Taliban: we won the war

[LetsGoBrandon]

Why not? America's military adventures continue. We don't do it any longer unless obligated to by our NATO membership commitments.

Yeah....damn us to hell for attacking Afghanistan after the terrorist attacks of 9/11/01, huh? We should have just let that go? As for the UK not doing it any longer, that's not totally true. You were with us in Iraq both wars, and you were with us in Afghanistan. NATO commitments did not require your participation in Iraq.

 

[Waddy]

We won until Bush and Rumsfeld pulled troops out to manage the war on the cheap rather than end it quickly. Read up on it.

Baloney. We will never conquer those regions. Read the history on them. Just like we could never have defeated the Vietnamese.

 

[OrphanSlug]

We won until Bush and Rumsfeld pulled troops out to manage the war on the cheap rather than end it quickly. Read up on it.

Unfortunately, that is rhetoric over substance. The only "win" was changing who was in power in Afghanistan and only for a portion of the nation it could control.

The reality is the Taliban is an ideology that has been there for a very long time under numerous names including those we once helped when they turned their weapons on the old USSR.

The idiocy is thinking we can "win" over there, really anywhere over there, by simply exchanging which ideology is in power while also leaving some resemblance of the ideology we removed from power.

The Taliban did win, they and the ideology they subscribe to, is still around and ready to take things back.

 

[Yes_Minister]

Really? is Saddam Hussein still in control of Iraq? Oh wait....no he is worm food. Iraq is still a bit of a mess, however they are no longer under an authoritarian dictatorship. They are electing their own leaders and I think history will see it as a success.

Let's see, thousands of American soldiers died, hundreds of thousands Iraqi civilians died, it created a power vacuum that ISIS filled, the US spent almost 2 trillion dollars there, how is that great?

 

[LetsGoBrandon]

Let's see, thousands of American soldiers died, hundreds of thousands Iraqi civilians died, it created a power vacuum that ISIS filled, the US spent almost 2 trillion dollars there, how is that great?

The power vacuum that ISIS filled, you can blame Obama for that. it was his failure to back up his own red lines that led to ISIS filling a vacuum. Trump took care of it. ISIS was all but wiped out in Iraq during his administration.

 

[calamity]

The power vacuum that ISIS filled, you can blame Obama for that. it was his failure to back up his own red lines that led to ISIS filling a vacuum. Trump took care of it. ISIS was all but wiped out in Iraq during his administration.

lol...you actually believe that.

 

[Yes_Minister]

The power vacuum that ISIS filled, you can blame Obama for that. it was his failure to back up his own red lines that led to ISIS filling a vacuum. Trump took care of it. ISIS was all but wiped out in Iraq during his administration.

The Bush administration the one who disbanded the Iraqi army, those former soldiers were the ones who formed ISIS, keeping them employed likely would have prevented that.

Or we could have not invaded Iraq at all and everyone who died, Iraqi civilians and US soldiers alike, would not have died.

Your super hero Trump said the Iraq War was a big fat mistake, do you think he was wrong? I don't like Trump, but I think his criticism of the endless wars is part of the reason he defeated Hillary Clinton back in 2016.

 

[Gladiator]

"The Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan is what the Taliban called their government when they ruled the country for five years, until their ouster by a U.S.-led coalition in 2001.

Still, there are few signs of a political agreement on the horizon. Battles between the Taliban and government forces are continuing in dozens of provinces, and thousands of Afghans are seeking visas in hopes of leaving the country. Most are frightened that the final withdrawal of U.S. and NATO troops after nearly 20 years will plunge their war-ravaged nation into deeper chaos. With the U.S. withdrawal more than 95% complete, Afghanistan’s future seems mired in uncertainty.

Militias with a brutal history have been resurrected to fight the Taliban but their loyalties are to their commanders, many of them U.S.-allied warlords with ethnic-based support."

Taliban say they want Afghan deal, even as they battle on

Still, there are few signs of a political agreement on the horizon.

www.politico.com

How long until the Taliban has 80% control of Afghan territory?

Will the warlords regain control, over time, in some areas where the Taliban have defeated the Afghanistan government?

