[W:256]What is a Liberal?

[JMaximus]

... or what is liberalism?

Anyone who reads my profile will see that I identify myself as "very liberal". But what does that mean?

What is a liberal?

For me, a liberal believes in:

• the right of self determination, including
  • democratic governance (not only that the government is determined democratically, but that the government exists democratically for the sole benefit of those who determine it - of the people, by the people, for the people,
  • nationhood as a means for protecting welfare and promoting collective goals,
  • the rights of people to improve their lives,
  • the right to be armed - or to possess the means, or access to the means, for protecting oneself,
  • freedom of speech and thought
• individual equality under the law, dependent on
  • the predictable and fair application of laws (rule of law), especially the principle that laws only apply to (and by extension offer protections to) the people who determine those laws (part of 'fair application'),
  • indifference of the law to traits such as race, ethnicity, sexual orientation, etc.
  • freedom of speech and thought

If this list looks short, it's that way on purpose: I am hungry.

Discuss.

 

[Middleground]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Mmmmm....

Judging from the stuff that has been written over the years here at DP, a liberal is someone who has a mental disorder that has never ever used a bar of soap. They hate Jesus but worship Gorge Soros and Mike Moore, and love all the gays -- even the ones that are more flaming than a pair of Richard Simmonds sequinned shorts. Despite being dependent on welfare, they all own luxuries like refrigerators and TVs. They own the media and that is why lefty politicians always win elections. They absolutely hate business, and have big hard-ons for rules and regulations and think women should be in a room other than the kitchen. The hate America, love commies and Muslims, and eat aborted fetuses on their morning toast. Sad!

 

[ecofarm]

Re: What is a Liberal?

What it means to me, regardless of modern or local/national parlance?

Liberal social policy: let people do what they want.
Liberal economic policy: let people do what they want with their money.
Liberal foreign policy: the pursuit of global liberation.

For the philosophical cornerstones of this, see signature.

 

[Dragonfly]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Lying, socialist, communist, christian-hating, white-man-hating, rich-hating, faggot loving, degenerates who want everything for free, want to ban every single firearm in the world, perverted sickos who want to destroy marriage and support NAMBLA as well as humping dead animals, think abortion should be a spectator sport on National television,
entitled, spoiled, drug addicted pot heads, hippies, .....

That's just off the top of my head.

 

[Crovax]

Re: What is a Liberal?

What it means to me, regardless of modern or local/national parlance?

Liberal social policy: let people do what they want.
Liberal economic policy: let people do what they want with their money.
Liberal foreign policy: the pursuit of global liberation.

For the philosophical cornerstones of this, see signature.

:rofl:

 

[ttwtt78640]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Hmm...



"tax the rich, feed the poor, 'til there are no rich no more" and then what is never addressed.

 

[ecofarm]

Re: What is a Liberal?

:rofl:

That's according to me, not modern parlance. I'm libertarian in general (interventionist being the main thing that gets me kicked out of the club). In modern parlance, I'm conservative economically. I look forward to Trump's tax reform. I hope he wipes out the death tax, the capital gains tax and corporate tax in addition to massive income tax cuts.

 

[NeverTrump]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Hmm...



"tax the rich, feed the poor, 'til there are no rich no more" and then what is never addressed.

Yeah that song fits the definition pretty well. It's a perfect theme song, I'm surprised it isn't used more on campaign trails. It's a great song, with a great beat. I could care less about it's politics.

 

[Whythink]

Re: What is a Liberal?

A liberal is a bit of an idealist. Example, equality (affirmative action)

A liberal fears making the same mistakes of the past.
Example, support of unions and regulations (minimum wage)

A liberal believe the government has a role.
Example, support of gun purchase waiting period.

A liberal hates hate.
Example, defense of lgbtq rights, defending Islam. At the same time having no patience or understanding for those who hate.

I tend to be liberal in my mind but moderate in comparison.
Example, anti-abortion but pro-choice.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[Trippy Trekker]

Re: What is a Liberal?

To help those of you confused over differences between Liberals and Conservatives, I have provided a brief description of both.

Liberals:
-tip generously, wait longer between haircuts and lawn cuts, take life in stride, help strangers, put others ahead of themselves, spew love and peace, smile a lot, have an optimistic and inclusive attitude, make hard work look easy, and focus on the common welfare for the benefit of the most people.

