[W:256]What is a Liberal?

[James972]

Re: What is a Liberal?

This isn't helpful or true.

agreed .

Liberals are for a free lunch,

conservatives are for work!

Its really that simple!

 

[Condor060]

Re: What is a Liberal?

To help those of you confused over differences between Liberals and Conservatives, I have provided a brief description of both.

Liberals:
-tip generously, wait longer between haircuts and lawn cuts, take life in stride, help strangers, put others ahead of themselves, spew love and peace, smile a lot, have an optimistic and inclusive attitude, make hard work look easy, and focus on the common welfare for the benefit of the most people.

Conservatives, on the other hand:
- have a stingy and judgmental nature, insist on conformity, focus on criticizing other people's values instead of their own, show strangers disdain, glorify themselves, spew hate and discord, frown a lot, have a pessimistic and exclusionary attitude, a sense of entitlement and couldn't give a rat's ass about the common welfare.

Whew, that is some real inclusive, optimistic, putting others ahead of themselves, love a peace spewing right there.

I'm not so sure I can take anymore.

Lesson, Learn how to be hypocritical of yourself in a single post.

Priceless.

 

[bongsaway]

Re: What is a Liberal?

That's according to me, not modern parlance. I'm libertarian in general (interventionist being the main thing that gets me kicked out of the club). In modern parlance, I'm conservative economically. I look forward to Trump's tax reform. I hope he wipes out the death tax, the capital gains tax and corporate tax in addition to massive income tax cuts.

No offense eco but for some reason when I read stuff from people who claim to be libertarian like this post of yours, I think it through and it mostly ends in my mind in anarchy. With basically no taxes how does our society pay for itself? Who's gonna build the roads, the airports, the subways and with what money? To me your idea is like putting the foxes in every hen house. We would have a country truly run by oligarchs.

 

[Casper]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Well then, we all knew this thread would go well......

 

[ecofarm]

Re: What is a Liberal?

No offense eco but for some reason when I read stuff from people who claim to be libertarian like this post of yours, I think it through and it mostly ends in my mind in anarchy. With basically no taxes how does our society pay for itself? Who's gonna build the roads, the airports, the subways and with what money? To me your idea is like putting the foxes in every hen house. We would have a country truly run by oligarchs.

I support roads and welfare. I'm not an anarchist. I'm just tired of a society tethered to the government tit.

 

[bongsaway]

Re: What is a Liberal?

I support roads and welfare. I'm not an anarchist. I'm just tired of a society tethered to the government tit.

Our government should be here to help us, not us here to help the government spend our money any way it wishes. Do we really need the military budget we spend every year? Do we really need to give corporate america tax breaks? Our government pisses money away and if you go and try to change the washington culture you are cast aside rather quickly. It's why I give some of these freshman dems credit. Shake the apple cart and hopefully some of the rotten ones will fall out.

 

[ecofarm]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Our government should be here to help us, not us here to help the government spend our money any way it wishes. Do we really need the military budget we spend every year? Do we really need to give corporate america tax breaks? Our government pisses money away and if you go and try to change the washington culture you are cast aside rather quickly. It's why I give some of these freshman dems credit. Shake the apple cart and hopefully some of the rotten ones will fall out.

Let's cut spending. I'm with you.

 

[bongsaway]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Let's cut spending. I'm with you.

I would call myself socially liberal, fiscally conservative. Or in terms of most from the right on here, I'm a liberal. I even support the right for people to own firearms and I'm totally against them.

 

[Good4Nothin]

Re: What is a Liberal?

... or what is liberalism?

Anyone who reads my profile will see that I identify myself as "very liberal". But what does that mean?

What is a liberal?

For me, a liberal believes in:

• the right of self determination, including
  • democratic governance (not only that the government is determined democratically, but that the government exists democratically for the sole benefit of those who determine it - of the people, by the people, for the people,
  • nationhood as a means for protecting welfare and promoting collective goals,
  • the rights of people to improve their lives,
  • the right to be armed - or to possess the means, or access to the means, for protecting oneself,
  • freedom of speech and thought
• individual equality under the law, dependent on
  • the predictable and fair application of laws (rule of law), especially the principle that laws only apply to (and by extension offer protections to) the people who determine those laws (part of 'fair application'),
  • indifference of the law to traits such as race, ethnicity, sexual orientation, etc.
  • freedom of speech and thought

If this list looks short, it's that way on purpose: I am hungry.