///

 

[notquiteright]

"The Islamic Emirate of Afghanistan is what the Taliban called their government when they ruled the country for five years, until their ouster by a U.S.-led coalition in 2001.

Still, there are few signs of a political agreement on the horizon. Battles between the Taliban and government forces are continuing in dozens of provinces, and thousands of Afghans are seeking visas in hopes of leaving the country. Most are frightened that the final withdrawal of U.S. and NATO troops after nearly 20 years will plunge their war-ravaged nation into deeper chaos. With the U.S. withdrawal more than 95% complete, Afghanistan’s future seems mired in uncertainty.

Militias with a brutal history have been resurrected to fight the Taliban but their loyalties are to their commanders, many of them U.S.-allied warlords with ethnic-based support."

Taliban say they want Afghan deal, even as they battle on

Still, there are few signs of a political agreement on the horizon.

www.politico.com

How long until the Taliban has 80% control of Afghan territory?

Will the warlords regain control, over time, in some areas where the Taliban have defeated the Afghanistan government?

///

I suspect many warlords will become Taliban when the time comes....

 

[Gladiator]

What about Isis in Afghanistan?


"As the U.S. military’s withdrawal from Afghanistan reaches its final stages, the Islamic State’s Khorasan branch in the country remains a “serious threat,” warned John T. Godfrey, the acting U.S. Special Envoy for the Global Coalition to Defeat ISIS.

Speaking with reporters on a call July 1, Godfrey echoed other recent warnings from American officials and generals that the Islamic State group’s presence in Afghanistan, thought to be severely diminished just a few years ago, is far from completely eradicated.

“Regarding the ISIS-Khorasan branch in Afghanistan, it is a group that we have been focused on for some time. We assess that it constitutes a serious threat. It’s one that we’ve certainly been focused on,” said Godfrey, who also serves as acting coordinator of counterterrorism in the State Department. “And I think that the assessment … by U.S. military leadership of the potential for that group to reconstitute capability within two years is consistent with what we’ve heard from other quarters of the U.S. government, so I think we would echo that.”

ISIS in Afghanistan Remains 'Serious Threat' | Air & Space Forces Magazine

ISIS-Khorasan, the Islamic State branch in Afghanistan, could soon "reconstitute capability," said the US State Department's John T. Godfrey.

www.airforcemag.com

//



//

 

[Gladiator]

Maps show Taliban making big gains of territory in Afghanistan.

Mapping the Taliban Offensive in Afghanistan

www.fdd.org

//

 

[Rexedgar]

Maps show Taliban making big gains of territory in Afghanistan.

Mapping the Taliban Offensive in Afghanistan

www.fdd.org

//

What happened after the Israelites crossed the Red Sea?

 

[Mika-El]

Afghanistan: 'We have won the war, America has lost', say Taliban

I tend to agree. The Taliban are still around, still controls parts of Afghanistan, and will probably be in charge of all of it within a few years. America is leaving and the people they went to unseat from power will be back in charge.

No one will ever control Afghanistan. Physically its not possible. The Ta.iban is just a network of cells each with their own alpha male, each controlling a site. It's always been that way.

It has a lot of lithium but the multi nationals finally realized to get it out would require a never ending series of bribes and private armies so for now they are gone.The heroin poppy business thrives even though the Taliban claims to be anti drugs showing you they only control certain areas. The US is out because they have no need for th e lithium at this time. The taliban was anti drugs and anti isis and anti Russia. The US was fighting all kinds of extremist cells the media lumped in with the taliban formerly called the mujahadeen. They were often not fighting the taliban but other vextremist non Afghanicrlls the taliban equally hated. It was stupid to have a war there but it was part of this stupid hegemony between the EU and US and Russia and China. The mega nationals will be back when they need lithium. This is a step down for the US so it can concentrate on the South Chine Seas and Ukraine, two hot spots that could explode any second. Also watch thd Lithuania Belarus border and Hong Kong or borders with Latvia and Estonia as well as Turkey and Greece. I think the Black Sea or South Chinese seas could accidentally trigger a serious conflict.

