The Roberts Court takes aim at the Establishment Clause

[DarkWizard12]

Parents have always had those rights. These laws weren't made because they didn't. They were made in an excessive attempt to target a marginalized group.
That is why they're draconian.

but how though? What are straight people allowed to do that lgbt aren't allowed to do?

 

[DarkWizard12]

I have no words. It would take a while of explaining because you seem to have no knowledge of such things. I suggest some research before you spew this shit. Why engage with someone when you have no understanding of what they're talking about?

Well good, because wrapping your identity around who you sleep with is a pretty bad way to go about life....especially in a country as diverse is ours.

 

[Ginger Ale]

but how though? What are straight people allowed to do that lgbt aren't allowed to do?

Do you even know what a marginalized group is?

 

[Ginger Ale]

Well good, because wrapping your identity around who you sleep with is a pretty bad way to go about life....especially in a country as diverse is ours.

Tell that to a Republican because they're the ones doing that. I wish they'd stop as well.

 

[DarkWizard12]

List of acts of violence against LGBT people - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

So far, none of those listed happened while these laws were in existence. Hell, the florida bill was signed literally this year.

So on that front, your un-academic wiki article isn't even relevent....but, let's just pretend for a second I was asking for any lgbt victims prior to 2021, to include the intolerant days of the 1930's and 40's, so far(again, haven't checked the entire list), none have been state-sanctioned. So...even on that front...your article is irrelevant.

do better.

 

[DarkWizard12]

Do you even know what a marginalized group is?

really rude to answer a question with another question.

a marginalized group is a group that doesn't have the same rights as the predominant group.

so again, what are straight people allowed to do, that lgbt's are not allowed to do, under these laws? can you name even one right? is it the "dancing in front of children" one that you think is a right?

 

[DarkWizard12]

Tell that to a Republican because they're the ones doing that. I wish they'd stop as well.

if you can't name even one law that prevents you from being gay, then you have nothing to stand on. And you supposedly have....what....500 state laws under discussion here? Just pick the one that regulates your rights the most, and tell me how a gay person is affected exactly.

 

[Ginger Ale]

really rude to answer a question with another question.

a marginalized group is a group that doesn't have the same rights as the predominant group.

so again, what are straight people allowed to do, that lgbt's are not allowed to do, under these laws? can you name even one right? is it the "dancing in front of children" one that you think is a right?

Talk about it for one, how can you not know? Republicans are actively marginalizing them right now, and you're acting clueless like you have no idea what it is. I don't really buy it.

Marginalization is the result of discrimination. Groups who experience these things - racism, sexism, ableism, ageism, homophobia, xenophobia.
There are also more subtle forms of discrimination like microaggressions and stereotypes. Whether or not the discrimination is overt or covert, it marginalizes others and that is unacceptable.

This link will let you know which groups in America are marginalized and why they are considered as such.

What Does Marginalized Mean and Why Does it Matter? — CultureAlly

Learn the meaning of marginalization and how it occurs in the workplace. Understand the impact on marginalized groups through data. List of resources for marginalized people.

www.cultureally.com

 

[DarkWizard12]

Talk about it for one, how can you not know? Republicans are actively marginalizing them right now, and you're acting clueless like you have no idea what it is. I don't really buy it.

What rights are they taking away, EXACTLY?

Marginalization is the result of discrimination. Groups who experience these things - racism, sexism, ableism, ageism, homophobia, xenophobia.

Right, discrimination where I have rights and you dont. So again, what RIGHTS do you not have that I have?

There are also more subtle forms of discrimination like microaggressions and stereotypes. Whether or not the discrimination is overt or covert, it marginalizes others and that is unacceptable.

So white males are a marginalized group because of all the stereotypes about them?

This link will let you know which groups in America are marginalized and why they are considered as such.

What Does Marginalized Mean and Why Does it Matter? — CultureAlly

Learn the meaning of marginalization and how it occurs in the workplace. Understand the impact on marginalized groups through data. List of resources for marginalized people.

www.cultureally.com

4 responses in, and you still cannot name a single right these bills take away from you, and you call yourself "marginalized".

What a joke!

 

[Ginger Ale]

if you can't name even one law that prevents you from being gay, then you have nothing to stand on. And you supposedly have....what....500 state laws under discussion here? Just pick the one that regulates your rights the most, and tell me how a gay person is affected exactly.