Discuss.

No. You would have to contrast "liberal" with "conservative," and conservatives today would agree with all of those.

 

[ecofarm]

Re: What is a Liberal?

I would call myself socially liberal, fiscally conservative. Or in terms of most from the right on here, I'm a liberal. I even support the right for people to own firearms and I'm totally against them.

I'm pro gun though progressive on other social issues

 

[Good4Nothin]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Originally "liberal" was contrasted with the old "conservative," which meant sticking with the old class system with aristocrats on top. Liberals thought individuals should be free to improve their lives by starting a business, etc. That is still what it means outside the USA.

Maybe after WWII, "liberal" got mashed in with "socialist" here. They don't mean the same thing at all but somehow got crammed into the same box together. That is one reason our political discourse is in chaos.

The old liberal ideology led to acceptance of all races and genders, and ethnic groups, as deserving of respect and fairness. Anyone should be allowed to improve their life through hard work, etc.

The old liberal values have been pretty much accepted by everyone now, including most conservatives. Conservatives now mostly oppose the socialist aspect of what we call liberal. Although even most conservatives now agree that one of government's roles should be to help individuals who can't work.

What is the difference between liberal and conservative now? Mostly just matters of degree. There is a lot of agreement, but each side emphasizes certain things.

 

[Mason66]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Mmmmm....

Judging from the stuff that has been written over the years here at DP, a liberal is someone who has a mental disorder that has never ever used a bar of soap. They hate Jesus but worship Gorge Soros and Mike Moore, and love all the gays -- even the ones that are more flaming than a pair of Richard Simmonds sequinned shorts. Despite being dependent on welfare, they all own luxuries like refrigerators and TVs. They own the media and that is why lefty politicians always win elections. They absolutely hate business, and have big hard-ons for rules and regulations and think women should be in a room other than the kitchen. The hate America, love commies and Muslims, and eat aborted fetuses on their morning toast. Sad!

You forgot that they think with a child's brain.

 

[smallvoice]

Re: What is a Liberal?

I agree. My question was rhetorical as I don't believe in calling anyone names based simply on some comments or votes. Hate the comments but not the person. Anymore I am happy if I agree with a candidate 60%. Not sure that Trump broke 40% approval from me.

That may be true, but I'm not sure Hilarity broke 10% approval from me.

 

[smallvoice]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Do you unknowingly make things up to fit your misconceptions and false narrative? Please provide some credible evidence of 1. Hillary calling herself a liberal... and 2. Protesters at Berkeley calling themselves Liberals or Progressives. I do not expect you to produce evidence. If you did provide evidence, you would still have another hurdle to validate your point. Some people misidentify their ideology.

Well, NO ONE who actually wants to win the Presidency will knowingly tag themselves as "Liberal". Bernie will destroy the Dems' chances- just look at who is the leading Dem contender. A Liberal? Not a peep. Once Hubert Humphrey let his true colors show, he went down in flames. Americans won't have any of that porridge, thank you.
The Berkeley gang are screaming liberals/progressives. They only get traction in their own echo chamber. Let them bring it to the heartland and let's see how it fares.
The may misidentify their ideology, but its easy to recognize when they open their mouth.

 

[Conaeolos]

Re: What is a Liberal?

A modern liberal, from what I can tell is someone who grew up in realtive wealth and privilege and as a result contrasted themselves to the stingy, backwards-thinking, anti-establishment other(conservatives). Having grown up often with absent parent or other authority figures, they took their peers as their role models. This leads to many forms of permeant adolence as to frame foundational ideas like capitalism, oil, finance and nationalism as stall-works of a by-gone era. The looming metaphoric parents they so crave to distinguish themselves from yet depend and rely upon. Virtue signalling is high sign of morality in the same way a high-schooler will see civil rights leader herodom verses the cold hard realities of flaw human fight powerful forces trying for something a little better by encouraging small miracles and real empathy. This may sound very negative, yet that is only do that being the focus. A liberal is also idealistic, kind of heart, thoughtful, self-responsible. It is a position with much integrity, simply one that rest on "willingness" rather than rational or loving underpinnings like those of a more mature world view.

The liberals greatest downfall is their naive unholy alliances, such as with the progressives. So taken by their virtous words that questionable actions appear justified even in the face of atrocity and the warning of history. Their lies taken as truth for not better reason than said with authority.

