To all Christians who think that they are being persecuted in America[W:610] (1 Viewer)

[AGENT J]

I just don't understand the purpose of the lie. I mean some things are up for debate and some things are opinion but when a right is lost is VERY easy to show. The evidence is abundant and the process isn't a small one but yet there's none to support these claims and some how they just want the majority of people to believe their empty cries. Well, we don't buy it.

Of course not, the majority don't because they are more honest and educated than that and have to much respect for themselves and others to play the false victim card.

 

[AGENT J]

Again, why should I waste my time with trolls who want "one more" reason after so many have already been listed? Really, it's not my fault you can't read.

I think we're done here.

Another post with no religious rights listed and another loss by you, I love it. What trolls? you mean every other poster in this thread besides like about 2-3 (who haven't been able to post one single right we lost) that acknowledge the fact that you nor I have lost any religious rights. Those posters? Please, tell us more!

You'll never get that list because a factual and truthful one simply doesn't exist.

 

[blackjack50]

And this is where i diasgree. I dont see where a private owned buisiness needs to cite relgion in order for it to choose who it does and does not service.

Some stores dont allow unaccompinied minors in them. Why isnt that illegal?
Biker bars wont allow them to wear certain colors
Resteraunts have dress codes
If a buisiness does not want the gay communities patronage i dont see why we need the gov to force it

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My question is why would a gay person want to give money to a person who doesn't accept their lifestyle?

I don't give my money to the dicks at dick sporting goods because they don't sell handguns or "assault rifles." I also won't buy ammo from them. I vote with my wallet. Just like gay people.


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[trouble13]

This couple is running a business. They have to abide by anti discrimination laws. They are not a church or even a religious based organization. They operated as a public business/accommodation.

That is not the same thing as a priest refusing to marry someone. Clergy, those who wed someone through a church, are doing so as church service not a business service.


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What is the difference between a church and a buisiness. It would seem that the way you are defining it everything provided to the public is a public utility and subject to any discrimatory law tje gov sees fit to apply.

Somebody, i think it might of been you mentioned earlier that anyone can become ordained easily enough, which is true. So are we going to say the only enterprise that is allowed to discriminate who it does buissiness with are religious entities?

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[trouble13]

It has to be sold as part of a public business, as service or merchandise revenue.


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Can you give me an example of something that would not fall under that denifition?

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[trouble13]

There's no question that it's fake. As with many of these things, it's hard to tell the extremists from the ridicule.

The following bio on the "author" is a clue. "Born at an early age...."

No i agree it was fake.and im embarassed that i got fooled by it. I hastily posted it without bothering to really researching it because the religious aspect is not the focal point of my argument. The central point to my argument is that private owned buisinesses have the right to pick and choose who they do it with and how they do it. I know some argue its a matter of religious freedom but i dont see where that is necessary. Nobody should be forced to do anything against their will.

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[roguenuke]

What is the difference between a church and a buisiness. It would seem that the way you are defining it everything provided to the public is a public utility and subject to any discrimatory law tje gov sees fit to apply.

Somebody, i think it might of been you mentioned earlier that anyone can become ordained easily enough, which is true. So are we going to say the only enterprise that is allowed to discriminate who it does buissiness with are religious entities?

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The line is drawn at being a business. A church is not a business. A person who legally can do wedding ceremonies must register with the state. If they are paid directly or through a business for that service, they are a business. Church pastors aren't paid directly via a legitimate business transaction to perform a marriage ceremony. Their livelihood does not depend on that one service type.


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[roguenuke]

Can you give me an example of something that would not fall under that denifition?

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Church service. Advice from your mother or friend. Doing something nice for a neighbor.


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[trouble13]

My question is why would a gay person want to give money to a person who doesn't accept their lifestyle?

I don't give my money to the dicks at dick sporting goods because they don't sell handguns or "assault rifles." I also won't buy ammo from them. I vote with my wallet. Just like gay people.


