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Venezuela Liquidates All US Assets

danarhea

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Venezuela has moved all its central bank assets out of the United States, has liquidated all its investments in US treasury securities, and has placed all of its funds in European banks, thus converting it all to Euros.

Does Venezuela see a coming monetary crash coming in the US, or is it merely keeping its promise to take economic action if the US kept supporting the idea of assassinating Chavez?

Article is here.
 

Pacridge

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danarhea said:
Venezuela has moved all its central bank assets out of the United States, has liquidated all its investments in US treasury securities, and has placed all of its funds in European banks, thus converting it all to Euros.

Does Venezuela see a coming monetary crash coming in the US, or is it merely keeping its promise to take economic action if the US kept supporting the idea of assassinating Chavez?

Article is here.
It's probably more show then anything else. But the massive US debt might have had some small effect on their move.
 

danarhea

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Pacridge said:
It's probably more show then anything else. But the massive US debt might have had some small effect on their move.
That is exactly my thinking too. What is going to kill us is not only the debt, and currency based on debt, but fractional banking too.
 

Kandahar

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danarhea said:
Does Venezuela see a coming monetary crash coming in the US,
Hardly. Hugo Chavez is an economic troglodyte who can't even see the current monetary crash taking place in his OWN country.
 

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333 billion $ over run on U S soil
America's DEBT while less frightening then Ven.
isn't the picture of perfect
and certainly not one that should lead to name calling unless your aiming your name calling directly at policy makers of your own country
Chavez has the guts to stand up
where are the American people that stand up
to this debt of theirs,nuke the iraq people with UD bombs and look at other poorer nation's people as troglodytes is that the real america speaking up
it certainly sounds like the REPS machine along the lines of
abortions for all blacks to save crime and assasinate chavez because he dares to speak out
 
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Canuck

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333 billion $ over run on U S soil
America's DEBT while less frightening then Ven.
isn't the picture of perfect
and certainly not one that should lead to name calling
it sounds an awfull lot like russian to me
chavez speaks up REPS say kill him
and bomb iraq with depleted uranium boms while your at abortions for all blacks so crime goes down but let the borders stay wide open for mexican crime
doesnt sound american its foriegn to my ears
 

Pacridge

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Canuck said:
333 billion $ over run on U S soil
America's DEBT while less frightening then Ven.
isn't the picture of perfect
and certainly not one that should lead to name calling
it sounds an awfull lot like russian to me
chavez speaks up REPS say kill him
and bomb iraq with depleted uranium boms while your at abortions for all blacks so crime goes down but let the borders stay wide open for mexican crime
doesnt sound american its foriegn to my ears
Dude (Dudette?) punctuation please. Seriously I'm the last guy to complain about anyone's grammar, But I can't even understand what you're trying to say here.

Plus your above two posts are almost identical, some reason for that?
 

Kandahar

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Canuck said:
333 billion $ over run on U S soil
America's DEBT while less frightening then Ven.
isn't the picture of perfect
and certainly not one that should lead to name calling unless your aiming your name calling directly at policy makers of your own country
Chavez has the guts to stand up
where are the American people that stand up
to this debt of theirs,nuke the iraq people with UD bombs and look at other poorer nation's people as troglodytes is that the real america speaking up
it certainly sounds like the REPS machine along the lines of
abortions for all blacks to save crime and assasinate chavez because he dares to speak out
What are you talking about? Where in my previous post could you have possibly gotten the impression that I supported the huge American debt and war in Iraq? What does any of that have to do with my statement that Hugo Chavez is an economic troglodyte? The fact is that Hugo Chavez has done everything in his power to make Venezuela LESS free and MORE poor. There is no country in the world that has seen a steeper decline in economic freedom over the past decade than Venezuela.
 

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Kandahar said:
What are you talking about? Where in my previous post could you have possibly gotten the impression that I supported the huge American debt and war in Iraq? What does any of that have to do with my statement that Hugo Chavez is an economic troglodyte? The fact is that Hugo Chavez has done everything in his power to make Venezuela LESS free and MORE poor. There is no country in the world that has seen a steeper decline in economic freedom over the past decade than Venezuela.
When you decode Canuck's posts, let me know.

How has Chavez made his country less free? More poor? I thought their economy was rebounding lately.
 

Kandahar

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Pacridge said:
When you decode Canuck's posts, let me know.