Conservatives, on the other hand:
- have a stingy and judgmental nature, insist on conformity, focus on criticizing other people's values instead of their own, show strangers disdain, glorify themselves, spew hate and discord, frown a lot, have a pessimistic and exclusionary attitude, a sense of entitlement and couldn't give a rat's ass about the common welfare.

 

[Spartacus FPV]

Re: What is a Liberal?

These modern leftists, the so called "progressives" certainly aren't liberals in the classical sense, or as described above.

 

[Lutherf]

Re: What is a Liberal?

 

[Master PO]

Re: What is a Liberal?

... or what is liberalism?

Anyone who reads my profile will see that I identify myself as "very liberal". But what does that mean?

What is a liberal?

For me, a liberal believes in:

• the right of self determination, including
  • democratic governance (not only that the government is determined democratically, but that the government exists democratically for the sole benefit of those who determine it - of the people, by the people, for the people,
  • nationhood as a means for protecting welfare and promoting collective goals,
  • the rights of people to improve their lives,
  • the right to be armed - or to possess the means, or access to the means, for protecting oneself,
  • freedom of speech and thought
• individual equality under the law, dependent on
  • the predictable and fair application of laws (rule of law), especially the principle that laws only apply to (and by extension offer protections to) the people who determine those laws (part of 'fair application'),
  • indifference of the law to traits such as race, ethnicity, sexual orientation, etc.
  • freedom of speech and thought

If this list looks short, it's that way on purpose: I am hungry.

Discuss.

conflict in your posting, democratic forms of government are collective and not based on individualism

 

[calamity]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Liberal: Nuanced, willing to see the gray on various issues and work within the confines of what is possible to achieve their ends.

Non-liberal: Archie Bunker

 

[<alt>doxygen]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Hmm...



"tax the rich, feed the poor, 'til there are no rich no more" and then what is never addressed.

"...but I don't know what to do. So I'll leave it up to you."

There, I finished the composers thoughts on the subject. LOL, thanks, good song - knocked a stupid one out of my head.

 

[faithful_servant]

Re: What is a Liberal?

... or what is liberalism?

Anyone who reads my profile will see that I identify myself as "very liberal". But what does that mean?

What is a liberal?

For me, a liberal believes in:

the right of self determination, including

Yet liberals also believe in focring people to carry out actions they find morally wrong

democratic governance (not only that the government is determined democratically, but that the government exists democratically for the sole benefit of those who determine it - of the people, by the people, for the people,

Then you live in the wrong country. This is not a Democracy, it is a Constitutional Republic.

nationhood as a means for protecting welfare and promoting collective goals,

That's what laws and personal responsibility are for.

the rights of people to improve their lives,

No. The support of ever increasing taxes to punish success proves this one to be a lie.

the right to be armed - or to possess the means, or access to the means, for protecting oneself,

Serioulsy??? It's the Left that has fought against 2nd Amendment rights

freedom of speech and thought

Only as long as it lines up with liberal accepted speech and thought as seen in places like Berkeley and Portland.

individual equality under the law, dependent on

Yet liberals support giving specific groups additional rights

the predictable and fair application of laws (rule of law), especially the principle that laws only apply to (and by extension offer protections to) the people who determine those laws (part of 'fair application'),

Again, liberals support laws which apply the law differently to people based on their identity

indifference of the law to traits such as race, ethnicity, sexual orientation, etc.

As far from wrong as it's possible to get. Liberals FOCUS on those traits and judge people by them.

freedom of speech and thought

As long as it lines with liberal speech and thoought

If this list looks short, it's that way on purpose: I am hungry.

Discuss.

 

[faithful_servant]

Re: What is a Liberal?

What it means to me, regardless of modern or local/national parlance?

Liberal social policy: let people do what they want.

So they can choose to not do something they find morally wrong?? Liberals are FAR more controlling than the worst we've ever seen from conservatives. Portland and Berkeley are prime recent examples of this.

Liberal economic policy: let people do what they want with their money.

That's just a flat out lie. Liberals are the ones pushing to take control of other people's money through increasing taxes that punish success.

Liberal foreign policy: the pursuit of global liberation.

Not even close. When facing one of the worst human rights disasters in recent history, all liberals could do was cry about WMDs. Did you forget that SH was the #1 "bad guy" for multiple human rights orgs., including the UN Council on Human Rights, Human Rights Watch and pretty much every other major human right organization. Yet all liberals could do when given a choice to stop this oppression was fight against it. Had liberals gotten their way on Iraq, SH would still be killing 20-30,000 people a year to maintain his power.

