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The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498;864]

re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

An MBA? MBAs are for retards. I've an MSc. International Environmental Science. I lived in Sweden for two years, traveled Europe, spent time in Amsterdam, spent days in London, dated a Russian (grad student) with a very thick accent and spent months in rural Africa.

What does this have to do with the civil war in Syria?
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

What does this have to do with the civil war in Syria?

I was responding to someones post.
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

Moderator's Warning:
How about we hop back on topic folks and cease with the personal comments directed at each other. The topic is not your own personal achievements or how good looking you think you might be. The topic is Syria. Thanks for listening.
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

They were always prominent Jack.....they are Officers who Defected from Assad. None will accept their rule or being in power. From the get go with al-Assad it was the same. They are talking about they have 85 % of the Country. They wont acknowledge Idris and the FSA. They are saying it all across the Country. They say they will attack us after Assad. Do you think they are lying? Saying it for nothing?

Yes. I think they're lying. Syrians aren't fundamentalist people. It's like claiming Southern Baptists are going to take over Massachusetts.:cool:
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

Yes. I think they're lying. Syrians aren't fundamentalist people. It's like claiming Southern Baptists are going to take over Massachusetts.:cool:

Neither are the Egyptians.

Who won the majority of Parliament in the last elections? The Muslim Brotherhood.
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

Yeah, but if we don't intervene Assad's going to regain control or Islamists will dominate the rebels and then achieve victory. There isn't going to be a civil war forever, you know.

No, but in the meantime why don't we let Hezbollah duke it out with al-Nusra?

Your point? You don't seem to understand that Syria is not Iraq.

What you don't seem to understand is that ethnic tribal and religious affiliations transcend national borders created arbitrarily after WWI and the fall of the Ottoman Empire. So the Sunnis who are heading into Syria from Iraq will be flowing back and forth along that border. The other point I'm making is, as Iraq apparently falls into chaos once again, we can see the folly of trying to build a so-called unity government around people who don't want much to do with each other. While Syria is roughly 75% Sunni, the other Muslim sects (Alawite and Druze) are large enough to pose a serious problem to any government we might help install. And you can bet your sweet bippy al-Nusra and other jihadist groups will want their place at the table. Good luck disarming them.
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

They also said that the Iraqis would welcome our invasion with flowers and candy.

Different plan altogether. I'm not proposing that a single American goes to Syria. We help people willing to fight for themselves.:cool:
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

Different plan altogether. I'm not proposing that a single American goes to Syria. We help people willing to fight for themselves.:cool:

What if they aren't fighting for democracy and equality?

Do we still arm them?
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

Yes. I think they're lying. Syrians aren't fundamentalist people. It's like claiming Southern Baptists are going to take over Massachusetts.:cool:

Not when there is 78 million of them and they are now the majority of an oppositional population. Not when Sunni Clerics in every Sunni County are calling for the Destruction of the Shia. Moreover not when their Leaders are openly saying such around the Press. Not caring who hears them. Not caring what they say and to who. As they think they are the Power.

Sectarian Genocide by the Rebels is quite different than what Assad is doing. Assad cannot wipe out 78 Million Sunni Muslims. Assad has been going after those who are supporting those Specific Sunni Muslims.....why? What is the reason?

Again the Rebels are at least Responsible for 1/3rd of the 93k they say have been killed inside Syria. Plus we know they have used chemical weapons. They will use Chemical weapons and any means necessary to get rid of Assad and the Alawites. Any means.....lying, and every single underhanded trick in the book. Even if it violates humanitarian laws.
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

What if they aren't fighting for democracy and equality?

Do we still arm them?

Democracy and equality would be best, but I'll settle for knocking out Assad's pro-Iran, pro-Hezbollah regime.:cool:
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

This may end up being Obama's greatest mistake.

If the Sunnis win and execute largscale massacres against Alawites and Shiites, Obama will own that.

If Syria becomes a haven for Al Qaeda and is taken over by extremists, Obama will own that.
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

Well.....Where do you think the Muslim Brotherhood's Leadership resides?