How has Chavez made his country less free? More poor? I thought their economy was rebounding lately.
The Venezuelan economy is so unstable that it undergoes wild swings. For example, GDP fell -18% in 2003, rebounded 11% in 2004, and underwent another nasty recession during the first half of 2005. If its economy is currently on an uptick, it doesn't mean the economy is rebounding. The long-term trend for the Venezuelan economy since Hugo Chavez came to power has been very much downward.

He has made Venezuela less free by harassing and intimidating journalists, imprisoning political opponents on petty charges, accepting bribes from local and foreign groups, and (according to some election monitors) fixing the last referendum.

Chavez has driven away almost all foreign investment in his country and has made Venezuela even more dependent on oil for its economy. He has nationalized many foreign-owned businesses, so it's no surprise that other foreign-owned businesses have been scared away.
 

galenrox

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I'm assuming that it was mostly for show. Both the US dollar and the Euro are in pretty bad ways, and so a complete switch is for all practical purposes pointless. I think it was more of a "screw the US" move than an actual move with their best financial interest in mind.
 

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I for one am glad Mr. Chavez has liquidated U.S. investments in the dollar and tuned to the Euro. Since he did, the dollar has strengthened against the Euro simply because our current GDP came in at 3.3% versus less than 1% for Europe as a whole led by France and Germany who are really hard pressed to see any growth in their economies while ours holds strong.

Yes, with the decline in the Euro against the dollar, Hugo C. really helped his country rid itself of some of the profits from his oil sales. He will be gone soon, the people are not happy with him and it's their business anyway, not a concern to us.
:duel :cool:
 
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The fact is that the value of the dollar has declined and the Euro is worth more. Saddam even switched his U.N. reserve fund from dollars to Euros in 2000. In fact, the dollar's value decreased by 19% in 2003 because of the Euro.
 

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Napoleon's Nightingale said:
The fact is that the value of the dollar has declined and the Euro is worth more. Saddam even switched his U.N. reserve fund from dollars to Euros in 2000. In fact, the dollar's value decreased by 19% in 2003 because of the Euro.
so you want to talk about 2000 and 2003. I'll talk about last Thursday and Friday when CNBC reported the strengthening trend in the dollar with the increase in interest rates from the fed, the 3 to 5 times GDP rate over European countries and the decline in productivity of European countries as compared to the U.S. as our productivity increases.

Last week the business section of the NYT's ran a story which mentioned the decline in productivity in the U.S. I didn't see that story but I did see the correction they made when they said their reporting had overstated the decline in productivity here as opposed to overseas.

Chavez is a poor leader in an oil rich country that is miles behind the U.S. and Europe is currently hanging on with growth of around 1% while we are between 3.5 to 4%. These numbers are available with just a small commitment to go on line to CNBC or the online business section of the Washington Post which you can receive as a separate email from the regular paper.

It's worth knowing our economy is leading the world. It's so hard to get some people to understand how strong this country really is. Hugo Chavez certainly didn't get it.
:duel :cool:
 
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Our economy isn't the "leading in the world". It has the most money invested in it but it's overall quality is less than several of the european, asian, and middle eastern nations. The fact is that the Euro is worth more than the Dollar even in 2005.
 

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Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Our economy isn't the "leading in the world". It has the most money invested in it but it's overall quality is less than several of the european, asian, and middle eastern nations. The fact is that the Euro is worth more than the Dollar even in 2005.
I am really laughing at this one. This is the world's leading economy under any guage you wish to look. Those economys you cite - europe, asian, middle eastern - they are paupers without our trade and wealth. This is a simple fact based upon world markets and measuring the economics of the globe. You may disagree but then you must show me GDP figures and the overlay of our economy on the GDP realized by those favorites of yours.

I am puzzled by "overall quality", a term that seems hatched. You cite the fact that the Euro is worth more than the Dollar but the British Pound has been up for years against the dollar. The Euro is worth more? Under what measure of economics? You can buy more dollars with a Euro? Oh, that is good for us is it not? With the low to nothing but limited growth in the European economys, you need a strong Euro to invest in the Unites States which is still the destination of money from around the world.

I sat in the el Tovar at Grand Canyon a few years back having a drink with friends and the tables around us said French, German, Japanese, Korean and they layed dollars on the table. Currency flucuations are always good but never is this country weakened by them. Imagine if all those countries pulled their dollars out. We would only be forced to stop feeding them. Look at the fuel prices we absorb and our markets hold fast. I'd call it amazing.