It isn't about preventing me to be gay and you know it. There's a ton of people around you right now you don't know are gay, no preventing that.

This is about creating a problem that doesn't exist. That's what DeSantis has done. This is about ostracizing and shaming LGBTQ+ kids and their families. What it's leading to is kids and families in this group feeling shamed, and less than that of their peers. Republicans are bullying and targeting these people.




So, the question is mine to ask, who's making you gay or trans? How are your kids being indoctrinated by left wing agenda? That's the reason cons give for these new laws. The cons slander of the LGBTQ+ community is off the charts. That's no way to treat a part of our society. It's ugly, so why continue it?
What keep this up?

Because Republicans don't like the LGBTQ+ community and it's a great way to gather their base for some political hoopla when you have no real issues to run on, that's why. It's obvious, we all see it, and your little word game here doesn't hide it very well.

 

[Ginger Ale]

What rights are they taking away, EXACTLY?

Right, discrimination where I have rights and you dont. So again, what RIGHTS do you not have that I have?

So white males are a marginalized group because of all the stereotypes about them?

4 responses in, and you still cannot name a single right these bills take away from you, and you call yourself "marginalized".

What a joke!

The joke is you still don't know what marginalized means.

 

[weaver2]

What rights are they taking away, EXACTLY?

The Supreme Court(SC) just granted the states the right to let women die even though there was a medical procedure that could prevent their death. The court has also indicated that if the state wanted to prevent anyone in the state from helping a woman dying from a pregnancy that would be OK. Along with that right the SC said the states could deny women equal rights with men to manage their lives and futures. I believe Texas has a bill before the next legislature to bring back laws that made homosexual sex illegal and punishable with incarceration. These laws ban the Constitutional free speech of doctors and other medical personnel. They make women and LGBT people second class citizen. They essentially allow the state to apply a death penalty on women for being pregnant.

Banning books and curriculum subjects is taking away a 1st amendment right of children and parents to read and learn freely and makes the state the arbiter of what certain groups of people will be allowed to know. It is putting a specific religious group in charge of determining book and curriculum bans essentially establishing the dogma of the evangelical churches in public schools.

It is my understanding from reading you posts that you approve of the denial of these rights.

 

[DarkWizard12]

It isn't about preventing me to be gay and you know it. There's a ton of people around you right now you don't know are gay, no preventing that.

so which provisions of these laws, exactly, do you have a problem with? can you just find the specific phrase or clause in the laws that you dont like?

This is about creating a problem that doesn't exist. That's what DeSantis has done. This is about ostracizing and shaming LGBTQ+ kids and their families. What it's leading to is kids and families in this group feeling shamed, and less than that of their peers. Republicans are bullying and targeting these people.

Again, quote the specific provision that does this.

If this is about creating a problem, then how come the only people who talk about these bills is lefty media? Right wing media doesn't even say anything about these laws. It seems like, to me, you're the ones making this into a problem when these bills have absolutely nothing to do with the LGBT community.

So, the question is mine to ask, who's making you gay or trans? How are your kids being indoctrinated by left wing agenda? That's the reason cons give for these new laws. The cons slander of the LGBTQ+ community is off the charts. That's no way to treat a part of our society. It's ugly, so why continue it?
What keep this up?

You slander the laws. You can't even quote the specific provision that takes away your rights, much less any provision you hate. It sounds like to me you know nothing at all about these bills, and it shows. You can't quote a single thing they do, and how they supposedly hurt the LGBT's. You just take it as a fact that they hurt the LGBT because some weirdo journalist told you to.

Because Republicans don't like the LGBTQ+ community and it's a great way to gather their base for some political hoopla when you have no real issues to run on, that's why. It's obvious, we all see it, and your little word game here doesn't hide it very well.

Ok well, quote the specific article or provision that has anything to do with the LGBT community(using the term loosely as no real LGBT community exists) and tell me how it regulates your rights.

Laws aren't games, ginger.

 

[DarkWizard12]

The joke is you still don't know what marginalized means.