 

[Gladiator]

Is there competition for Islamic recruits, between the Afghan Government, the Taliban and ISIS? Who is winning?

"UNIDENTIFIED TALIBAN COMMANDER: (Through interpreter) These military achievements are so we can rule the country.

HADID: He goes on to say the strategy is to overrun key districts and encircle urban centers to force their surrender. The Taliban are also taking control of border crossings to deny the Afghan government revenue from customs duties and to compel neighboring countries to deal with them. One of the Taliban's greatest achievements was to overrun much of northern Afghanistan earlier this month. Afghan journalist Bilal Sarwary showed a video of Taliban fighters strolling through a newly conquered green valley. They were crying out long live the Islamic Emirate, which is what the Taliban call themselves.

(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED RECORDING)"

As Allied Forces Leave Afghanistan, The Taliban Keep Up Its Surge

Following the withdrawal of U.S. forces, the Taliban have begun a new phase of the conflict in Afghanistan. Their objective is to seize the entire country.

www.npr.org

//

 

[Gladiator]

"The assault on Badghis comes as the Taliban has besieged the capitals of several provinces across the country by overrunning surrounding districts, according to interviews with local officials. The territory grab has given the Taliban control of key roadways into and out of those areas, in what one Taliban commander said was the goal of the operation."

"Local officials in the area did not describe significant Taliban recruitment in Afghanistan’s north, but many cited deals made between local leadership and Taliban fighters in recent months that paved the way for the group’s swift advances.

Ultimately, the senior Taliban commander said the northern push was designed to secure financial gains for the militants.
The aim of the operation was to “get hold of financial hubs, and the main commercial trade routes connecting Afghanistan with central Asian countries,” he said, citing Afghanistan’s main port with Uzbekistan and crossing with Turkmenistan."

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/07/07/afghanistan-taliban-surge/

//

 

[Individual]

When these things aren't 'won' it's never the troops' fault. The decisions are made by men who sometimes don't know what the **** they are doing.

Pretty much the same as our government.

 

[Individual]

Maybe we should stop respecting our troops so much until they do better and start actually winning some of these things.

The troops are required to follow orders, as are their superiors. Who, then, should we disrespect when we're not winning?

 

[Red_Dave]

Since when was Afganistan in the Middle East?

 

[bluesmoke]

Since when was Afganistan in the Middle East?

A common misnomer. Afghanistan is part of the subcontinent of South Asia/Southern Asia. BTW, since when was Afghanistan spelled Afganistan?

 

[joluoto]

Thing looks really bleak for Afghanistan.

 

[uptower]

 

[Jredbaron96]

Again, you are making up your own realities. Subduing the communists would have taken an invasion of Russia and probably China. That is where their supplies came from. Nixon bombed the North Vietnamese into signing a treaty, even if that treaty was violated after we left. I don't call it an overall victory as the objective was ultimately lost when the north overran the south. America has never lost a war. That would take a military defeat.

That's not how war works. Either you accomplish your objectives and you win, or you don't and you lose.

Trying to paint Vietnam as anything other than a defeat is just face saving.

 

[swing_voter]

What would you call victory in Afghanistan for America?


Would you say that if Afghanistan were no longer a terrorist threat, our goals were met?



.

 

[bluesmoke]

Thing looks really bleak for Afghanistan.

When have things not looked bleak for Afghanistan in the last 2500 yrs?

 

[LetsGoBrandon]

That's not how war works. Either you accomplish your objectives and you win, or you don't and you lose.

Trying to paint Vietnam as anything other than a defeat is just face saving.

Vietnam was not a declared war. It was referred to as a "police action". To be fair, it was a war until the start of the Paris Peace talks. At that point the US military was denied permission to accomplish objectives. Prime military targets that would have led to victory were taken off limits. While there were still day to day battles, they did not mean anything. Ultimately after the North Vietnamese leadership walked out of the peace talks, President Nixon had had enough and ordered unrestricted carpet bombing of all prime military targets and had Haiphong Harbor mined. That brought the north back to the peace talks and a treaty was signed, ending our involvement. Only a complete moron would refer to that as a US defeat.