• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

The Moral Case for Fossil Fuels

Deuce

Outer space potato man
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 6, 2010
Messages
94,298
Reaction score
46,742
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
I'm judging them by what they say, as quoted in the OP.

No, not those guys. The 99.9% of the conversation that is about radiation hazards. You're tossing that out because someone fed you three quotes from dudes decades ago.
 

Jack Hays

Traveler
Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 28, 2013
Messages
94,822
Reaction score
28,339
Location
Williamsburg, Virginia
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
No, not those guys. The 99.9% of the conversation that is about radiation hazards. You're tossing that out because someone fed you three quotes from dudes decades ago.

The thread is actually not about nuclear power or radiation, but you have made a valiant attempt to deflect. Fossil fuels are significantly superior to "green" alternatives, and nuclear power is largely unavailable because of know-nothing environmentalist opposition. Environmental leaders are on record opposing abundant power.
 

Jack Hays

Traveler
Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 28, 2013
Messages
94,822
Reaction score
28,339
Location
Williamsburg, Virginia
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
No, not those guys. The 99.9% of the conversation that is about radiation hazards. You're tossing that out because someone fed you three quotes from dudes decades ago.

Environmentalism's Fear-Loathing of Technology

". . . In an article in Quest magazine, titled "The Case Against Abundant, Cheap Energy," Dartmouth professor Noel Perrin wrote: "I don't want nuclear technology (or solar, or any other kind) to work because the blessings of abundant energy are even more to be feared than its risks" (emphasis in original).
Two years later he would write in The New York Times: "What's needed from the nuclear industry is an actual catastrophe-such as it almost gave us at Three Mile Island. . . . We do need a nuclear accident-a nice big one. Soon! Three Mile Island would have done nicely. . . probably no more than a hundred people would have died from the initial contact with the radioactive steam. . . ."
 

Deuce

Outer space potato man
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 6, 2010
Messages
94,298
Reaction score
46,742
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Environmentalism's Fear-Loathing of Technology

". . . In an article in Quest magazine, titled "The Case Against Abundant, Cheap Energy," Dartmouth professor Noel Perrin wrote: "I don't want nuclear technology (or solar, or any other kind) to work because the blessings of abundant energy are even more to be feared than its risks" (emphasis in original).
Two years later he would write in The New York Times: "What's needed from the nuclear industry is an actual catastrophe-such as it almost gave us at Three Mile Island. . . . We do need a nuclear accident-a nice big one. Soon! Three Mile Island would have done nicely. . . probably no more than a hundred people would have died from the initial contact with the radioactive steam. . . ."

You think quoting the same people more often makes this opinion become more prevalent?
 

Deuce

Outer space potato man
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 6, 2010
Messages
94,298
Reaction score
46,742
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
First time Perrin has been quoted.

I can link you a dozen pages that talk about radiation. But it doesn't matter, does it? You've decided this is a majority opinion, and evidence cannot undo a conspiracy theory.
 

Jack Hays

Traveler
Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 28, 2013
Messages
94,822
Reaction score
28,339
Location
Williamsburg, Virginia
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
I can link you a dozen pages that talk about radiation. But it doesn't matter, does it? You've decided this is a majority opinion, and evidence cannot undo a conspiracy theory.

No conspiracy needed. An anti-abundant-energy position is integral to green energy ideology. And nuclear power remains a mere side issue in this discussion.
 

Deuce

Outer space potato man
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 6, 2010
Messages
94,298
Reaction score
46,742
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
No conspiracy needed. An anti-abundant-energy position is integral to green energy ideology. And nuclear power remains a mere side issue in this discussion.

It's not. I am a green energy proponent and I am not against abundant energy. if we could work out that nuclear fusion thing, that'd be great.

But you don't give a ****. The real agenda is what you've decided it is.
 

Jack Hays

Traveler
Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 28, 2013
Messages
94,822
Reaction score
28,339
Location
Williamsburg, Virginia
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
It's not. I am a green energy proponent and I am not against abundant energy. if we could work out that nuclear fusion thing, that'd be great.

But you don't give a ****. The real agenda is what you've decided it is.

You are an exception.
 

Deuce

Outer space potato man
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 6, 2010
Messages
94,298
Reaction score
46,742
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed

polgara

DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 25, 2013
Messages
20,215
Reaction score
17,786
Location
NE Ohio
Gender
Female
Political Leaning
Other
You are an exception.

Greetings, Jack. :2wave:

Out of curiosity, I'd like to hear from people who have gone "totally-solar" in their home, and how it's worked out for them, including the limitations in their lifestyle that they may have experienced.
 

Jack Hays

Traveler
Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 28, 2013
Messages
94,822
Reaction score
28,339
Location
Williamsburg, Virginia
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
No, I'm the majority. But since we can only use anecdotes, you'll never change your mind.

There's a documented record of anti-abundant-energy pronouncements by individuals widely recognized as green energy advocates and leaders.
 

Jack Hays

Traveler
Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 28, 2013
Messages
94,822
Reaction score
28,339
Location
Williamsburg, Virginia
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
Greetings, Jack. :2wave:

Out of curiosity, I'd like to hear from people who have gone "totally-solar" in their home, and how it's worked out for them, including the limitations in their lifestyle that they may have experienced.

Greetings Polgara.:2wave:

Perhaps they don't have enough electricity to be on the net.
 

Deuce

Outer space potato man
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 6, 2010
Messages
94,298
Reaction score
46,742
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
There's a documented record of anti-abundant-energy pronouncements by individuals widely recognized as green energy advocates and leaders.
Yes. By individuals.

And I showed you documented record of AGW skeptic leaders making religious arguments against climate change. Should I treat that opinion as a majority? Are you just a rare exception to those beliefs?
 

Jack Hays

Traveler
Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 28, 2013
Messages
94,822
Reaction score
28,339
Location
Williamsburg, Virginia
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
Yes. By individuals.

And I showed you documented record of AGW skeptic leaders making religious arguments against climate change. Should I treat that opinion as a majority? Are you just a rare exception to those beliefs?

I'm indifferent to characterizations of skeptic leadership.
 

Deuce

Outer space potato man
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 6, 2010
Messages
94,298
Reaction score
46,742
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
I'm indifferent to characterizations of skeptic leadership.

And everyone in the world is indifferent to characterizations of those whack job "leaders" you cherry picked. I'm glad we've come to an understanding.
 

Jack Hays

Traveler
Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 28, 2013
Messages
94,822
Reaction score
28,339
Location
Williamsburg, Virginia
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Independent
And everyone in the world is indifferent to characterizations of those whack job "leaders" you cherry picked. I'm glad we've come to an understanding.

Whack jobs they may be, but they're widely recognized as green energy leaders.
 

Deuce

Outer space potato man
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 6, 2010
Messages
94,298
Reaction score
46,742
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Whack jobs they may be, but they're widely recognized as green energy leaders.

So is Senator Inhofe. And yet, I am indifferent.
 

Deuce

Outer space potato man
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 6, 2010
Messages
94,298
Reaction score
46,742
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Senator Imhofe represents his constituents well, but I don't think he's a green energy leader.

He's a fossil fuel proponent. And therefore your leader.

And yet, indifference.
 
Top Bottom