Not to leave us conservatives out. The majority of conservatives are IMHO mostly frustrated liberals who feel left behind by their ilk and nostalgic for a bygone liberalism. Honest enough to admit some of the failing and harsh realities of previous idealism. Honest enough to shoulder some the responsiblity of being a productive adult, but ever so reluctant to move beyond virtual signalling and hero worship into hard labour of real virtue and leaving a better world to the next generation.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Re: What is a Liberal?

... or what is liberalism?

Anyone who reads my profile will see that I identify myself as "very liberal". But what does that mean?

What is a liberal?

For me, a liberal believes in:

• the right of self determination, including
  • democratic governance (not only that the government is determined democratically, but that the government exists democratically for the sole benefit of those who determine it - of the people, by the people, for the people,
  • nationhood as a means for protecting welfare and promoting collective goals,
  • the rights of people to improve their lives,
  • the right to be armed - or to possess the means, or access to the means, for protecting oneself,
  • freedom of speech and thought
• individual equality under the law, dependent on
  • the predictable and fair application of laws (rule of law), especially the principle that laws only apply to (and by extension offer protections to) the people who determine those laws (part of 'fair application'),
  • indifference of the law to traits such as race, ethnicity, sexual orientation, etc.
  • freedom of speech and thought

If this list looks short, it's that way on purpose: I am hungry.

Discuss.

Well, the standard definitions seem to no longer apply. Today, my first hand experience tells me a liberal is someone who thinks they can do anything they want, and have no responsibility assigned to their actions. They are also hypocritical of others who do as they want, that is in opposition to the liberal's viewpoint, making them hypocritical and authoritarian also.

Just my personal observation.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Yep. Almost what I said.

What it means to me, regardless of modern or local/national parlance?

Liberal social policy: let people do what they want.

But not take responsibility for their actions.

Liberal economic policy: let people do what they want with their money.

But tax anyone who is rich at punishing levels.

Liberal foreign policy: the pursuit of global liberation.

And cause wars and hatred for our country by meddling with another nations sovereignty, because they have different sets of values. Liberals are so authoritarian.

 

[ecofarm]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Yep. Almost what I said.


But not take responsibility for their actions.


But tax anyone who is rich at punishing levels.


And cause wars and hatred for our country by meddling with another nations sovereignty, because they have different sets of values. Liberals are so authoritarian.

I believe in laws to hold people responsible. I defined "liberal" not "anarchist".

I believe in lowering taxes for everyone.

A genocidal dictatorship has a meaningful difference in values. Liberation is liberal.

 

[JMaximus]

Re: What is a Liberal?

No. You would have to contrast "liberal" with "conservative," and conservatives today would agree with all of those.

I think all the major political parties in western governments today are liberal.

Their membership not always so much...

 

[James972]

Re: What is a Liberal?

a liberal is someone who thinks they can do anything they want, and have no responsibility assigned to their actions.

gibberish. William Buckley Jr said conservatives are "those of us against govt" thus making liberals those of us for govt. Our conservative founders were against govt. That is what made America great. Our Founders knew liberal govt had been the source of evil in human history, and that was without seeing the great 20th Century liberals, Hitler Stalin Mao Pol Pot.

 

[James972]

Re: What is a Liberal?

"tax the rich, feed the poor, 'til there are no rich no more" and then what is never addressed.

exactly, liberals oppose evolution and are actually trying to reverse it. Their core value is anti science!

 

[James972]

Re: What is a Liberal?

...
If this list looks short, .

Discuss.

in fact, its incoherently long. Liberals are for govt and conservatives against.

 

[rickc]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Lying, socialist, communist, christian-hating, white-man-hating, rich-hating, faggot loving, degenerates who want everything for free, want to ban every single firearm in the world, perverted sickos who want to destroy marriage and support NAMBLA as well as humping dead animals, think abortion should be a spectator sport on National television,
entitled, spoiled, drug addicted pot heads, hippies, .....

That's just off the top of my head.

So you have defined yourself as one of the blind and brainwashed, faux news watching deplorables.

 

[JMaximus]

Re: What is a Liberal?

in fact, its incoherently long. Liberals are for govt and conservatives against.

That's not true at all (about liberals and conservatives; my post may well have been incoherent - I was apparently hungry).

 

[Dragonfly]

Re: What is a Liberal?

So you have defined yourself as one of the blind and brainwashed, faux news watching deplorables.

You took that as a serious answer??? :shock: