Transsurdity of the Day: Vagina is for Trans; Front Hole, Cis

[Brochacholomigo]

Knowing that because of the work that I do with someone, they can actually find happiness and success in life. To some extent, it's about making a difference.

Thank you. That's all I had to ask for now.

 

[Jane]

Correction. Just one of the few examples that anti-trans folks love to present when they can't prove their position with logic, facts, or numbers. Accepting the lack of logic in your position is your choice.

Seems like an odd thing to say for our resident anonymous expert who basically uses cultural woo words to discuss various trans issues. I'd be great if people could just ignore CC's trolling (what's this now in the thread for him - 60, 70 issue-free posts?) and force him to confine his anger issues to a more appropriate place for the way he wants to interact.

Calamity, I thought that trans couple was fairly "out there" when I first saw one of their videos. But what I've heard from them has usually provided food for thought. I'm not a big follower of detransioning news. It mostly seems to play out on private blogs, YouTube postings and Facebook groups. The people who have the courage to talk about their usually lousy experiences seem to be relatively young and born female. They sound like they've had a hard time finding each other, but value those venues where they can share their experiences. Of course, many of them are in therapy, but probably not with the therapists who guided them previously into trans land, T injections, maybe double mastectomies.

I've no reason to think that FtTs have these detransitioning experiences more than MtTs but it seems that way since the loudest transactivist MtTs shout down people in mixed settings online who don't toe the transactivist party line. And then there's everybody's get-out-of-jail-free card: "Oh, well you must have never been a real transsexual to begin with."

There are also some sharp folks out there (who attract a huge amount of crap from the trans clones) who post about being transwomen AND understanding that they're males; who understand the perniciousness of culturally-mandated gender roles.

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

Seems like an odd thing to say for our resident anonymous expert who basically uses cultural woo words to discuss various trans issues. I'd be great if people could just ignore CC's trolling (what's this now in the thread for him - 60, 70 issue-free posts?) and force him to confine his anger issues to a more appropriate place for the way he wants to interact.

Not odd at all, Jane. Accurate. So, are you willing to be educated yet?

Calamity, I thought that trans couple was fairly "out there" when I first saw one of their videos. But what I've heard from them has usually provided food for thought. I'm not a big follower of detransioning news. It mostly seems to play out on private blogs, YouTube postings and Facebook groups. The people who have the courage to talk about their usually lousy experiences seem to be relatively young and born female. They sound like they've had a hard time finding each other, but value those venues where they can share their experiences. Of course, many of them are in therapy, but probably not with the therapists who guided them previously into trans land, T injections, maybe double mastectomies.

I've no reason to think that FtTs have these detransitioning experiences more than MtTs but it seems that way since the loudest transactivist MtTs shout down people in mixed settings online who don't toe the transactivist party line. And then there's everybody's get-out-of-jail-free card: "Oh, well you must have never been a real transsexual to begin with."

There are also some sharp folks out there (who attract a huge amount of crap from the trans clones) who post about being transwomen AND understanding that they're males; who understand the perniciousness of culturally-mandated gender roles.

Tell us, Jane... what is the percentage of transsexuals who go through transitioning and are unhappy with the outcome?

 

[William Rea]

My area of expertise is working with teenagers and young adults. I specialize in "difficult" cases, suicidality, eating disorders, self-injury, things like that. Working with transsexuals is a sub-specialty that often doesn't relate to the other areas of which I work... though many of the transsexuals of which I've worked have been teenagers and young adults. Transsexuals make up about one-sixth to one-eighth of my caseload at any given time.

So, in general terms, what is the process and how long would you typically see a transsexual before considering 'signing off' their transition? What other factors do you consider? Do you consider that what is being presented as transsexualism is perhaps not actually that but, some other diagnosis presenting as such?

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

So, in general terms, what is the process and how long would you typically see a transsexual before considering 'signing off' their transition?

Depends. MINIMUM 3 months. I will not sign off on any transition if they are under 18. I'd say the average of how long I see someone before "signing off" on their transition is 6 months. I want to be sure. And there have been two clients that I would not "sign off" on because of co-morbid diagnoses that made identifying GDD as a primary diagnosis impossible.