I've never seen any real marginalized group lack the ability to list the specific laws and provisions that affect their rights. Not palestinians, not tibetans, not south africans, no one....except you.

and i've been to all these places, so yea, I think i know wtf what marginilized means, and you are not it lol.

why do you fight this simple request so hard? Could it be that you actually have nothing to protest against and your modus operandi is simply "republicans bad" the minute some weirdo disney lefty snaps his fingers?

 

[DarkWizard12]

The Supreme Court(SC) just granted the states the right to let women die even though there was a medical procedure that could prevent their death. The court has also indicated that if the state wanted to prevent anyone in the state from helping a woman dying from a pregnancy that would be OK. Along with that right the SC said the states could deny women equal rights with men to manage their lives and futures. I believe Texas has a bill before the next legislature to bring back laws that made homosexual sex illegal and punishable with incarceration. These laws ban the Constitutional free speech of doctors and other medical personnel. They make women and LGBT people second class citizen. They essentially allow the state to apply a death penalty on women for being pregnant.

so allowing parents have access to school counseling records......makes women refuse surgeries? lol

ok, uh....maybe? lol not sure what that has to do with lgbt or florida's parental rights bill in any way, but noted!

I believe Texas has a bill before the next legislature to bring back laws that made homosexual sex illegal and punishable with incarceration

source: trust me bro

Banning books and curriculum subjects is taking away a 1st amendment right of children and parents to read and learn freely and makes the state the arbiter of what certain groups of people will be allowed to know.

So you think that a state or local government....who runs public/school libraries...doesn't have the right to decide what books to carry in their libraries?

It is putting a specific religious group in charge of determining book and curriculum bans essentially establishing the dogma of the evangelical churches in public schools.

Can you demonstrate how a library not carrying the book you wanted is "teaching an evangelical dogma" or otherwise violating your first amendment rights in any way? I really don't think that's how that works lol

i just ask because this community doesn't seem very evangelical lol https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...higan-muslim-council-lgbtq-pride-flags-banned all these libraries could be teaching islam for all you know!

It is my understanding from reading you posts that you approve of the denial of these rights.

to the extent these laws don't deny any specific group's rights, i approve of them. That's why i'm asking ANYONE at all to demonstrate how any of your rights are being taken away. If you can show that, then great, but so far, it seems every law has equal application for everyone, gay or straight. In missouri, you are not allowed to strip in front of 5 year olds, and neither am I. You have yet to show me a law or provision that I would not agree to follow myself. And if you don't, then why would I allow you to have more rights than me?

 

[weaver2]

so allowing parents have access to school counseling records......makes women refuse surgeries? lol

???

ok, uh....maybe? lol not sure what that has to do with lgbt or florida's parental rights bill in any way, but noted!

You seem to be discussing more than just Florida's parental rights law

source: trust me bro

Texas is talking about restoring the anti-sodomy laws

Bill striking unconstitutional state law that criminalized homosexuality fails to meet critical deadline in the Texas House

In a landmark decision, the U.S. Supreme Court struck down Texas’ law banning sodomy in 2003. It took almost 20 years for Democrats to get a bill to repeal the defunct ban on the House calendar.

www.texastribune.org

Ted Cruz says Texas should repeal its now-defunct law banning gay sex

The law was made unenforceable by the Supreme Court in 2003, but Justice Clarence Thomas recently suggested that the court should reconsider it.

www.texastribune.org

Texas AG says he would back law banning sodomy if Supreme Court reconsiders landmark case

Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton (R) said last week he would back a law banning the act of sodomy if the U.S. Supreme Court were to overrule a case deeming it unconstitutional. Paxton said during …

thehill.com

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/06/29/texas-sodomy-supreme-court-lawrence-paxton-lgbtq/

Clarence Thomas wants Supreme Court to revisit Texas sodomy law

Justice Clarence Thomas wrote in a concurring opinion that the high court should now...

www.chron.com

So you think that a state or local government....who runs public/school libraries...doesn't have the right to decide what books to carry in their libraries?

If you had read the articles on school book banning you would know that it is not the librarian that is banning books. It is conservative religious organization.

Can you demonstrate how a library not carrying the book you wanted is "teaching an evangelical dogma" or otherwise violating your first amendment rights in any way? I really don't think that's how that works lol

What part of: Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

i just ask because this community doesn't seem very evangelical lol https://www.theguardian.com/us-news...higan-muslim-council-lgbtq-pride-flags-banned all these libraries could be teaching islam for all you know!

