasant. Meeting those we lost before. Hanging out with Jimi Hendrix and John Bonham. Getting busy with Marilyn Monroe. Having wings and being able to fly through time and clouds and stuff. Maybe playing some "ghostly" tricks on those still alive on Earth.

All of it's a coping mechanism for death, and/or the limited and finite time we have in life.

As for your "watch maker" stuff...that's all been answered in other threads. No need to go down that path here. Not in this thread.

I think we will go to a better place, although describing that place is far above my pay grade. I think THIS LIFE is just a test... an admission test, if you will.

 

[Overitall]

In the end, it really does not matter what you believed in life. You will be dead and gone. Live presently, a good life. Harm no one, just in case. Live well, just in case.

Very true, in the grand scheme of life. But in exploring these sort of questions a doorway of understanding may be opened. With understanding a better opportunity to live our lives may also be gained.

 

[AARguy]

Very true, in the grand scheme of life. But in exploring these sort of questions a doorway of understanding may be opened. With understanding a better opportunity to live our lives may also be gained.

All we can do is our best.

 

[Dragonfly]

I think THIS LIFE is just a test... an admission test, if you will.

No harm in believing that, but surely you admit it's nothing but pure faith. 72 virgins kind of faith. Reincarnation kind of faith.

As we've stated often, faith and truth/fact are not one in the same.

 

[AARguy]

No harm in believing that, but surely you admit it's nothing but pure faith. 72 virgins kind of faith. Reincarnation kind of faith.

As we've stated often, faith and truth/fact are not one in the same.

Oh absolutely. But there are many things we do not know. All we can do is take a best guess. There are too many things we cannot explain to just ignore ignore them. In he artillery we were taught to deal with a lack of information by firing "best data". Believing in "best data" helps fill in gaps until we learn more. Insert new data as it acquired.

 

[bongsaway]

I'm just curious of what you all think about what happens after death. Nothing? Your soul departs your body and goes somewhere? Your soul is reincarnated in another human body? What do you think?

I think it's all bullcrap. Anyone ever see a soul? I've seen soul train and I've eaten soul food but I've never actually seen a soul. Has anyone? Oh right, W, when he looked into putin's eyes.

You die, you're gone, end of subject. That's my guess.

 

[AARguy]

I think it's all bullcrap. Anyone ever see a soul? I've seen soul train and I've eaten soul food but I've never actually seen a soul. Has anyone? Oh right, W, when he looked into putin's eyes.

You die, you're gone, end of subject. That's my guess.

I've never seen love... but I know it exists. I've never seen anguish... but I know it exists... I've never seen an intelligent liberal... but I know one must exist somewhere