What other factors do you consider?

Any other diagnosis that could be clouding the presentation. Depression, anxiety, personality disorders, PTSD, or psychosexual disorders would be some key differentials. Age and sexual history are other factors.

Do you consider that what is being presented as transsexualism is perhaps not actually that but, some other diagnosis presenting as such?

Yes. Transsexuality is pretty rare. I know a lot about the issue and about other issues that could present as transsexuality. I have a very intense and complete assessment process. I'm sure at times, the individual may be thinking that they are trying to convince me. That's actually not the case, but I do go into all assessments in a completely neutral position. I have my assessment process and that process will tell me what I need to know. Transitioning is a pretty significant event. I want to be as sure as I possibly can be before I "sign off". For example, I will be getting a new trans client in the next few days. The individual's old therapist (who doesn't know much about transsexuality) told me that the client is very depressed. My first determination will be whether the depression is related to GDD or something else. If it is something else, before considering transitioning and before getting too heavy into my assessment, alleviating the depressive symptoms is key. The co-morbidity of the depression will "poison" the assessment process.

 

[roguenuke]

Extortion for sex is not rape in many states. You're reaching, by the way.
Is sex by blackmail ‘rapeâ€[emoji769]? – Benchmarks

But it is rape in some at least and obviously people have different definitions of rape. There is a reason I asked it the way I did.


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[roguenuke]

I'm guessing like many, at least the men I know, that its because 99% of the time being woken up that way would indeed be welcome. Worst case, you're not feeling well, you stop it, no big..you don't yell at your GF/wife "you are raping me!" What kind if inconsiderate asshole would berate their sexual partner like that for such a silly thing? If it was someone you were NOT in a sexual relationship with, or you were NOT sleeping in the same bed, entirely different. Carrying these issues to the extreme is absurd, but it does allow us to find the limits of particular arguments/movements...and there are limits to any such argument.

99% of the time, women feel the same way. It isn't a guy thing. Most women would not consider such a thing rape most of the time. It would always come down to that small percent when it would be, but it could be by either.


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[roguenuke]

Uh, no. I say it for a simple biological fact. Men wake up with a hard on--healthy ones, all the time. A mate willing to take care of that...uh, issue, would be very welcome at that moment.

Women can wake up that way too, be horny and still not want that particular person to have sex with them, which would be the same for men.


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[roguenuke]

Another, "she didn't really say that, did she?" moment!!!! This is the same poster who doubted FBI rape stats I quoted because she had a different definition of rape than they used. [adds another whopper to the roguenuke list of greatest hits]

What lie is there in here? Many have a different definition of rape. Even the FBI have changed theirs. The CDC and many others have a different definition than the FBI.


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[Jane]

Not odd at all, Jane. Accurate. So, are you willing to be educated yet?

Oh hi! You just interrupted another of my fruitless searches in the DP archives trying to discover what your actual credentials are to educate us. You never seem to address that directly, other than to say you're a psychotherapist, which could mean darn near anything. Maybe you have a BA in something; maybe an MSW. So come on! Is that asking too much? It's an anonymous forum, after all. You could say anything and we might believe you.

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

Oh hi! You just interrupted another of my fruitless searches in the DP archives trying to discover what your actual credentials are to educate us. You never seem to address that directly, other than to say you're a psychotherapist, which could mean darn near anything. Maybe you have a BA in something; maybe an MSW. So come on! Is that asking too much? It's an anonymous forum, after all. You could say anything and we might believe you.

You didn't answer my question. Do you want to be educated on this topic, or do you want to remain ignorant?

 

[Jane]

You didn't answer my question. Do you want to be educated on this topic, or do you want to remain ignorant?

Nor did you answer mine about your educational credentials.

I really don't have any desire to talk with you after getting a taste of how you interact with other posters, on this forum and elsewhere. I find it distasteful. I took the opportunity to populate my ignore list with people after a bit of observation elsewhere. Unfortunately, I discovered that I couldn't put mods on ignore. :mrgreen: Oh well! But there's certainly nothing to keep you from starting some threads about topics you find personally interesting and "educating" others, is there?

