U.S. Aborted Raid on Qaeda Chiefs in Pakistan in ’05

[jfuh]

WASHINGTON, July 7 — A secret military operation in early 2005 to capture senior members of Al Qaeda in Pakistan’s tribal areas was aborted at the last minute after top Bush administration officials decided it was too risky and could jeopardize relations with Pakistan, according to intelligence and military officials. The target was a meeting of Al Qaeda’s leaders that intelligence officials thought included Ayman al-Zawahri, Osama bin Laden’s top deputy and the man believed to run the terrorist group’s operations.
But the mission was called off after Donald H. Rumsfeld, then the defense secretary, rejected the 11th-hour appeal of Porter J. Goss, then the director of the Central Intelligence Agency, officials said. Members of a Navy Seals unit in parachute gear had already boarded C-130 cargo planes in Afghanistan when the mission was canceled, said a former senior intelligence official involved in the planning.

Source


THe most incompetent administration in the history of the US. WE've already gotten the rep of unilateral action and yet here you terminate the 2nd best opportunity to get the SOB?
What the hell were these morons in the admin waiting for? November surprise the next year? The incompetence is just unparallel with any other administration I've ever known. So much for our "wise" and "brilliant" leader.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Source


THe most incompetent administration in the history of the US. WE've already gotten the rep of unilateral action and yet here you terminate the 2nd best opportunity to get the SOB?
What the hell were these morons in the admin waiting for? November surprise the next year? The incompetence is just unparallel with any other administration I've ever known. So much for our "wise" and "brilliant" leader.

The Pakistani's are an integral asset in the war on terror and that relationship should not be jeopardized, however, we should have done this anyway but I'm sure there's more information that the Democratic Financiers at the NYT's aren't telling us and ofcourse it's not like the previous administration was offered OBL on a silver platter now was it?

 

[RightinNYC]

I guarantee you that if we had tried this and it hadn't worked out, you and champs and the rest of your ilk would be on here excoriating the Bush administration for costing soldiers lives and damaging relations with Pakistan.

 

[Gardener]

So violating sovereignty is o.k. in some instances, but wrong in others?

It's a tough call to make, but if one is to have a position, that position should be consistant rather than just the product of partisanship.

 

[Hatuey]

I guarantee you that if we had tried this and it hadn't worked out, you and champs and the rest of your ilk would be on here excoriating the Bush administration for costing soldiers lives and damaging relations with Pakistan.

....how so? As far as I can tell Champs is only against the war in Iraq. Which is as we all know a catastrof@c|<. Seems to me like if this administration had put our soldiers out to do what they were supposed to do(which is catch Bin Laden) and not put them in a senseless war like Iraq is. Then their approval ratings would be much higher then they currently are.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

....how so?

I distinctly remember after a missille strike on AQ leaders in Pakistan the leftists on this site being up in arms about it, Right probably remembers it too, I'm not sure if you were here yet though.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Oh FYI people they're doing a replay of that "banned from PBS" documentary about Islamism vs. moderate Muslims today on Fox News I missed it the first time, so far it's pretty good.

 

[Hatuey]

I distinctly remember after a missille strike in Pakistan the leftists on this site being up in arms about it.

Which one? The one who missed the Al-Qaeda officials and hit 13 villagers and we still don't know whether or not we hit the actual target? :|

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Which one? The one who missed the Al-Qaeda officials and hit 13 villages and we still don't know whether or not we hit the actual target? :|

I'm not sure how a missile strike could hit "13 villages," but yep that would be the one thanks for proving my point.

 

[Hatuey]

I'm not sure how a missile strike could hit "13 villages," but yep that would be the one thanks for proving my point.

..unless your point was that people were up in arms about a botched missile strike that hit the wrong target....I don't see how that proved your point...not 13 villages sorry villagers*

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

..unless your point was that people were up in arms about a botched missile strike that hit the wrong target....I don't see how that proved your point...not 13 villages sorry villagers*

So you don't think any "villagers," would have been killed in this raid? And BTW if these villagers are entertaining AQ leadership as guests then to hell with them. Oh and where is your evidence that they hit the wrong target?

 

[Hatuey]

So you don't think any "villagers," would have been killed in this raid? And BTW if these villagers are entertaining AQ leadership as guests then to hell with them. Oh and where is your evidence that they hit the wrong target?

The strike killed 13 villagers. The original targets were AQ operatives. They hit the wrong people. When you aim for something and hit something else. Thats called a **** up. A botched attempt. A failure.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

The strike killed 13 villagers. The original targets were AQ operatives. They hit the wrong people. When you aim for something and hit something else. Thats called a **** up. A botched attempt. A failure.

And how do you know that these 13 villagers weren't killed into addition to the target?

 

[Hatuey]

And how do you know that these 13 villagers weren't killed into addition to the target?

If they had. It wouldn't have been "U.S. officials believe" it would have been "U.S. officials confirmed that the intended target was also hit".

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

If they had. It wouldn't have been "U.S. officials believe" it would have been "U.S. officials confirmed that the intended target was also hit".

Why wouldn't it be "we missed" ?

 

[dixon76710]

Source


THe most incompetent administration in the history of the US.

