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US shuts down major San Diego port of entry as migrants rush border

Trying to walk a very fine line

Chomsky said:
Given even the U.S.'s failure to maintain a border, I'm not sure Mexico has the ability to do so either. I'm all for secure borders, but I'm not sure Mexico has that capability.
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The logistics of enforcing the Mexico/Central American border are much easier than the logistics of enforcing the US/Mexico border. Just look @ a map sometime. The US supplies Mexico with financial & technical & training & equipment aid, to help Mexico in maintaining their border with Central America, & in the expectation that if people can't get into Mexico from C. America, then it's less likely that they can reach the US.

For historical reasons, it's hard for Mexico to even appear to be complying with US requests in terms of aligning their foreign policy with ours, or immigration policy. Finding common ground that we can cooperate on is a delicate task, & the Trump administration mostly finds the wrong things to say, @ every opportunity.
 
ecofarm said:
It was a fine analogy until you brought it to "putting the dogs down".

And, no, your hate rant is completely full of crap. When a crowd of 500 gets unruly, something that happens all the time, police do not "put the dogs down". So let's stow that hate fantasy.
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:confused: Hate rant? Hate fantasy? You DO know that I was just making a point about you using a bad analogy. I never commented on anything else. I even made a statement that I thought for sure that even YOU wouldn't take offense at. Where in my post is there ANY hate what so ever? Much less "hate rant" or "hate fantasy".

And if it was a "fine analogy" then I wouldn't have been able to point out how it wasn't a "fine analogy". Fine analogies don't have negatives.
 
It's obvious these "attackers" are crisis actors, supplying tRump the excuse to close the border.
 
ecofarm said:
Try telling people in line for a concert that procedures are changing.
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I get it, but there's a huge difference between trespassing or even rioting at a concert venue versus illegally rushing and then crossing an international border. The former might get you arrested, the latter can get you shot DRT.
 
Kal'Stang said:
:confused: Hate rant? Hate fantasy?
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Yes, obviously. You took the "dog bite man" saying to "dog must be put down", which is not part of the saying.

Now, why did you completely leave the context of the saying (that which is common, not that which bites) to venture into "put them down" territory?

When someone says, "news of shoplifting at Walmart is man bites dog", do you suggest we kill shoplifters? See how you left context?

Now, there's another way you left context. When you suggest the dog be put down, even claiming that the dog "IS put down usually", you forget we're talking about 500 largely innocent people. We're not talking about a dog that bit someone. That's just a saying. And you want to "put them down", or at least suggest it would be the logical thing to do.


So...

1. The saying is not actually concerning a dog, it's concerning a common occurrence. It needn't be a dog, it could be anything.

2. The saying does not include, "and the dog was put down because that's what we usually do".

3. We do not usually "put down" unruly crowds.


Your rambling is obtuse and idiotic hate. Nothing more.
 
digsbe said:
Maybe so, but it appears that the Mexican government has not tried to apprehend these people for being in Mexico illegally. They've been there for days/weeks and I'm sure under Mexican law they would merit deportation. They have facilitated this and I believe the US should take that as an act of aggression against our country.

This also bolsters the argument that the US needs to vastly vamp up border security and aggressively tackle illegal immigration.
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Quite frankly, I think Mexico is far too corrupt to handle this and they are not trustworthy. CF the war on drugs. Unfortunately, it seems we're on our own here ...
 
ecofarm said:
Try telling people in line for a concert that procedures are changing.
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They groan and then comply... they don't charge the gates and get a free concert.
 
Beaudreaux said:
I get it, but there's a huge difference between trespassing or even rioting at a concert venue versus illegally rushing and then crossing an international border. The former might get you arrested, the latter can get you shot DRT.
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Rushing a border crossing isn't getting anyone shot. This isn't Iraq. This is concert goers becoming unruly because the hosts are changing stuff.
 
Trade must flow

digsbe said:
Maybe so, but it appears that the Mexican government has not tried to apprehend these people for being in Mexico illegally. They've been there for days/weeks and I'm sure under Mexican law they would merit deportation. They have facilitated this and I believe the US should take that as an act of aggression against our country.

This also bolsters the argument that the US needs to vastly vamp up border security and aggressively tackle illegal immigration.
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And do what? Declare war on Mexico? We've already been there & done that - over Texas in the 1840s, the Mexican American War in 1846, the Mexican Incursion in 1916 (the latter a close call). We debated annexing Mexico @ the time - & we've always rejected the possibility - as too many people, too many languages, too many different cultures - political, legal, religious, cultural, ethnic. We captured Vera Cruz, Mexico City, & dictated terms - that's how we acquired NM, AZ, CA & parts of other western states.

Crowd control barriers & tear gas are par for the course, the only thing missing here is BP & ICE personnel in riot gear standing off any crowd trying to charge the border. That would likely be next, except that the caravans insisted that they would demonstrate @ the border crossings. Thus giving the US border agencies time to prepare defenses.
 