The Muslim Brotherhood in Syria was founded in the 1930s (according to lexicorient.com) or in 1945, a year before independence from France, (according to journalist Robin Wright). In the first decade or so of independence it was part of the legal opposition, and in the 1961 parliamentary elections it won ten seats (5.8% of the house). But after the 1963 coup that brought the Baath Party to power it was banned.[63] It played a major role in the mainly Sunni-based movement that opposed the secularist, pan-Arabist Baath party. This conflict developed into an armed struggle that continued until culminating in the Hama uprising of 1982, when the rebellion was crushed by the military.[64]

Membership in the Syrian Brotherhood became a capital offence in Syria in 1980 (under Emergency Law 49, which was revoked in 2011), but the headquarters of the Muslim Brotherhood-linked Palestinian group, Hamas, was located in the Syria's capital Damascus, where it was given Syrian government support. This has been cited as an example of the lack of international centralisation or even coordination of the Muslim Brotherhood.[65]

The Brotherhood is said to have "resurrected itself" and become "dominant group" in the opposition during the Syrian civil war against the Assad regime according to the Washington Post newspaper.[66]

Big deal.:cool:
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

The Muslim Brotherhood in Syria was founded in the 1930s (according to lexicorient.com) or in 1945, a year before independence from France, (according to journalist Robin Wright). In the first decade or so of independence it was part of the legal opposition, and in the 1961 parliamentary elections it won ten seats (5.8% of the house). But after the 1963 coup that brought the Baath Party to power it was banned.[63] It played a major role in the mainly Sunni-based movement that opposed the secularist, pan-Arabist Baath party. This conflict developed into an armed struggle that continued until culminating in the Hama uprising of 1982, when the rebellion was crushed by the military.[64]

Membership in the Syrian Brotherhood became a capital offence in Syria in 1980 (under Emergency Law 49, which was revoked in 2011), but the headquarters of the Muslim Brotherhood-linked Palestinian group, Hamas, was located in the Syria's capital Damascus, where it was given Syrian government support. This has been cited as an example of the lack of international centralisation or even coordination of the Muslim Brotherhood.[65]

The Brotherhood is said to have "resurrected itself" and become "dominant group" in the opposition during the Syrian civil war against the Assad regime according to the Washington Post newspaper.[66]

Big deal.:cool:

Indeed a Big Deal since they are also in the US.

The Society of the Muslim Brothers (Arabic: جماعة الإخوان المسلمين‎, often simply: الإخوان المسلمون, the Muslim Brotherhood, transliterated: al-ʾIkḫwān al-Muslimūn) is the Arab world's most influential and one of the largest Islamic movements, and is the largest political opposition organization in many Arab states.[1][2] Founded in Egypt in 1928[3] as a Pan-Islamic, religious, political, and social movement by the Islamic scholar and schoolteacher Hassan al-Banna,[4][5][6][7] by the end of World War II the Muslim Brotherhood had an estimated two million members.[8] Its ideas had gained supporters throughout the Arab world and influenced other Islamist groups with its "model of political activism combined with Islamic charity work".[9]

The Brotherhood's stated goal is to instill the Qur'an and Sunnah as the "sole reference point for ...ordering the life of the Muslim family, individual, community ... and state. The movement is also known for engaging in political violence, though it also advocates non-violent change.[10] They were responsible for creating Hamas, a U.S. designated terrorist organization, who grew to infamy for its suicide bombings of Israelis during the first and second intifada.[10] Muslim Brotherhood members are suspected to have assassinated political opponents like Egyptian Prime Minister Mahmoud an-Nukrashi Pasha.[9] The Egyptian Muslim Brotherhood is now politically active and officially rejects the use of violence, however violence against Christians and Women has continued.[9] [11]

The Muslim Brotherhood started as a religious social organization; preaching Islam, teaching the illiterate, setting up hospitals and even launching commercial enterprises. As it continued to rise in influence, starting in 1936, it began to oppose British rule in Egypt.[12] Many Egyptian nationalists accuse the Muslim Brotherhood of violent killings during this period.[13] After the Arab defeat in the First Arab-Israeli war, the Egyptian government dissolved the organisation and arrested its members.[12] It supported the Egyptian Revolution of 1952, but after an attempted assassination of Egypt's president it was once again banned and repressed.[14] The Muslim Brotherhood has been suppressed in other countries as well, most notably in Syria in 1982 during the Hama massacre.[15]

The Muslim Brotherhood is financed by contributions from its members, who are required to allocate a portion of their income to the movement. Some of these contributions are from members who work in Saudi Arabia and other oil-rich countries.[16