Why are you talking about Michigan?

to the extent these laws don't deny any specific group's rights, i approve of them. That's why i'm asking ANYONE at all to demonstrate how any of your rights are being taken away. If you can show that, then great, but so far, it seems every law has equal application for everyone, gay or straight. In missouri, you are not allowed to strip in front of 5 year olds, and neither am I. You have yet to show me a law or provision that I would not agree to follow myself. And if you don't, then why would I allow you to have more rights than me?

Are you back to talking about the Florida parental rights law?

 

[weaver2]

I've never seen any real marginalized group lack the ability to list the specific laws and provisions that affect their rights. Not palestinians, not tibetans, not south africans, no one....except you

The powers that were/are marginalizing the above groups justify their actions based on the violence of the marginalized and the right to protect themselves from that violence. They ignore the fact that they provoked the violence by the marginalization.

why do you fight this simple request so hard?

"Ask not for whom the bell tolls....."

 

[Ginger Ale]

so which provisions of these laws, exactly, do you have a problem with? can you just find the specific phrase or clause in the laws that you dont like?

Again, quote the specific provision that does this.

If this is about creating a problem, then how come the only people who talk about these bills is lefty media? Right wing media doesn't even say anything about these laws. It seems like, to me, you're the ones making this into a problem when these bills have absolutely nothing to do with the LGBT community.

You slander the laws. You can't even quote the specific provision that takes away your rights, much less any provision you hate. It sounds like to me you know nothing at all about these bills, and it shows. You can't quote a single thing they do, and how they supposedly hurt the LGBT's. You just take it as a fact that they hurt the LGBT because some weirdo journalist told you to.

Ok well, quote the specific article or provision that has anything to do with the LGBT community(using the term loosely as no real LGBT community exists) and tell me how it regulates your rights.

Laws aren't games, ginger.

I don't understand how you can say this shit when your representatives are running agendas on it, and coming out stating bull crap slander not only about the LGBTQ+ community but just liberals in general. They don't even acknowledge that there are LGBTQ+ republicans that exist. Here MTG is comparing trans care to pedophiles. It's not the left you should be worried about, it's the right and their obsession with the LGBTQ+ community.


He's not lefty media and he's concerned.



Republican asking questions on the bill showing it's just targeting certain sexual orientation.



Christians seem to want their morality for everyone. These religious lawmakers and governors have a Religious theme.


Florida teacher training seems to be training teachers on Christian values.



Republicans talk about it, and believe Christian values override neutral values that apply to all. That's why these politicians run on anti woke agendas.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-AuM9N93J8

57% of Republicans support Christianity as the national religion. This is why they're writing up these bills against the freedoms involving the LGBTQ+ community. To jazz that base.
What it looks like is a competition of values, and it's not.

Lauren Boebert wants biblical citizen training in our schools. She's not a liberal saying this, she's a republican stating it. She also thinks the church should run the government. That's coming out of a Republicans mouth.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dXiGLCa3gig

The majority of the Republican Party support recognition of a Christian Nation. These are Evangelists, and born again Christians. One common belief is that belonging to the LGBTQ+ group is a sin, is wrong. Same with abortion. That's why these issues are their agenda. Paul and Marj gave speeches at a White Nationalist convention. It's obvious who they support and why they hate and target part of our country.

Most Republicans Support Declaring the United States a Christian Nation

New polling shows the appeal — and limits — of a Christian nationalist message.

www.politico.com

I've done nothing but post what's wrong with this shit. The main wrong is targeting and terrorizing a marginalized group in this country. Not only that but actively trying to push this country toward accepting Christian values as the only values that matter here. I've been perfectly clear on this.

There have been 558 anti trans bills 82 have passed and 365 are still active. If that's not targeting I don't know what is.

2024 Anti-Trans Bills: Trans Legislation Tracker

2024 anti-trans bills tracker. Explore data on U.S. anti-trans legislation including passed bills and themes including sports, bathrooms, healthcare, pronouns, drag shows, and education.

translegislation.com

Laws aren't tools for your Christian agenda either, yet the Republicans are using them for just that. I don't buy the nativity act, it's been overplayed by cons.
You know it harmful, and that's why they do it. They want them out of sight, and out of mind. You can't do that to other people and not expect pushback.