Re: Trying to walk a very fine line

southwest88 said:
The logistics of enforcing the Mexico/Central American border are much easier than the logistics of enforcing the US/Mexico border. Just look @ a map sometime. The US supplies Mexico with financial & technical & training & equipment aid, to help Mexico in maintaining their border with Central America, & in the expectation that if people can't get into Mexico from C. America, then it's less likely that they can reach the US.

For historical reasons, it's hard for Mexico to even appear to be complying with US requests in terms of aligning their foreign policy with ours, or immigration policy. Finding common ground that we can cooperate on is a delicate task, & the Trump administration mostly finds the wrong things to say, @ every opportunity.
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I'll accept your geographical evidence. But regardless, I believe Mexico is far too corrupt and financially impoverished to properly secure their own borders.
 
Bodhisattva said:
They groan and then comply... they don't charge the gates and get a free concert.
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They get unruly. Usually some get arrested. And some do, in fact, charge the gates. Google it.
 
Tanngrisnir said:
LOL! I was responding to an asinine, meaningless claim about places that don't exist and tailor my posts to suit who I'm addressing.

Good to see it's working.
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It was a metaphor... but I can see that this will end up becoming another meaningless and stupid exchange where you attempt to post something clever and for some stupid reason never stop... so address the argument or have a nice day.
 
Re: Trying to walk a very fine line

Chomsky said:
I'll accept your geographical evidence. But regardless, I believe Mexico is far too corrupt and financially impoverished to properly secure their own borders.
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Mexico does not maintain a border regarding non criminal immigration. Undocumented immigration is not a crime in Mexico. The "Mexico has strict immigration enforcement" is an outdated (at best) myth. Mexico's border is for military purpose, not civilian.
 
ecofarm said:
They get unruly. Usually some get arrested. And some do, in fact, charge the gates. Google it.
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That is generally because of alcohol... comparing those in line for a concert to those in line for changing their lives by seeking asylum into another country is a Straw Man of epic proportions....
 
Chomsky said:
Source: (CNN) US shuts down major San Diego port of entry as migrants rush border

It's currently a fast developing story, with only partial context.

From on-air reports, it seems the normal processing of asylum-seekers at this crossing is 60-100 per day. There is a tightly-packed migrant protest camp of 5,000 just across the border in Mexico, courtesy of the Mexican government and humane organizations. Just moments ago they eschewed the regular queue on the bridge to the border crossing, instead moving ad hoc to the end of the Mexican border, not able to reach the U.S. side (as of this moment).

In response the administration shut-down all crossings at this border, including both pedestrian and vehicular traffic in both directions (to & fro).

My comment on this? Marone! It's going to be a helluva' post holiday-weekend Monday morning commute! :doh

Edit: There seems to be some discrepancy over the size of this group, with MSNBC reporting a nearby migrant camp of 5K, and CNN reporting a group of 500 going to the border. I'm not sure if these two reports are necessarily exclusive to each other, but wanted to reflect this on-air development in my post.
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5k is close to what various local groups have been estimating. That said I don't think the entire crowd rushed the border. There is reportedly a core of agitators and radicals that have been trying to create confrontation.


Forcing the closure of that crossing is not going endear the caravaners to the local population who use that to go back and forth to jobs on the US side then go home to Tijuana.
 
Beaudreaux said:
Link? Proof? At least some modicum of factual support? Or, did I miss the sarcasm?
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It's someone from England. You missed massive sarcasm.
 
Verax said:
Orange Hitler's pincer attack on Texas working out beautifully.
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Ah, the predictable prog BTF - Blame Trump First lunacy pops up. Shame on him for demanding an orderly, lawful process. But "Trump!:twisted:" Right?
 
ecofarm said:
Rushing a border crossing isn't getting anyone shot. This isn't Iraq. This is concert goers becoming unruly because the hosts are changing stuff.
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You're view on this is unrealistically simplistic, just as my "will be shot" was an intentional overstatement to demonstrate the polar opposite. Here's the base line: they're the rules set by the US, not by those trying to enter the US, and if the folks trying to rush the border would follow the actual rules (US law in this instance - get in line and apply for visa entry or asylum) there would be no problem at the border.

I won't blame the US for the people rushing the border and trying to circumvent the rules.

A US President changed the rules which created "catch and release" and a different US President changed it again to more reflect US law.
 
Beaudreaux said:
You're view on this is unrealistically simplistic, just as my "will be shot" was an intentional overstatement to demonstrate the polar opposite. Here's the base line: they're the rules set by the US, not by those trying to enter the US, and if the folks trying to rush the border would follow the actual rules (US law in this instance - get in line and apply for visa entry or asylum) there would be no problem at the border.

I won't blame the US for the people rushing the border and trying to circumvent the rules.

A US President changed the rules which created "catch and release" and a different US President changed it again to more reflect US law.
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I'm not blaming the US. I'm keeping perspective. A crowd of 500 gets unruly every day in the Western world and we don't mow them down.

No one is getting shot. This isn't Iraq.

Let's keep perspective.
 
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