Organization

From the Transcripts[27] the following hierarchical Organisation structure can be derived:
The Shura Council has the duties of planning, charting general policies and programs that achieve the goal of the Group. Its resolutions are binding to the Group and only the General Organisational Conference can modify or annul them and the Shura Office has also the right to modify or annul resolutions of the Executive Office. It follows the implementation of the Group policies and programs. It directs the Executive Office and it forms dedicated branch committees to assist in that.[28]
Executive Office (Guidance Office) with its leader the General Masul (General Guide) and its members, both appointed by the Shura Office, has to follow up and guide the activities of the General Organisation. It submits a periodical report to the Shura Council about its work and of the activity of the domestic bodies and the general organisations. It distributes its duties to its members according to the internal bylaws.

It has the following divisions (not complete): – Executive leadership – Organizational office – Secretariat general – Educational office – Political office – Sisters office

The Muslim Brotherhood aimed to build a transnational organization, founding groups in Lebanon (in 1936), Syria (1937), and Transjordan (1946). It also recruited among the foreign students in Cairo where its headquarters became a center and meeting place for representatives from the whole Muslim world.

In each country there is a Branch committee with a Masul (leader) appointed by the General Executive leadership with essentially the same Branch-divisions as the Executive office has. To the duties of every branch belong fundraising, infiltrating and overtaking other Muslim organisations for the sake of uniting the Muslims to dedicate them to the general goals of the Muslim Brotherhood.....snip~

Muslim Brotherhood - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Basic Wiki.....and the MB has never been able to Control the Salafists. Now throw in AQ merged within both Groups, let alone others.
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

Obama announced direct military support.

Down goes Assad.
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

Obama announced direct military support.

Down goes Assad.

Mission accomplished. So what else is there to talk about?
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

Supporting the rebels is a very dangerous game.

We supported the rebels in Afghanistan 20 years ago and what did we get?

The Taliban and Al Qaeda.

The CIA practically created the Taliban in Afghanistan. Arming extremist groups was actually a goal of ours. Now we have learned our lesson and will hopefully be able to arm the rebels that aren't like the Taliban.
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

Obama announced direct military support.

Down goes Assad.

Yeah and.....Obama says a lot of things that he flips on. Other than throwing money away to Foreign Countries which end up stabbing us in the back.

That don't mean troops on the ground. Nor even a No Fly Zone. What are the Russians saying? What happens when Assad shoots down some American Planes for being where they are not suppose to be.

Obama is a fool to allow us to get caught up into this conflict. This is exactly what the Russians want. Same with the Chinese. Even moreso than the Iranians.

Means we wont be able to cover the Asia Region. Maybe we should just have some Americans going after the Sunni Right here in the States. This way the Sunni know that the American People aren't going to give them a Pass on any of this. Despite what our lackless and classless politicians think and have to say. Including Obama!
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

Obama announced direct military support.

Down goes Assad.

Not if the rebels keep ****ing things up by using chemical weapons and slaughtering civilians.
 
The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253]

Not if the rebels keep ****ing things up by using chemical weapons and slaughtering civilians.

Don't you know, Alquaida are now the good guys, using chemical weapons makes you a good guy, torture makes you a good guy, warrantless wiretapping makes you a good guy, persecution of political opponents makes you a good guy, etc.???
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]

Don't you know, Alquaida are now the good guys, using chemical weapons makes you a good guy, torture makes you a good guy, warrantless wiretapping makes you a good guy, persecution of political opponents makes you a good guy, etc.???

Is Assad the good guy?
 
The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253]

Is Assad the good guy?

No,

Throw hitler, Stalin and Mao in a room and ask which one is the good guy, is a morally relative argument.

We don't want to be the "relative" good guys, the us used to try and hold itself to a higher moral standard...

I'm just pointing out that the country no longer holds the high ground.
 
re: The Shame of Our Inaction in Syria [W:253,W:498]


Look, if we don't get involved, one of two things will happen:

1. Assad will kill another 100k and, presumably, at that point have subdued the population.
2. Radical elements ascend to power.

The only way to avoid those two outcomes is to get involved. The outcome we want is a transitional government supported by the UN, development projects, foreign aid and a new hope for Syria to join the developed world.
 
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