The United States is a powerhouse when it comes to proping up other countries currency and never forget. If we catch a cold, the world gets pnuemonia. For well over a century its been that way and with your "overall quality" comment for a country that is stronger in every measure than any on earth in the economic, military and social arenas, what now? I take it you aren't from the U.S.
:duel :cool:
 
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gordontravels said:
I am really laughing at this one. This is the world's leading economy under any guage you wish to look. Those economys you cite - europe, asian, middle eastern - they are paupers without our trade and wealth. This is a simple fact based upon world markets and measuring the economics of the globe. You may disagree but then you must show me GDP figures and the overlay of our economy on the GDP realized by those favorites of yours.

I am puzzled by "overall quality", a term that seems hatched. You cite the fact that the Euro is worth more than the Dollar but the British Pound has been up for years against the dollar. The Euro is worth more? Under what measure of economics? You can buy more dollars with a Euro? Oh, that is good for us is it not? With the low to nothing but limited growth in the European economys, you need a strong Euro to invest in the Unites States which is still the destination of money from around the world.

I sat in the el Tovar at Grand Canyon a few years back having a drink with friends and the tables around us said French, German, Japanese, Korean and they layed dollars on the table. Currency flucuations are always good but never is this country weakened by them. Imagine if all those countries pulled their dollars out. We would only be forced to stop feeding them. Look at the fuel prices we absorb and our markets hold fast. I'd call it amazing.

The United States is a powerhouse when it comes to proping up other countries currency and never forget. If we catch a cold, the world gets pnuemonia. For well over a century its been that way and with your "overall quality" comment for a country that is stronger in every measure than any on earth in the economic, military and social arenas, what now? I take it you aren't from the U.S.
:duel :cool:

Overall quality includes GDP, Deficit GDP, etc. The only reason our GDP is higher is because the U.S. is 50 times larger than most countries. Most of our states have a higher deficit than most countries. You have to make it proportional for it to be a proper comparisson. The problem with the U.S. economy, amoung other things, is that our imports are greater than our exports. So before you go on another high and mighty kick, our economy would crash if countries decided to sell to someone else in greater quantity. Since the Euro came out the value of the dollar has been steadily decreasing. Why? It's backed by the economies and assests of nearly all of continental europe, parts of the middle east, etc. The dollar peaked in 04 but has continued to steadily decline again at the end of 04 and continues to decline in 05.
 

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Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Overall quality includes GDP, Deficit GDP, etc. The only reason our GDP is higher is because the U.S. is 50 times larger than most countries.
That's not true. Our population is, of course, the largest factor in our GDP but it is by no means the only factor. The United States has one of the highest GDPs per capita (I think we're 2nd or 3rd).

Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Most of our states have a higher deficit than most countries.
That's not true. Most of the states have very low deficits (it's technically illegal for states to deficit spend, although this is often ignored). Even the federal deficit is very low as a percentage of the GDP, by international standards. That's not to say that there's no problem; of course it should be lower.

Napoleon's Nightingale said:
You have to make it proportional for it to be a proper comparisson. The problem with the U.S. economy, amoung other things, is that our imports are greater than our exports. So before you go on another high and mighty kick, our economy would crash if countries decided to sell to someone else in greater quantity.
Why would they suddenly "decide" to sell to someone else assuming no change in economic policy?

I think your description of the previous poster's "high and mighty kick" is a big misconception. He is correct that the United States has the strongest economy in the world by almost any standard; there's nothing arrogant about this, as a simple look at the statistics will confirm this.

Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Since the Euro came out the value of the dollar has been steadily decreasing. Why? It's backed by the economies and assests of nearly all of continental europe, parts of the middle east, etc. The dollar peaked in 04 but has continued to steadily decline again at the end of 04 and continues to decline in 05.
Why is a weak dollar a bad thing?
 
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Kandahar said:
That's not true. Our population is, of course, the largest factor in our GDP but it is by no means the only factor. The United States has one of the highest GDPs per capita (I think we're 2nd or 3rd).
Population is the only reason why our economic system semi-works. Luxembourg has the highest GDP per capita in the world..odd considering the fact that it's only 2,586 square kilometers. Theres also another factor though that in my opinion determines the best quality..how that money is spent and how stable the economy is. For example, we spend more money per individual than any other country in the world on healthcare yet we're only 37th in overall healthcare quality and our economy takes a nose dive everytime it rains somewhere or someone fires a gun.



Kandahar said:
That's not true. Most of the states have very low deficits (it's technically illegal for states to deficit spend, although this is often ignored). Even the federal deficit is very low as a percentage of the GDP, by international standards. That's not to say that there's no problem; of course it should be lower.


