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Should We Get Rid Of Monuments?

James972 said:
probably that the monuments don't show support for slavery but rather homage to freedom bravery etc things the south thought they fought for too. Don't forget 99% of southerners did not own slaves.

More importantly, the problem blacks have is not the monuments but rather being victimized by crippling liberal welfare programs.
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Do you always just make **** up and post it?
 
James972 said:
wanting cheap labor is not exploiting people if the cheap labor is taking the jobs because they pay more than any other jobs on earth available to them. They are literally risking their lives to get these jobs because they are such good jobs. Now do you understand?
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So you believe exploiting these people is the right thing to do. I guess if you are the one exploiting these people it is OK. I guess breaking our immigration laws is OK. I guess breaking our tax laws is OK. I guess breaking our laws by not paying minimum wage is OK. I guess having these people working in unsafe conditions is OK. Maybe chaining them up and beating them will be Ok as well one day.
 
Tigerace117 said:
Ah, the age old paranoid fantasy. Good luck with that bud.
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Exploiting immigrants has been a major part of our history. I guess it must continue even though it is clearly wrong. Whether it was the coal mines, the railroad, or the cotton fields it is all good I guess. Maybe one day we will evolve to the point where exploiting people is not OK.
 
apdst said:
Post a quote, then. Or, adnit you aren't being honest and your dishonest accusations are the only thing you can bring to the table.
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Your attempts to minimize slavery by trying to compare to vandalism; your desperate defense of the CSA's murder of American soldiers and sailors; frankly, there are too many to choose from.
 
PIPEWRENCH said:
Exploiting immigrants has been a major part of our history. I guess it must continue even though it is clearly wrong. Whether it was the coal mines, the railroad, or the cotton fields it is all good I guess. Maybe one day we will evolve to the point where exploiting people is not OK.
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Considering how many people still worship the Confederacy I highly doubt it
 
James972 said:
Not really England just switched to indentured servants from India and Spain used slaves in Cuba till the 1880's. Sorry to rock your world.
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Europe did not want African Negroes in their land just as later the Northern state did not want them. The Americas was different where they didn't have to live with them or deal with them but could profit off their labor but even then relegated to mostly the Southern rural states but keeping the indentured servants, temporary slaves, in the north.

This myth that seems to have been created that the Confederacy sent ships to Africa and captured African Negroes and put them on ships, throwing half of them overboard on the way here and then acting like the equivilent of Nazi's here while the North and the rest of the world had nothing to do with slavery is just that, a myth.
 
Tigerace117 said:
Your attempts to minimize slavery by trying to compare to vandalism; your desperate defense of the CSA's murder of American soldiers and sailors; frankly, there are too many to choose from.
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I never compared slavery to vandalism. You fabricated that. However, you proved that you support freedom and liberty, only up to the point that it suits your agenda. That type of thinking goes against everything America stands for.
 
Tigerace117 said:
And yet we know that throughout Western Europe people despised slavers and slavery, something which you clearly don't understand. It was considered peculiar that southerners still clung to it long after everyone else had gotten rid of it.
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They just didn't want African Negroes to overtake Europe so purchased and brought them to the Americas where they could profit off the labor and still traded with the former Colonies even after the Revolutionary war and some even posed to recognized and trade with the Confederacy had they strung together a few more convincing victories. Stop with trying to place them on higher moral grounds.
 
apdst said:
I never compared slavery to vandalism. You fabricated that. However, you proved that you support freedom and liberty, only up to the point that it suits your agenda. That type of thinking goes against everything America stands for.
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You started whining about vandalism earlier in the thread when I pointed out the fact that the statues celebrate a regime which fought for the "right" to own other people and whose worshippers went on to deny Americans their civil rights for years afterwards the war ended.

Oppressing others has nothing to do with freedom and liberty. There is no "freedom to oppress others" in the constitution.

You know what actually goes against everything America stands for? Celebrating the murder of American soldiers and sailors.
 
Stinger said:
They just didn't want African Negroes to overtake Europe so purchased and brought them to the Americas where they could profit off the labor and still traded with the former Colonies even after the Revolutionary war and some even posed to recognized and trade with the Confederacy had they strung together a few more convincing victories. Stop with trying to place them on higher moral grounds.
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:lamo

Buddy, there was zero chance of "African negros" overtaking Europe, and nobody in Europe thought there was. That particular racist myth has been around for a while, but it has different boogeymen.

So? Europeans played the major role in eradicating the slave trade from Africa itself to the New World. What's your point?

No, no country ever recognized the Confederacy. England and France's ruling class had a soft spot for slavers, and more importantly the idea of "proving" that democracy wouldn't work, but the people of those countries never would have stood for it, and indeed didn't.

And if the Confederacy had Kalishnikovs they definitely would have won the war. "If" is useless.