 

[William Rea]

Oh hi! You just interrupted another of my fruitless searches in the DP archives trying to discover what your actual credentials are to educate us. You never seem to address that directly, other than to say you're a psychotherapist, which could mean darn near anything. Maybe you have a BA in something; maybe an MSW. So come on! Is that asking too much? It's an anonymous forum, after all. You could say anything and we might believe you.

CC could tell us anything he wants regarding his credentials and it would make no difference with the anonymity in here so, I am interested in why you need to know this? All that we have available to judge each other in here is the content of our posts and when I read CC's posts, his claims are plausible, I can verify them against those of other professionals that I have come into contact with. Now, he could just be repeating the words of professionals that he has read online in order to try to dupe people into believing that he is qualified. The point is, even if that is the case, what he posts does not contradict what little else I know or have read myself so, I can plausibly accept his claim and if he is blagging, it makes no actual difference to the veracity of what he says, it is true either way.

Your 'fruitless searching' has the hallmarks of someone trying to dox another poster on here for whatever reasons you feel a need to satisfy. My suggestion is to stop trying to do that and stop trying to turn yourself in knots to feed this obsession. Being wrong is not a crime, there have been men that have been wrong before as well so, don't feel to bad about being wrong on trans topics my dear.

 

[calamity]

Correction. Just one of the few examples that anti-trans folks love to present when they can't prove their position with logic, facts, or numbers. Accepting the lack of logic in your position is your choice.

Seems to me there is no "anti" anything in that video presenting information. It is two "trans folk" who are doing the presenting. Primarily they are presenting their dissatisfaction with how their issues have been addressed by the so-called professionals in this field. But, to admit that might hurt your ego.

 

[calamity]

This is just you sour grapes at being defeated over and over on this issue. I've presented the numbers; you've failed to refute them. No one really cares what you believe since your beliefs are based on an ignorant and biased anti-trans agenda. I've challenged you many times to refute the numbers. Each time you've failed.



The numbers don't lie. You, on the other hand, tend to.

The numbers you presented for trans-satisfaction are unrealistically high and are not supported by objective realities. High suicide rates, drug addictions, criminal activity, mental health issues and social maladjustment persist. None of those spell satisfied customer.

 

[William Rea]

The numbers you presented for trans-satisfaction are unrealistically high and are not supported by objective realities. High suicide rates, drug addictions, criminal activity, mental health issues and social maladjustment persist. None of those spell satisfied customer.

Yes, and this is not the first time that this has been explained and I doubt given your track record it will be the last. It is boring that you never come back with anything that demonstrates that you understand the nuances.

 

[Jane]

The numbers you presented for trans-satisfaction are unrealistically high and are not supported by objective realities. High suicide rates, drug addictions, criminal activity, mental health issues and social maladjustment persist. None of those spell satisfied customer.

You know, since you often argue over the efficacy of "sex reassignment" surgery, with the therapist arguing that SRS is the greatest thing since sliced bread, it might be interesting to ask how he can account for the fact that the Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services (CMS) recently decided not to establish a national policy on gender reassignment surgery. Why would that be, you might ask, since he claims that everyone in the medical community is in agreement that these are medically necessary procedures?

The question they sought to answer was: “Does gender reassignment surgery improve health outcomes for Medicare beneficiaries with gender dysphoria?”

The decision memo from the CMS basically left things status quo - requiring a case-by-case determination by the local Medicare Administrative Contractors (MACs). The CMS came to this conclusion after an apparently extensive review of the relevant literature indicated that the clinical evidence on the procedure is inconclusive for Medicare beneficiaries with gender dysphoria.

The memo is not a quick or easy read in itself, and certainly most lay people aren't going to follow up by reading much of the primary literature. But it points out key problems with regard to study design, and gaps in the clinical evidence that need to be addressed.
https://www.cms.gov/medicare-coverage-database/details/nca-proposed-decision-memo.aspx?NCAId=282

 

[William Rea]

You know, since you often argue over the efficacy of "sex reassignment" surgery, with the therapist arguing that SRS is the greatest thing since sliced bread...