The problem you and I have is that you agree with them. ^^^^ And I do not. It's not clever to fake stupidity. Take your stand or get off the pot.

 

[DarkWizard12]

There have been 558 anti trans bills 82 have passed and 365 are still active. If that's not targeting I don't know what is.

2024 Anti-Trans Bills: Trans Legislation Tracker

2024 anti-trans bills tracker. Explore data on U.S. anti-trans legislation including passed bills and themes including sports, bathrooms, healthcare, pronouns, drag shows, and education.

translegislation.com

and you STILL won't even pick out a single bill with a single provision that you claim is anti-lgbt, not one.

There's nothing to debate about until you do, and if you have nothing, your concerns can be fully dismissed. there are not 558 anti-trans bills, as you have not proven that any single provision of theirs is anti-trans. Therefore, there is 0 anti-trans bills in existence, and everything you've said otherwise is pure propaganda without any evidence to back it up.

all you had to do was pick on single provision, even a phrase, that you found anti-trans inside the bills. but you can't do that apparantly, even when you have all public government statutes accessible at your fingertips. this kind of laziness passes for activism? really? lol

 

[Ginger Ale]

and you STILL won't even pick out a single bill with a single provision that you claim is anti-lgbt, not one.

There's nothing to debate about until you do, and if you have nothing, your concerns can be fully dismissed. there are not 558 anti-trans bills, as you have not proven that any single provision of theirs is anti-trans. Therefore, there is 0 anti-trans bills in existence.

all you had to do was pick on single provision, even a phrase, that you found anti-trans inside the bills. but you can't do that apparantly, even when you have all public government statutes accessible at your fingertips. this kind of laziness passes for activism? really? lol

All the bills prove my point which is you are targeting the LGBTQ+ community. I don't need to pick one.
Saying it does not make it true. Playing the naive child isn't a debate tactic. You can click my links or not, your choice. I'm not going to copy paste for you.
If this wasn't an issue, your party wouldn't be running on it. You still haven't told me how liberals are indoctrinating you, not one link of proof. You ask a lot for such little return. I suggest you stop playing games, and either state your position or get off the pot. This is only entertaining to you.

 

[DarkWizard12]

All the bills prove my point which is you are targeting the LGBTQ+ community. I don't need to pick one.

I wish we were as evil as you claim we are. believe me, if these bills TRULY targetted the lgbt community, then i'd be celebrating.

but obviously, im not celebrating because it's not there, and yet you won't show me where it is so.....

Saying it does not make it true.

then prove it! point to specific law and provision that you claim is anti-lgbt? where is it?

Playing the naive child isn't a debate tactic.

naivete would believing your claims without evidence, and you have yet to show any. quote the specific provision that is anti-lgbt.

You can click my links or not, your choice. I'm not going to copy paste for you.

I did, not one of them explained how any of these bills were targetting lgbt. Not one of them quoted the specific, anti-lgbt provisions of the laws. I WISH IT WAS THERE, believe me, i really do. a totally victory for my side if it was there, BUT I DONT SEE IT! you have to actually quote the provision that makes it a criminal act to be lgbt! Where Ginger, where?

If this wasn't an issue, your party wouldn't be running on it. You still haven't told me how liberals are indoctrinating you, not one link of proof. You ask a lot for such little return.

It's not about whether the party should run on it, it's about whether it actually exists! What provision makes these laws anti-lgbt? QUOTE THE PROVISION!

I suggest you stop playing games, and either state your position or get off the pot. This is only entertaining to you.

oh I hate LGBT's more than anyone. You point to these laws and i'm supposed to celebrate? really? Ok, point out which of these provisions are actually anti-lgbt, and i will! I'll have a cook out just for you!

 

[weaver2]

I wish we were as evil as you claim we are. believe me, if these bills TRULY targetted the lgbt community, then i'd be celebrating. but obviously, im not celebrating because it's not there, and yet you won't show me where it is so.....then prove it! point to specific law and provision that you claim is anti-lgbt? where is it?