Kandahar said:
Why would they suddenly "decide" to sell to someone else assuming no change in economic policy?
Consider it an insentive to do what said country wants us to do. For example, when OPEC decreases oil production our economy makes a crater in the floor.

Kandahar said:
I think your description of the previous poster's "high and mighty kick" is a big misconception. He is correct that the United States has the strongest economy in the world by almost any standard; there's nothing arrogant about this, as a simple look at the statistics will confirm this.
It's not the strongest by any means..it's one of the most fragile economies in the world.


Kandahar said:
Why is a weak dollar a bad thing?
Foreign goods are more expensive and our economy is based primarily on importing.
 

Kandahar

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Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Population is the only reason why our economic system semi-works.
Can you elaborate, please.

Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Luxembourg has the highest GDP per capita in the world..odd considering the fact that it's only 2,586 square kilometers.
It doesn't seem that odd to me. Small countries like that are obviously going to be homogeneous, so if it happens to be comprised mainly of wealthy people there aren't many poor people to bring that number down.

Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Theres also another factor though that in my opinion determines the best quality..how that money is spent and how stable the economy is. For example, we spend more money per individual than any other country in the world on healthcare yet we're only 37th in overall healthcare quality
I agree with you on this. Our health care system is horribly inefficient. It seems we have two options: A) Find a way to make it more efficient, B) Get the government out of the health care business. I'd prefer B.

Napoleon's Nightingale said:
and our economy takes a nose dive everytime it rains somewhere or someone fires a gun.
That's not true; our economy stands up to unexpected traumas much BETTER than any other economy in the world simply because it's so large and no single event is likely to do major, lasting damage.

Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Consider it an insentive to do what said country wants us to do. For example, when OPEC decreases oil production our economy makes a crater in the floor.
So does theirs, but a much deeper crater.

Napoleon's Nightingale said:
It's not the strongest by any means..it's one of the most fragile economies in the world.
You'll need to provide some evidence of this, as I see only one event in all of American history (the 1929 Stock Market crash) that caused major, lasting damage to the American economy. Even the Civil War didn't leave an imprint lasting for more than a few years following.

Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Foreign goods are more expensive and our economy is based primarily on importing.
Didn't you mention that the trade deficit was part of the problem (which I agree with)? You're right; a weak dollar makes foreign goods more expensive, thus reducing our imports. On the flip side, it makes our exports cheaper, thus increasing our exports and reducing the trade deficit. So I repeat: How is this a bad thing?
 

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Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Population is the only reason why our economic system semi-works. Luxembourg has the highest GDP per capita in the world..odd considering the fact that it's only 2,586 square kilometers. Theres also another factor though that in my opinion determines the best quality..how that money is spent and how stable the economy is. For example, we spend more money per individual than any other country in the world on healthcare yet we're only 37th in overall healthcare quality and our economy takes a nose dive everytime it rains somewhere or someone fires a gun.









Consider it an insentive to do what said country wants us to do. For example, when OPEC decreases oil production our economy makes a crater in the floor.



It's not the strongest by any means..it's one of the most fragile economies in the world.




Foreign goods are more expensive and our economy is based primarily on importing.
Not really. Our economy is based on nothing but debt, which is a concept that is insane.
 
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Kandahar said:
Can you elaborate, please.
Sure :smile: . Considering the fact that our system is based primarily on imports the fact that we have a high population to buy those products is what keeps the economy running. We'll never be able to export more products than we import so having a huge population is what makes it semi-work.




Kandahar said:
I agree with you on this. Our health care system is horribly inefficient. It seems we have two options: A) Find a way to make it more efficient, B) Get the government out of the health care business. I'd prefer B.

I'm glad you agree heh but I disagree with you on how to fix the problem. The best healthcare systems in the world are federally run. It's just a matter of how the money is spent and whether or notwe can make the government keep it's paws of the money specifically assigned to healthcare provision.



Kandahar said:
That's not true; our economy stands up to unexpected traumas much BETTER than any other economy in the world simply because it's so large and no single event is likely to do major, lasting damage.

The events of 9/11 have and will continue to do major, lasting damage but I suppose an event like that would have a similar effect on any economy.

Kandahar said:
So does theirs, but a much deeper crater.
Possibly. Thats the problem with intertwined economies..if one goes down it drags the others down with it.