For the philosophical cornerstones of this, see signature.

 

[TobyOne]

Re: What is a Liberal?

Thats not liberalism. Thats mom and apple pie. Who wouldn't be for those things? Why don't talk about what makes liberalism unique ? Identity politics, faithful belief in government, class antagonism and general nuttery.

... or what is liberalism?

Anyone who reads my profile will see that I identify myself as "very liberal". But what does that mean?

What is a liberal?

For me, a liberal believes in:

• the right of self determination, including
  • democratic governance (not only that the government is determined democratically, but that the government exists democratically for the sole benefit of those who determine it - of the people, by the people, for the people,
  • nationhood as a means for protecting welfare and promoting collective goals,
  • the rights of people to improve their lives,
  • the right to be armed - or to possess the means, or access to the means, for protecting oneself,
  • freedom of speech and thought
• individual equality under the law, dependent on
  • the predictable and fair application of laws (rule of law), especially the principle that laws only apply to (and by extension offer protections to) the people who determine those laws (part of 'fair application'),
  • indifference of the law to traits such as race, ethnicity, sexual orientation, etc.
  • freedom of speech and thought

If this list looks short, it's that way on purpose: I am hungry.

Discuss.

 

[Whythink]

Re: What is a Liberal?

So they can choose to not do something they find morally wrong?? Liberals are FAR more controlling than the worst we've ever seen from conservatives. Portland and Berkeley are prime recent examples of this.


That's just a flat out lie. Liberals are the ones pushing to take control of other people's money through increasing taxes that punish success.


Not even close. When facing one of the worst human rights disasters in recent history, all liberals could do was cry about WMDs. Did you forget that SH was the #1 "bad guy" for multiple human rights orgs., including the UN Council on Human Rights, Human Rights Watch and pretty much every other major human right organization. Yet all liberals could do when given a choice to stop this oppression was fight against it. Had liberals gotten their way on Iraq, SH would still be killing 20-30,000 people a year to maintain his power.

So, one of the best political/philosophical questions I have heard:

When can my individual beliefs infrindge upon your equality?

Or
When can my equality infringe upon your individual beliefs?



Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[faithful_servant]

Re: What is a Liberal?

To help those of you confused over differences between Liberals and Conservatives, I have provided a brief description of both.

Liberals:
-tip generously, wait longer between haircuts and lawn cuts, take life in stride, help strangers, put others ahead of themselves, spew love and peace, smile a lot, have an optimistic and inclusive attitude, make hard work look easy, and focus on the common welfare for the benefit of the most people.

Conservatives, on the other hand:
- have a stingy and judgmental nature, insist on conformity, focus on criticizing other people's values instead of their own, show strangers disdain, glorify themselves, spew hate and discord, frown a lot, have a pessimistic and exclusionary attitude, a sense of entitlement and couldn't give a rat's ass about the common welfare.

Lets' look at what liberals actually DO:
Refuse to stand up for the oppressed when it's not politically expedient. (Iraq's massive human right's violations that the left would have allowed to continue unabated just to spite Pres. Bush)
Accept injustice in the name of liberal ideals. (Dead silence from liberal leaders on the recent repeated uses of violence to stop people from speaking or even being in a parade)
Focus on identity over performance. (Let's see what a completely unqualified person can do as President, just because he's black)
Condemn anyone who doesn't think like they do. (Portland and Berkeley)
Use violence to push their agenda. (Portland and Berkeley)
Are willing to make other people sacrifice for the common welfare and punish the successful. (Taxing the successful to keep poor people dependent on the gov't)

Let's see what conservatives DO:
Put their money where their mouth by working to stop oppression.
Fighting against injustice by allowing people who don't think like they do to freely speak their minds and share their ideas..
Focus on performance and don't give a rat's ass about identity.
Want to see EVERYONE succeed by giving them opportunity.

Most liberals I know are bitter, angry people who define themselves by not being conservative instead of by what they are and what they believe in. They want everyone to think like they do and are willing to shout down those who don't.

 

[Whythink]

Re: What is a Liberal?

There is a YouTube video, part of the Crash Course series that summarizes liberal/conservative as freedom vs. equality.