Sadly for you, Florida's HB1557 (Don't say gay) doesn't say " We are bigots extending our bigotry so that we can deny LGBT students instruction, counseling, privacy, discussion or any help at school with their gender issues. We also want to notify parents that their kids are homo's, ban books and change curriculum so it reflects our church's teaching about homosexuals being an abomination before God."
I know that's what you mean by "specific statement". Most people realize that when they see vagueness , waffling statements and weasel words in a bill they recognize the techniques hiding the actual intent of the law.

Here is the actual written intent of the bill from its preamble with my comment in bold italics:
Parental Rights in Education; Requires district school boards to adopt procedures that comport with certain provisions of law for notifying student's parent of specified information; ( now what do you guess is that specified information? grades? Nope School trips? Guess again.... your kid has said s/he is homosexual or transgendered? Bingo!)requires such procedures (outing the student to parents) to reinforce fundamental right of parents to make decisions regarding upbringing & control of their children; prohibits school district from adopting procedures or student support forms that prohibit school district personnel from notifying parent about specified information or that encourage student to withhold from parent such information; prohibits school district personnel from discouraging or prohibiting parental notification & involvement in critical decisions affecting student's mental, emotional, or physical well-being; prohibits classroom discussion about sexual orientation or gender identity in certain grade levels;( in all other grades. also. The word prohibited isn't used but the words developmentally appropriate which is never defined) requires school districts to notify parents of healthcare services; authorizes parent to bring action against school district to obtain declaratory judgment; provides for additional award of injunctive relief, damages, & reasonable attorney fees & court costs to certain parents.(encourage parents to sue then charge the school district so it has less money for instruction)

It's not about whether the party should run on it, it's about whether it actually exists! What provision makes these laws anti-lgbt? QUOTE THE PROVISION!

Read HB1557 Lines 97-101: "Classroom instruction by school personnel or third parties on sexual orientation or gender identity may not occur in kindergarten through grade 3 or in a manner that is not age appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students in accordance with state standards." (in other words instructions and discussion are restricted in all grades but couched in vague terms so parents can sue over pretty much any instruction or discussion by defining age appropriate/developmentally appropriate any way they want within state standards which the state is going to rewrite)

Continue with your charade since it makes you happy, just don't be surprised when the LGBT community wins its suit against the state of Florida.

 

[DarkWizard12]

Sadly for you, Florida's HB1557 (Don't say gay) doesn't say " We are bigots extending our bigotry so that we can deny LGBT students instruction, counseling, privacy, discussion or any help at school with their gender issues.

I agree, so let's see what it says.

I hope you don't mind if i took out your bolded inserts....i think it's bad practice to poison the well, don't you?

Here is the actual written intent of the bill from its preamble with my comment in bold italics:
Parental Rights in Education; Requires district school boards to adopt procedures that comport with certain provisions of law for notifying student's parent of specified information;

ok, so you think it's bad for parents to have information about their own kids, from the school, right?

I disagree with that. I think parents should be entrusted with ALL information without their kids. They are, afterall, they're kids, and school staff are simply employees of the state/district.

but fine, you can just say you disagree. You don't have to lie about it lol

requires such procedures to reinforce fundamental right of parents to make decisions regarding upbringing & control of their children; prohibits school district from adopting procedures or student support forms that prohibit school district personnel from notifying parent about specified information or that encourage student to withhold from parent such information; prohibits school district personnel from discouraging or prohibiting parental notification & involvement in critical decisions affecting student's mental, emotional, or physical well-being; prohibits classroom discussion about sexual orientation or gender identity in certain grade levels; requires school districts to notify parents of healthcare services; authorizes parent to bring action against school district to obtain declaratory judgment; provides for additional award of injunctive relief, damages, & reasonable attorney fees & court costs to certain parents.

ok, well, from the preamble(again, no actually policy is given yet), it seems this bill applies every bit to straight people as it does to gay people. If you are, say gay parents, you get the same exact information about your kids from the school. At least from the preamble, this is entirely equal. Straight parents don't get any more special rights than gay parents.

And if you want to disagree with that, fine, that's your opinion, but don't lie and say it targets LGBT when all parents, gay or straight, are given the exact same rights.

Read HB1557 Lines 97-101:

k. you could have just quoted it.

"Classroom instruction by school personnel or third parties on sexual orientation or gender identity may not occur in kindergarten through grade 3 or in a manner that is not age appropriate or developmentally appropriate for students in accordance with state standards."

