Stats compared: UK stabbings 2018 vs US shootings 2018 (1 Viewer)

[PeteEU]

I would just add to this part -- I feel very safe in the USA, and while I have guns, I'm rarely armed. I do, however, believe that others who might need to arm themselves have every right to do so. It's not the innocent people who are committing the crimes, after all, but it's a good idea to allow them to defend themselves.

Well I would not feel safe in the US... because you have a gun. And of course because the police are crazy.

 

[Gaugingcatenate]

That bit wasn't to you...

Yes, but my bit WAS for you.

 

[HowardBThiname]

What you are advocating is some sort of mad max meets the Purge society, where everyone is armed to the teeth. We had that once in the US.. the wild west, and here law and order was all but broken down and people lived in fear of bullies with guns. If guns were the solution to violence, then there would be no Syrian civil war, or failed states like Somalia, because guns would solve everything... they dont.

I'm not advocating that everyone is "armed to the teeth." I specifically said only those who chose to arm themselves. Yes, the Wild West was a frontier run by the law of the gun, but we have more laws than we need now to protect ourselves from vigilante types. Today in the USA, many are legally armed, but they aren't using their guns to bully others.

[qutoe]If guns were the solution to crime, then places like Texas and Florida would be crime free.. they are not. In fact they are quite unsafe because you can get gunned down by random people because they dont like how you look.. and those people will get away with it.

Arming the population aint a solution....it is like cutting off your foot because you have an ingrown toenail.[/QUOTE]

Not sure about Texas and Florida, I think they have some cultural issues they're dealing with, but where I live in the rural Midwest, nearly everyone is armed and our crime rate is extremely low.

The truth is, the amount of legally owned guns is not a contributor to crime, rather criminals with guns is. Or, without guns -- the common denominator is the criminal element.

But, as I said before, when you advocate taking them away, you advocate crimes against the weakest members of our society, by default. We don't need to go back to that.

 

[HowardBThiname]

Well I would not feel safe in the US... because you have a gun. And of course because the police are crazy.

Well, see, that fear is unreasonable because I've never discharged a gun toward another person and I'm very careful with my guns. Guns just don't suddenly go off -- someone has to pull a trigger.

And, you'd be surprised how great our police really are. You only hear about the tiny, tiny minority that are bad seeds. The majority are great people that would look out for your safety were you here.

 

[Infinite Chaos]

~ I'd like to know those reasons, since they are not apparent, and you did not cite them. But, if so, those reasons are important - so please let us know what they are. They did not appear in the study you cited earlier.

You're kidding right? Check back to the bit before you bolded.

~Also, I don't belong to the NRA, so your attempt to link me to what you see as a bogeyman falls on deaf ears.

OK. The premise of the thread is Trump's speech to the NRA. You chose to join the thread and your position is clearly along the lines Trump and the NRA espouse. More guns does not mean greater safety for the citizenry - there are no comparable worldwide stats that shows that American gun ownership rates means people are safer than non gun owning citizens of Japan / Korea / Taiwan / Canada or Western Europe.

You're currently dragging me into comparisons between US states which is a distraction from the original premise but I wanted to see where you were going in case there was a surprise.

~You keep running from my questions and posting others words. I don't want to debate anyone but you. Can't you put your thoughts and opinions into words?

Simple. I am pro gun but more along the models in Switzerland / Canada etc where gun ownership is promoted for responsible, mentally fit owners. I am against citizens walking around armed like they are in the wild west - to me, a society has failed when that is the resort because the police are not enforcing / keeping the law or where the gun industry pushes all sorts of misinformation and lies to push sales because at the end - that is what the gun industry truly wants. (more guns sold)

As others have pointed out - US weapon homicide statistics show a huge failing on the part of the US, contrary to the idiotic lie that no comparison can be made - it can and the comparison does not help the case for what the US does and how it treats gun ownership.

 

[Infinite Chaos]

Yes, but my bit WAS for you.

Thank you.

 

[PeteEU]

Well, see, that fear is unreasonable because I've never discharged a gun toward another person and I'm very careful with my guns. Guns just don't suddenly go off -- someone has to pull a trigger.

No it is not unreasonable.. because anyone can go "postal" at any time.. put a gun in their hands and well..

And, you'd be surprised how great our police really are. You only hear about the tiny, tiny minority that are bad seeds. The majority are great people that would look out for your safety were you here.

No doubt the majority are great people, but the minority is the problem and as long as you cant point them out.. then all cops are bad.

 

[HowardBThiname]

No it is not unreasonable.. because anyone can go "postal" at any time.. put a gun in their hands and well..

I don't really think "anyone" can go postal, it takes a certain type and mental outlook. Similarly, there's no reason to be afraid of everyone who owns a knife in London -- because the vast majority of knife owners will not go on a stabbing spree.

No doubt the majority are great people, but the minority is the problem and as long as you cant point them out.. then all cops are bad.

No, all cops are not bad, and that's a divisive way of looking at it. That type of attitude breeds contempt and leads to attacks on innocent officers. It also leads to people resisting arrest and getting themselves hurt.

 

[Brave New World]

 

[Infinite Chaos]

~ the minority is the problem ~

Well, the minority can cause damage exponentially worse than their number. Numbers of shootings by police in the US are horrendous. I feel a lot of their training is to escalate situations rather than deescalate and defuse.

~and as long as you cant point them out..

You wonder at the support the bad ones get when they kill people or arrest people the majority posters are "different from..."