No cheap shots just different conclusion about role of government.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[faithful_servant]

Re: What is a Liberal?

So, one of the best political/philosophical questions I have heard:

When can my individual beliefs infrindge upon your equality?

Or
When can my equality infringe upon your individual beliefs?



Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

I'm assuming that when you talk about "individual beliefs", you're not just limiting this to what a person thinks, but how they act upon those beliefs.

"Equality" is a term that needs to either go away or start being applied accurately. For too many people in this country it's come to mean pushing others down, so that a few can rise up. When we grant additional rights to people based on nothing but identity (Affirmative Action, fed. contracts that are only offered to specific identities, etc.), we are fighting against equality, yet for a lot of people here, it's fighting for equality.

As a conservative, I believe that all people should be treated equally, but that all people are not the same. There is a fundamental equality in the eyes of the law that no one's beliefs should be allowed to infringe on. But there is also a fundamental inequality in people that the law should not be allowed to touch as well. You don't get to stop me from being successful just because you are less successful.

 

[Casca XV]

Re: What is a Liberal?

To help those of you confused over differences between Liberals and Conservatives, I have provided a brief description of both.

Liberals:
-tip generously, wait longer between haircuts and lawn cuts, take life in stride, help strangers, put others ahead of themselves, spew love and peace, smile a lot, have an optimistic and inclusive attitude, make hard work look easy, and focus on the common welfare for the benefit of the most people.

Conservatives, on the other hand:
- have a stingy and judgmental nature, insist on conformity, focus on criticizing other people's values instead of their own, show strangers disdain, glorify themselves, spew hate and discord, frown a lot, have a pessimistic and exclusionary attitude, a sense of entitlement and couldn't give a rat's ass about the common welfare.

Today there are two types of Liberals:

1. Leftist Socialists attempting to lie about what they are.

2. Useful Idiots who join up because they think it’s cool or they like a social issue (abortion, gay rights). But they don’t realize they are giving support to the most destructive political/economic ideology the world has ever seen.

Decades ago the term "Liberal" described what a Libertarian is today: an open minded free thinker who loves individual freedom and limited power Government.

Over the years, in a propaganda effort Leftist Socialist hijacked the term. Today people calling themselves Liberal are the most closed minded totalitarian segment of Americans.

 

[Casca XV]

Re: What is a Liberal?

... or what is liberalism?

Anyone who reads my profile will see that I identify myself as "very liberal". But what does that mean?

What is a liberal?

For me, a liberal believes in:

• the right of self determination, including
  • democratic governance (not only that the government is determined democratically, but that the government exists democratically for the sole benefit of those who determine it - of the people, by the people, for the people,
  • nationhood as a means for protecting welfare and promoting collective goals,
  • the rights of people to improve their lives,
  • the right to be armed - or to possess the means, or access to the means, for protecting oneself,
  • freedom of speech and thought
• individual equality under the law, dependent on
  • the predictable and fair application of laws (rule of law), especially the principle that laws only apply to (and by extension offer protections to) the people who determine those laws (part of 'fair application'),
  • indifference of the law to traits such as race, ethnicity, sexual orientation, etc.
  • freedom of speech and thought

If this list looks short, it's that way on purpose: I am hungry.

Discuss.

see #23

 

[Casca XV]

Re: What is a Liberal?

... or what is liberalism?

Anyone who reads my profile will see that I identify myself as "very liberal". But what does that mean?

What is a liberal?

For me, a liberal believes in:

• the right of self determination, including
  • democratic governance (not only that the government is determined democratically, but that the government exists democratically for the sole benefit of those who determine it - of the people, by the people, for the people,
  • nationhood as a means for protecting welfare and promoting collective goals,
  • the rights of people to improve their lives,
  • the right to be armed - or to possess the means, or access to the means, for protecting oneself,
  • freedom of speech and thought
• individual equality under the law, dependent on
  • the predictable and fair application of laws (rule of law), especially the principle that laws only apply to (and by extension offer protections to) the people who determine those laws (part of 'fair application'),
  • indifference of the law to traits such as race, ethnicity, sexual orientation, etc.
  • freedom of speech and thought

If this list looks short, it's that way on purpose: I am hungry.

Discuss.

This is Liberalism today: https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct...mO0C0vJ8BFVwkax8g&sig2=VtFaeJvSF0IqV0J3WVfNSQ