So this targets LGBT people.....because it bans school personnel from talking about sexuality from kindergarten to grade 3....THAT is targetting LGBT people?

Yea, no. I know PLENTY of LGBT people, they have absolutely no desire to talk about sexuality to kids that young. LGBT people are not pedos.

and no, there's nothing vague about this sentence, nor does it give parents the right to sue, rather, it gives the state the right to sue the school district if they are breaching the state's own standards. Lawsuits from parents are mentioned separately in the bill.

Continue with your charade since it makes you happy, just don't be surprised when the LGBT community wins its suit against the state of Florida.

I admit I hate LGBT's and you still call it a charade lol.

you should care about the so-called "lgbt leaders" leading you to a rock and hard place. On one hand, they could lose the suit(as is likely to happen), or if they somehow win, the LGBT community would be legally equating itself to pedophilia. Really, you should be worried if you do win the lawsuit. long-debunked pedophilia accusations would suddenly become legitimized. Not even I, an admitted homo-hater, would call them pedos. But if they win, then i wouldn't be able to totally disagree with that anymore.

If the LGBT community chooses to die on this hill, then they were truly more arrogant and narcissistic than their movement could bear. There is no "real" winning here.

 

[DarkWizard12]

???


You seem to be discussing more than just Florida's parental rights law

Well yea, the other poster mentioned 500 laws were anti-lgbt. I just ask for proof of any one of those. Doesn't matter to me which.

Texas is talking about restoring the anti-sodomy laws

Bill striking unconstitutional state law that criminalized homosexuality fails to meet critical deadline in the Texas House

In a landmark decision, the U.S. Supreme Court struck down Texas’ law banning sodomy in 2003. It took almost 20 years for Democrats to get a bill to repeal the defunct ban on the House calendar.

www.texastribune.org

Ted Cruz says Texas should repeal its now-defunct law banning gay sex

The law was made unenforceable by the Supreme Court in 2003, but Justice Clarence Thomas recently suggested that the court should reconsider it.

www.texastribune.org

Texas AG says he would back law banning sodomy if Supreme Court reconsiders landmark case

Texas Attorney General Ken Paxton (R) said last week he would back a law banning the act of sodomy if the U.S. Supreme Court were to overrule a case deeming it unconstitutional. Paxton said during …

thehill.com

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2022/06/29/texas-sodomy-supreme-court-lawrence-paxton-lgbtq/

Clarence Thomas wants Supreme Court to revisit Texas sodomy law

Justice Clarence Thomas wrote in a concurring opinion that the high court should now...

www.chron.com

oh i'd certainly celebrate if texas did that, but that hasn't happened yet so...i'll have to save the bbq for next year i guess.

If you had read the articles on school book banning you would know that it is not the librarian that is banning books. It is conservative religious organization.

you mean the state government? THAT "religious" organization? lol

it's not a private church deciding what books can be in a taxpayer funded library, it's the state! why do you choose to argue this?

What part of: Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Free speech doesn't mean public libraries have to buy and lend you the books you like. The wider community with their elected and bureaucratic officials decides that, not you alone. You are not anyone's dictator.

 

[weaver2]

Well yea, the other poster mentioned 500 laws were anti-lgbt. I just ask for proof of any one of those. Doesn't matter to me which.
oh i'd certainly celebrate if texas did that, but that hasn't happened yet so...i'll have to save the bbq for next year i guess.
you mean the state government? THAT "religious" organization? lol
it's not a private church deciding what books can be in a taxpayer funded library, it's the state! why do you choose to argue this?
Free speech doesn't mean public libraries have to buy and lend you the books you like. The wider community with their elected and bureaucratic officials decides that, not you alone. You are not anyone's dictator.

You seem to think that unless a law specifically states "This bill specifically discriminates against XXX" that it isn't discriminatory.
You don't seem to understand how libraries and banning of library books works .
You seem to think that vague language in the law is innocent and not purposefully written into the law in order to accomplish something discriminatory.
You don't have a very good grasp of what conservative religious groups are doing in the US right now.
And you seem to think that the anti-LGBTQ laws being proposed and/or enacted are not discriminatory
A great deal of what you post is devoid of considered thought.