Kandahar said:
Didn't you mention that the trade deficit was part of the problem (which I agree with)? You're right; a weak dollar makes foreign goods more expensive, thus reducing our imports. On the flip side, it makes our exports cheaper, thus increasing our exports and reducing the trade deficit. So I repeat: How is this a bad thing?
Yes, I did. The problem is that,unfortunatley, it doesn't work out in real life. It doesn't reduce the total trade deficit it simply slows down the accumulation in the short term..the debt still keeps pileing up. It's better to have a higher value because, in theory, it increases consumer spending.
 

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Napoleon's Nightingale said:
Overall quality includes GDP, Deficit GDP, etc. The only reason our GDP is higher is because the U.S. is 50 times larger than most countries. Most of our states have a higher deficit than most countries. You have to make it proportional for it to be a proper comparisson. The problem with the U.S. economy, amoung other things, is that our imports are greater than our exports. So before you go on another high and mighty kick, our economy would crash if countries decided to sell to someone else in greater quantity. Since the Euro came out the value of the dollar has been steadily decreasing. Why? It's backed by the economies and assests of nearly all of continental europe, parts of the middle east, etc. The dollar peaked in 04 but has continued to steadily decline again at the end of 04 and continues to decline in 05.
You cite the "overall quality" of europe, asian, etc. economies that we support and then talk about our GDP being higher than other countries because we are 50 times larger? I am still laughing.

Where do you think the Euro comes from? Luxemburg? You then want to talk about how the Euro is backed by all these countries that shoots down your "the U.S. is 50 times larger" argument and saves me time.

You talk about how we would be nothing if all these countries decided to pull their investment in dollars. There is a name for that. It's called "Economic Suicide". It isn't just that the U.S. is the engine that pulls the world's economy along. It's that without our economy the world chugs to a halt and the word depression wouldn't be enough to describe it.

It is true that at the federal level we can run deficits and those deficits can run into the hundreds of billions. It is not true of our states which California has shown.

The world has confidence in the U.S. economy and even now the strength shows with the way the country is absorbing the high cost of energy. Most of what the world hears about the U.S. comes fom a media that has an agenda and a side; their side. It's like the difference in the French Government/Media on the one hand and the French people on the other. The former don't like our government much and say and show it. The French people like us and look on their own media and government with some of the lowest positive poll numbers in the world.

If you do anything, hope the U.S. keeps ahead of the curve because when the bottom line comes about it will be spelled "food" and the world wants its share.
:duel :cool:
 

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danarhea said:
Venezuela has moved all its central bank assets out of the United States, has liquidated all its investments in US treasury securities, and has placed all of its funds in European banks, thus converting it all to Euros.

Does Venezuela see a coming monetary crash coming in the US, or is it merely keeping its promise to take economic action if the US kept supporting the idea of assassinating Chavez?

Article is here.



Naw, ..Chavez is a witless fool who has convinced his contemporaries of the "ugly American".
He thinks its gonna hurt America economically, & therfore he can take personal satifaction in that hopeful event.

In truth, Chavez will have his country's economy wrecked,.. all in good time!
 
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gordontravels said:
You cite the "overall quality" of europe, asian, etc. economies that we support and then talk about our GDP being higher than other countries because we are 50 times larger? I am still laughing.

Where do you think the Euro comes from? Luxemburg? You then want to talk about how the Euro is backed by all these countries that shoots down your "the U.S. is 50 times larger" argument and saves me time.

You talk about how we would be nothing if all these countries decided to pull their investment in dollars. There is a name for that. It's called "Economic Suicide". It isn't just that the U.S. is the engine that pulls the world's economy along. It's that without our economy the world chugs to a halt and the word depression wouldn't be enough to describe it.

It is true that at the federal level we can run deficits and those deficits can run into the hundreds of billions. It is not true of our states which California has shown.

The world has confidence in the U.S. economy and even now the strength shows with the way the country is absorbing the high cost of energy. Most of what the world hears about the U.S. comes fom a media that has an agenda and a side; their side. It's like the difference in the French Government/Media on the one hand and the French people on the other. The former don't like our government much and say and show it. The French people like us and look on their own media and government with some of the lowest positive poll numbers in the world.

If you do anything, hope the U.S. keeps ahead of the curve because when the bottom line comes about it will be spelled "food" and the world wants its share.
:duel :cool:

Reading comprehension is a wonderful skill don't you agree? You can't compare the GDP of an individual european country to the U.S. because it is entirely disproportional. The Euro is backed by almost all of continental Europe..do the math several small countries plus several small countries equalls one large country. Our economy is only functioning because of our population and size therefore the reason the Euro is so successful against the American dollar is because the GDPs are proportional and the ecnomonies are independant. I don't think the world would mourn the loss of the Big Mac.
 
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