Which, as is the way with your posts, is a straw man that no one has argued. Why do you argue with yourself so much?

 

[maquiscat]

Oh hey, this thread is somehow still alive. You would think people would run out of stuff to say about a pamphlet after a few hundred posts, but apparently not. I wonder if this thread is exactly the same as every other thread about transsexuals?

It's moved seriously off topic of the phamplet for a while now.

 

[TheGoverness]

Oh hey, this thread is somehow still alive. You would think people would run out of stuff to say about a pamphlet after a few hundred posts, but apparently not. I wonder if this thread is exactly the same as every other thread about transsexuals?

Yep. These kind of threads always devolve over time.

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

Nor did you answer mine about your educational credentials.

I don't offer up my credentials to someone who has no intention or desire to learn anything. This is about the issue, not about how much time I've spent in school.

I really don't have any desire to talk with you after getting a taste of how you interact with other posters, on this forum and elsewhere. I find it distasteful. I took the opportunity to populate my ignore list with people after a bit of observation elsewhere. Unfortunately, I discovered that I couldn't put mods on ignore. :mrgreen: Oh well! But there's certainly nothing to keep you from starting some threads about topics you find personally interesting and "educating" others, is there?

I find this topic interesting and I don't like starting threads. If you are going to post on this topic, especially in the way that you do, expect me to respond.

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

Seems to me there is no "anti" anything in that video presenting information. It is two "trans folk" who are doing the presenting. Primarily they are presenting their dissatisfaction with how their issues have been addressed by the so-called professionals in this field. But, to admit that might hurt your ego.

The "anti" folks aren't the people in the video. They are people like you who attempt to use the video prove their point, but since the video does not, you fail whenever you try this.

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

The numbers you presented for trans-satisfaction are unrealistically high and are not supported by objective realities. High suicide rates, drug addictions, criminal activity, mental health issues and social maladjustment persist. None of those spell satisfied customer.

This has been explained to you over and over. You have been proven wrong on this point more times than anyone can count. You have offered nothing credible in the way of evidence to counter the numbers. Your only response is "well, I don't buy it". That's about the extent of your debate ability on this topic, calamity. Nada.

 

[calamity]

The "anti" folks aren't the people in the video. They are people like you who attempt to use the video prove their point, but since the video does not, you fail whenever you try this.

The couple in the video have hundreds of videos and those clips represent the feelings of hundreds, if not thousands, of trans who absolutely hate what has been done to them by quacks. I know you are going to ignore their stories. That's why I posted the link to their page.

 

[calamity]

This has been explained to you over and over. You have been proven wrong on this point more times than anyone can count. You have offered nothing credible in the way of evidence to counter the numbers. Your only response is "well, I don't buy it". That's about the extent of your debate ability on this topic, calamity. Nada.

I'll let Jane answer that since she does a great job of debunking your mansplaining.

You know, since you often argue over the efficacy of "sex reassignment" surgery, with the therapist arguing that SRS is the greatest thing since sliced bread, it might be interesting to ask how he can account for the fact that the Centers for Medicare & Medicaid Services (CMS) recently decided not to establish a national policy on gender reassignment surgery. Why would that be, you might ask, since he claims that everyone in the medical community is in agreement that these are medically necessary procedures?

The question they sought to answer was: “Does gender reassignment surgery improve health outcomes for Medicare beneficiaries with gender dysphoria?”

The decision memo from the CMS basically left things status quo - requiring a case-by-case determination by the local Medicare Administrative Contractors (MACs). The CMS came to this conclusion after an apparently extensive review of the relevant literature indicated that the clinical evidence on the procedure is inconclusive for Medicare beneficiaries with gender dysphoria.

The memo is not a quick or easy read in itself, and certainly most lay people aren't going to follow up by reading much of the primary literature. But it points out key problems with regard to study design, and gaps in the clinical evidence that need to be addressed.
https://www.cms.gov/medicare-coverage-database/details/nca-proposed-decision-memo.aspx?NCAId=282