Yes, the Europeans, to be frank, were on a much higher ground when you compare them to the Confederacy
 
While folk are still on about the 'monuments' (cuz...you know...they 'care' so much) I would like to just remind everyone that in one city...a city fairly free of monuments and confederate flags, to date in 2017 alone there has been:

Shot & Killed: 471
Shot & Wounded: 2255
Total Shot: 2726
Total Homicides: 508

The vast majority of victims in all of those cases are black males. The second largest demographic (trailing by a LOT) are black females. In case you were still pretending that black lives matter or some other sad bull****.

In that same city, latest estimates (compiled by the previous administration) show that 47% of its residents are illiterate. 80% of their current class population is functionally illiterate in both reading and mathematics. That might account for an unemployment rate of 13% (despite the city unemployemnt picture overall IMPROVING) for all black Americans living in that city, with black Americans under 25 years of age being unemployed at just south of 50%.

The joys southern Black Americans can expect to enjoy once they get rid of all those monuments.
 
James972 said:
and Jesus Christ himself accepted slavery!! So lets get rid of them all and start over like Hitler Stalin and Mao did. There is no need to conserve the best of history rather we should just start history all over again-right?
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if one accepts The Bible then I would agree with that statement, as Jesus never spoke in favor, nor against slavery

In John it states Jesus and God the Father are one & also states Jesus was with God from the beginning.
If that is correct then how could the followers of Jesus aka Christians not accept that Jesus himself approved of all of the brutal things that God himself approved of in the Old Testament?

Many Southerners during the US Civil War era were very religious/Christians yet they firmly believed in the brutality of slavery, just as the New & Old Testaments imply.
 
Paperview said:
I notice he does that a lot. That last one was a whopper.
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I thought about responding specifically about what were lies and misinformation, but they were so obviously crap that I decided it would be just as stupid to respond to the stupid comment.
 
Tigerace117 said:
You started whining about vandalism earlier in the thread when I pointed out the fact that the statues celebrate a regime which fought for the "right" to own other people and whose worshippers went on to deny Americans their civil rights for years afterwards the war ended.

Oppressing others has nothing to do with freedom and liberty. There is no "freedom to oppress others" in the constitution.
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Are you sure about that? I thought it was OK to exploit immigrants/aliens in this country. Today we exploit illegal aliens so we can be rich. Nothing wrong with that. Lets move those monuments over to the fields in California, Arizona, New Mexico etc. where they belong.
 
VanceMack said:
While folk are still on about the 'monuments' (cuz...you know...they 'care' so much) I would like to just remind everyone that in one city...a city fairly free of monuments and confederate flags, to date in 2017 alone there has been:

Shot & Killed: 471
Shot & Wounded: 2255
Total Shot: 2726
Total Homicides: 508

The vast majority of victims in all of those cases are black males. The second largest demographic (trailing by a LOT) are black females. In case you were still pretending that black lives matter or some other sad bull****.

In that same city, latest estimates (compiled by the previous administration) show that 47% of its residents are illiterate. 80% of their current class population is functionally illiterate in both reading and mathematics. That might account for an unemployment rate of 13% (despite the city unemployemnt picture overall IMPROVING) for all black Americans living in that city, with black Americans under 25 years of age being unemployed at just south of 50%.

The joys southern Black Americans can expect to enjoy once they get rid of all those monuments.
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They have the American dream to look forward to. Food stamps and welfare.
 
PIPEWRENCH said:
Are you sure about that? I thought it was OK to exploit immigrants/aliens in this country. Today we exploit illegal aliens so we can be rich. Nothing wrong with that. Lets move those monuments over to the fields in California, Arizona, New Mexico etc. where they belong.
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You clearly thought wrong. Also, illegal immigrants aren't property regardless
 
Tigerace117 said:
You know what actually goes against everything America stands for? Celebrating the murder of American soldiers and sailors.
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If you look at the monuments there is no celebration. They are much more like tombstones.
 
cuban smokes said:
if one accepts The Bible then I would agree with that statement, as Jesus never spoke in favor, nor against slavery

In John it states Jesus and God the Father are one & also states Jesus was with God from the beginning.
If that is correct then how could the followers of Jesus aka Christians not accept that Jesus himself approved of all of the brutal things that God himself approved of in the Old Testament?

Many Southerners during the US Civil War era were very religious/Christians yet they firmly believed in the brutality of slavery, just as the New & Old Testaments imply.
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there is nothing there in support of brutality. The opposite in fact. More than half the population were slaves and changing that would have seemed been like changing the movement of the earth. Further, slaves were considered lucky because they were not killed in battle but given the opportunity to live as slaves. It was only the morality of Jesus that eventually enabled mankind to see slavery as immoral.
 
Tigerace117 said:
No, they really aren't anything like tombstones.
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if so why are you afraid to present evidence that they are celebrations as you said?? Sorry to rock your world.
 
James972 said:
if so why are you afraid to present evidence that they are celebrations as you said?? Sorry to rock your world.
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You are absolutely terrified of the topic so you are desperately trying to sidetrack the discussion, as usual. All you are "rocking" is your own ignorance.

Pay the **** up.
 
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