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Thats exactly how a free an open marketplace should work. What people are essentially arguing os that dicks should be obligated to seel you a gun because you have a right to own one. If they dont the gov should fine or jail them. I wonder how antigun people would feel about being forved to sell guns

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[roguenuke]

Thats exactly how a free an open marketplace should work. What people are essentially arguing os that dicks should be obligated to seel you a gun because you have a right to own one. If they dont the gov should fine or jail them. I wonder how antigun people would feel about being forved to sell guns

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No we haven't argued that. What is being argued is that Dicks should not be allowed to refuse to sell a gun or any product they actually do sell to the public, in their stores to people who are Christian or Muslim, white or black or Native American, or gay or straight.


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[trouble13]

The line is drawn at being a business. A church is not a business. A person who legally can do wedding ceremonies must register with the state. If they are paid directly or through a business for that service, they are a business. Church pastors aren't paid directly via a legitimate business transaction to perform a marriage ceremony. Their livelihood does not depend on that one service type.


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Thats a pretty ticky tacly argument your making. I could definitely argue that churches are buisinesses or at least run like them. Weddings are just one of many products that they sell.

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[nota bene]

Thats a pretty ticky tacly argument your making. I could definitely argue that churches are buisinesses or at least run like them. Weddings are just one of many products that they sell.

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I've never thought of a church/synagogue wedding or funeral as a "product" to be "sold."

 

[trouble13]

Church service. Advice from your mother or friend. Doing something nice for a neighbor.


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I feel like your being obtuse with your answer. Im asking for an example of a private owned buisiness. Are you being obtuse because as you define it there are no examples?

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[trouble13]

I've never thought of a church/synagogue wedding or funeral as a "product" to be "sold."

Thats what it is though. You pay a fee for their service

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[nota bene]

Thats what it is though. You pay a fee for their service

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Do you mean that you gift the officiant with an honorarium?

 

[Garydog]

I've never thought of a church/synagogue wedding or funeral as a "product" to be "sold."

Private wedding venues would beg to differ.

 

[blackjack50]

No we haven't argued that. What is being argued is that Dicks should not be allowed to refuse to sell a gun or any product they actually do sell to the public, in their stores to people who are Christian or Muslim, white or black or Native American, or gay or straight.


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Why should they sell to anyone? And if they dislike them...why should the person buy from them?


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[nota bene]

Private wedding venues would beg to differ.

I am aware that there are professional wedding officiants. I referred to churches and synagogues.

 

[Garydog]

I am aware that there are professional wedding officiants. I referred to churches and synagogues.

Who are still paid.

 

[nota bene]

Who are still paid.

That is not necessarily true.

 

[trouble13]

Do you mean that you gift the officiant with an honorarium?

I mean they dont provide their service for free. How they collect pay isnt relivent.

Would you argue that wikipedia isnt a business because it asks for donations instead of directly charging its customers?

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[AGENT J]

Thats exactly how a free an open marketplace should work. What people are essentially arguing os that dicks should be obligated to seel you a gun because you have a right to own one. If they dont the gov should fine or jail them. I wonder how antigun people would feel about being forved to sell guns

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Those arent the same on any level? maybe reword what you are trying to say because it's not coming off clear, relevant or analogous at all the way you stated it.

 

[AGENT J]

Thats a pretty ticky tacly argument your making. I could definitely argue that churches are buisinesses or at least run like them. Weddings are just one of many products that they sell.

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No you couldnt because legality wise, tax wise, zoning and per business laws/rules a church is not a buinsess

 

[it's just me]

What is the difference between a church and a buisiness. It would seem that the way you are defining it everything provided to the public is a public utility and subject to any discrimatory law tje gov sees fit to apply.

Somebody, i think it might of been you mentioned earlier that anyone can become ordained easily enough, which is true. So are we going to say the only enterprise that is allowed to discriminate who it does buissiness with are religious entities?

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Go get yourself ordained in a mainstream church and let me know how easy it is. See you in 6-7 years, if they listen to you at all.

 

[it's just me]

That is not necessarily true.

I'd like to know where all of this money in the Church is, I haven't seen any of it yet.

And as far as gifting the officiant at weddings, why bother, he has nothing else to do with his time...