Hmmm?
"Pakistan", "early 2005", "Osama bin Laden’s top deputy and the man believed to run the terrorist group’s operations". That would probably be Abu Faraj al-Libbi captured in May 2005 by the Pakistani ISI. Or maybe Haitham al-Yemeni who was in line to replace al-Libbi, but was taken out with a predator and a hell fire missile in March 2005 in Pakistan. Or maybe al Qaeda operations chief Abu Hamza Rabia who was taken out with a missile in December 2005 in Pakistan. Then there was Khalid Habib, the al Qaeda operations chief for Pakistan and Afghanistan, and Abdul Rehman al Magrabi, a senior operations commander for al Qaeda, taken out with a US bomb in January 2006 in Pakistan.
Navy seals?? the tribal mountains of Pakistan?? PARACHUTES?? Maybe not incompetent, simply reasonable.

 

[dixon76710]

Which one? The one who missed the Al-Qaeda officials and hit 13 villagers and we still don't know whether or not we hit the actual target? :|

I believe it was 18 civilians, 6 of them kids. And the Alqaeda officials were hit. Khalid Habib, the al Qaeda operations chief for Pakistan and Afghanistan, and Abdul Rehman al Magrabi, a senior operations commander for al Qaeda and Zawahiris Brother in law, taken out with a US missile in January 2006 in Damadola Pakistan. Zawahiri was supposed to be there for that one as well.

 

[dixon76710]

If they had. It wouldn't have been "U.S. officials believe" it would have been "U.S. officials confirmed that the intended target was also hit".

..........

ABC News has learned that Pakistani officials now believe that al Qaeda's master bomb maker and chemical weapons expert was one of the men killed in last week's U.S. missile attack in eastern Pakistan.

Midhat Mursi, 52, also known as Abu Khabab al-Masri, was identified by Pakistani authorities as one of four known major al Qaeda leaders present at an apparent terror summit in the village of Damadola early last Friday morning.

Pakistani officials also said that Khalid Habib, the al Qaeda operations chief for Pakistan and Afghanistan, and Abdul Rehman al Magrabi, a senior operations commander for al Qaeda, were killed in the Damadola attack.
ABC News: U.S. Strike Killed Al Qaeda Bomb Maker

The deputy leader(Zawahiri) of al-Qa'ida may have survived an American air strike in Pakistan because he did not turn up to a dinner at which he was expected. As the reports emerged yesterday, thousands of Pakistanis took part in angry street protests at the air strike, in which 18 civilians are believed to have died, including six children.
'No evidence' that Zawahiri was present when bomb hit Independent, The (London) - Find Articles

 

[Kandahar]

Should we have gone for this snatch and grab job?
Yes
No, here's why

How are we possibly supposed to make an informed decision about this? We don't have access to the same information the Pentagon did.

 

[jfuh]

I guarantee you that if we had tried this and it hadn't worked out, you and champs and the rest of your ilk would be on here excoriating the Bush administration for costing soldiers lives and damaging relations with Pakistan.

Champs or the rest of "ilk" I've no idea, but as for myself you're wrong big time. Had they did this in 2005 it would've been a great victory, yet instead what has happened? OBL is still at large and far more influential than ever before.
Would I still be screaming foul about Iraq though? Absolutely. But that's because Iraq had nothing at all to do whatsoever with OBL.
The Bush admin is incompetent, those they should strike they don't, those they shouldn't they do. Those initiatives where they should take unilateral leadership actions they don't, those that they shouldn't they do. They do the exact opposite of what they should be doing.
Of course, I'll give a bit here in that hind sight is 20/20. However that Iraq had anything to do with AQ and his lot was not a matter of debate at all within the admin. They were going in regardless of.

I've said it a million times here, I've supported the war in Afghanistan, but not in Iraq. If taking out OBL meant going over into Pakistan so be it - afterall, aren't they our "allies"?

 

[jfuh]

So violating sovereignty is o.k. in some instances, but wrong in others?

It's a tough call to make, but if one is to have a position, that position should be consistant rather than just the product of partisanship.

There are multiple ways of doing this, we could give the pakistannis a heads up with, hey we're going in and taking out this guy, if it means war with you so be it, but we're taking this guy out - this is a notice.
Or something more so diplomatic than that.
The first mistake was letting the Afghani warlords going in to try and "grab" OBL, you would think that by '05 they would've known better?
The administration didn't reject this because it was an invasion of sovereignty, no, they rejected this because the task force was "too big". In otherwords they were worried about the image they would project from such, they wanted to keep it small and "on the cheap" sound familiar?

 

[jfuh]

I distinctly remember after a missille strike on AQ leaders in Pakistan the leftists on this site being up in arms about it, Right probably remembers it too, I'm not sure if you were here yet though.

If that missle strike resulted in the confirmed death of OBL, you would've heard a different tone. But instead what happened? It hit the wrong fracking target.
Hell, the GOP wouldn't have lost congress in '06 and the neocons would still be in power.
You're darling Boy George failed yet again.

 

[jfuh]

How are we possibly supposed to make an informed decision about this? We don't have access to the same information the Pentagon did.

Let me rephrase then:
Based on what we do know from what has been released by the Pentagon should we have gone in on this snatch and grab job?
Unfortunately the poll is limited in the number of characters allowed to be used.

 

[Binary_Digit]

If that missle strike resulted in the confirmed death of OBL, you would've heard a different tone. But instead what happened? It hit the wrong fracking target.

It killed 3 senior al'Qaeda members, how do you figure it hit the wrong target? (see post #18 by dixon76710)

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

If that missle strike resulted in the confirmed death of OBL, you would've heard a different tone. But instead what happened? It hit the wrong fracking target.

Disproven conculsuively by Dixon in post 18. And just like Right said if this attack had went ahead and not gone according to plan you people would be bitching about that too.