ADK_Forever
DP Veteran
- Joined
- Sep 6, 2008
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There are reasons to stay and reasons to pullout. It’s debated all over the news, internet, and this very forum. But don’t throw around the deaths of Marines and Soldiers to better your argument of why we should leave Iraq and Afghanistan. If you truly respect those who have lost their lives, don’t do it…
This is the ugly downside of getting all Gung Ho for combat and then not being trained how to throttle it back. The military "could" do a much better job at this. They just choose not to.
Kudos to your hubby for turning his situation around. From what I read, more and more are not able to make that adjustment back into civilian life. I believe the suicide and domestic violence rates are the highest they've ever been. It's a damn shame.
Your error is, VoodooChild is a serving member of the military. His opinion counts more than your's, unless, of course, you are a serving member of the United States military. Are you?
Anyone, in the military, has more moral authority than anyone who isn't in the military, to explain why they decided to serve their country. That's his right. He earned it when he took up arms to serve this great nation of ours. No one in, or out, of uniform has the right to tell him he's wrong.
You have the wife of a soldier (Spiker) and the mother of another (me) telling you that you're not right.
If every US service member joined for the sole reason of wanting to be deployed so they can kill insurgents, why do so many choose non-combat MOS's?
Any rational person is perfectly well aware that not all US service members think with a single mind.
We all know service members; many of us know them intimately.
Don't speak for our loved ones.
Don't tell us what they feel.
It is his right to tell us what he feels and why he joined the service, and no one here should contradict him, since we're not psychic and have no access to his thought processes, other than what he tells us.
I, for one, am always interested to hear from service members about their ideas and experiences.
It is not his prerogative, however, to tell us what other service members feel, or why other service members joined, and expect no disagreement.
His uniform gives him no "moral authority" to do that.
It's called human emotion. There's not much the military can do about that, nor should they.
Speaking from personal experience, I want a platoon of heartbreakers and lifetakers. if I have soldiers who are going to, "throttle it back", in the middle of a firefight, we'll see too many friendly casualties and not enough enemy casualties.
When you actually where the uniform, then you can preach to me. Until then...at ease!!
Obama's never been in uniform.
And he's our Commander and Chief, now - he can send you where his two pretty legs will NEVER dare to go.
So, yes, whether you're in or out doesn't matter much.
So much for that point.
It's been a very long time since we've had a president who was ever in the military, let alone fought in a war.
There was McCain, and there was Kerry... but of course, they didn't win.
Biden's son is in the military, I believe, and was in Iraq in 2008. I've heard whispers that he might be a future democratic nominee.
I have a NEWS FLASH for ya pal, we all get the same number of votes, one. You don't get more votes if you "where" a uniform, if you "wear" a uniform or if you never stepped foot on a military installation. We ALL get a say.
Carry on private.
Reading comprehension really isn't high on your list of important skills is it? In thread after thread you misunderstand what people post. :roll: Or is it that you intentionally twist their meaning?
When I mentioned "throttling it back" I was obviously talking, and the gist of the conversation was, about when soldiers get out of the military.
You can play ignorant on how an oil rig works until the cows come home. I don't care. But, don't twist my words on an issue like this. Some of us have family and friends over in those hell holes and want them to assimilate into our society, and their families, as best they can when they come home. Grow up sonny.
People who come back from the battlefield ****ed up, had problems before they went. Combat only brought it to the surface. Just more actual experience.
Where in the hell did that come from? "They had problems before they went . . . that's the only reason why they came back with issues" - are you a psychologist? Pray tell, are you in their heads?
People come back ****ed up because they've been blown up and shot at - they come back ****ed up because they didn't have a solid nights sleep for over a year.
Those who come back without problems - yeah, goodie for them. Share the secret. Thousands and thousands would like to know how to get back to normal.
It does not matter if individual Marines don't mind dying for a stupid, misguided or hopeless cause. I mind. And so do alot of other Americans, and our opinions matter just as much as the Marines who are willing.In most cases, our opinions are more well thought out, because we are older and have more experience thinking about these things. We are also removed from the situation, and can provide perspective.
As for the Afghanistan war, I believe that what we are doing there is important, relevant and worthwhile. I am thankful for the Marines and other service members who are willing to die for my protection. But, I am not happy that they are dying, and each one I read about causes me to reassess whether it is worth it, and will continue to do so. I like my attitude about the matter much better than some callous person who gives no thought to the ultimate cost of war. I really don't think that we really want a society or policy that takes that calculation out of the equation. I mean, really.
Actually, your opinion doesn't matter as much as a serving member of the military. You wanna think it does, but trust me, it doesn't.
No, not a shrink. An actual combat soldier. Just speaking from personal experience. IMO, it's the people that vets come home to that cause most of the problems, with their lack of understanding as to what is actually going on in that person's grape. More than that, it's the inability of those people to openly admit that they have no clue and their insistance that they can, "help". I've noticed that in some cases the, "help", only made things worse.
The secret, IMO, is don't talk to people who haven't a single goddamn clue about what it's like to serve on a battlefield.
Your idea that sleep deprivation is a leading cause of PTSD only serves to prove my point.
Really. Because we all know that service members get two votes, while civilians only get one.
Oh, wait a minute... :doh
To the bolded, first, I never said that sleep deprivation is a leading cause of PTSD. I didn't remotely imply that - you read into what I wrote and tried to draw a conclusion. (See post #15 for my thoughts on the issue)
My husband is a soldier - and he helps soldiers adjust when they come home so I speak knowing all the experiences he's gone through and all the people he's helped. . .war changes people, regardless of what you say and how you feel about it, it changes people. Not everyone sure, there are those who have no issues - but quite a few, absolutely.
Your point in this quoted post is different than your point in the previous post.
In the first post you said that "people had problems before the left . . ." as a prelude to their post-war issues.
However, in this post you point to "the people they come home to . . . and their lack of understanding" as to why they have issues.
While I disagree with the first point, I do agree with the second point. Yes - family and friends can make things more complicated. . . which is why therapy and FRG meetings, etc, for the family is great - but can't cure all issues and answer all questions.
One of the issues my husband faced when coming home was the kids - the kids got under his skin. He was away from them for 16 months, coming home, the baby that was born while he was deployed was almost a year old. . .the balance in the house had shifted - all the kids were older, we had a different home-routine. Things were different for him when he came home than they were before he left, that was the hardest thing to adjust to - life was different. On top of having all the kids - I was still recovering from pregnancy related health issues, I, up until he came home, had to have help from my Mom. That was different, too, having her come over often and so on - things were just strange for him.
It took me (all of us, really) years to sort through some of the stuff that happened after my husband came back. It wasn't his first deployment, that's for sure, but he came home with issues that definitely weren't there before (before as in - long before we even met).
Actually, your opinion doesn't matter as much as a serving member of the military. You wanna think it does, but trust me, it doesn't.
Actually, your opinion doesn't matter as much as a serving member of the military. You wanna think it does, but trust me, it doesn't.
Actually, I am afraid mine generally does matter more. I have more time to devote to activism, if I so choose. I have more money than the average service member to contribute political campaigns. And so forth. So, the reality is that my opinion does matter more, if we're talking about effect. That's just the way it is.
It may not matter more to YOU. But, I really don't care about that.
Your error is, VoodooChild is a serving member of the military. His opinion counts more than your's, unless, of course, you are a serving member of the United States military. Are you?
While I may not have served in the military, my tax dollars, and the tax dollars of many others who haven't served, go to fund the military. When the military no longer asks for money from those who haven't served is when those who haven't served have no say in military affairs.
Whoever puts the money in the jukebox is whoever gets to pick the song.
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