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Should a white flag be recognised?

alexa said:
As far as I'm aware and I am just going by memory, it is very difficult to bring charges against the US because they refused to sign up for whatever the agreement is on war crimes. I understand this was to avoid being brought to court.

It is also very difficult to bring anything against Israel - again just from memory, but I understand that even if the UN does an enquiry which I think it was supposed to have started, the fact that Israel will refuse to come and give witness means that it unlikely to be able to come to a just conclusion.

The US and Israel hence protect themselves from charges which other countries might face.

As far as Hamas in the Gaza war, I understood charges were being brought against Hamas as well as Israel.
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No, charges are not being brought against Hamas or Israel.

And who investigates Britain?
 
Apocalypse said:
No, charges are not being brought against Hamas or Israel.

And who investigates Britain?
Click to expand...

I think we can be charged like most people. I will need to do a search concerning charges against Israel because about a month ago I saw they were due to begin - or maybe it was pre investigations were due to begin. They did though say that because Israel would fail to come they were unlikely to achieve anything.,
 
alexa said:
I think we can be charged like most people. I will need to do a search concerning charges against Israel because about a month ago I saw they were due to begin - or maybe it was pre investigations were due to begin. They did though say that because Israel would fail to come they were unlikely to achieve anything.,
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I didn't ask if Britain can be charged, I'm asking who's doing the investigation of the British involvement in the Iraq and Afghanistan wars.
 
Apocalypse said:
I didn't ask if Britain can be charged, I'm asking who's doing the investigation of the British involvement in the Iraq and Afghanistan wars.
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Why would anyone be doing an investigation?
 
Apocalypse said:
And who investigates Britain?
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The same folks who investigate the US Predator attacks in Pakistan.

It's not what you do but rather, who you are.
 
alexa said:
Why would anyone be doing an investigation?
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Alexa, let's think together for a moment.
Why would anyone be doing an investigation on Israel?
Now, why would anyone be doing an investigation on Britain?

Key words:
Gaza, Afghanistan, Iraq.
 
Apocalypse said:
Alexa, let's think together for a moment.
Why would anyone be doing an investigation on Israel?
Now, why would anyone be doing an investigation on Britain?

Key words:
Gaza, Afghanistan, Iraq.
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There were a lot of calls made during the war by the UN that Israel was guilty of war crimes. That sounds like a good reason.

Also that Hamas was guilty too - of using civilians as human shields and of killing civilians in the aftermath I think.

I am unaware of us (UK) having committed war crimes. There have been a few trials for some soldiers but I am unaware of any 'war crimes' as such.....

now don't get me wrong here, I am not justifying Britains position in Iraq. I was against it from the beginning.

There is also grave doubt as to whether it was a legal war or not.

It is quite right that the UK people responsible should be brought to trial if there is anything to bring them to trial about.

But there needs to be a reason. I have not heard of it. If you know of one please tell me.
 
Apocalypse said:
Do you have a source that is not presenting a gallery of injured/dead Palestinians in its main page?
Palestine Think Tank
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Well :lol: that wasn't deliberate!! I may find it another day, not in the mood for a long look.

It was a kosher thing I found a month or two ago but that computer has broken down so I don't have a link on this one. ;)
 
alexa said:
As far as Israel is concerned I have found this asking for information submissions in June. Do you have anything to say that it has been decided charges will not be brought and why?

UN Fact Finding Mission on Gaza War begins: call for submissions | Palestine Think Tank
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Where are these UN calls for submissions alexa?

UN Fact Finding Mission on Iraq War
UN Fact Finding Mission on War In Afghanistan
UN Fact Finding Mission on Sierra Leone
UN Fact Finding Mission on Myanmar
UN Fact Finding Mission on Sudan
UN Fact Finding Mission on Congo
UN Fact Finding Mission on Ossetia
UN Fact Finding Mission on Chechnya
UN Fact Finding Mission on Somalia
 
Tashah said:
Where are these UN calls for submissions alexa?

UN Fact Finding Mission on Iraq War
UN Fact Finding Mission on War In Afghanistan
UN Fact Finding Mission on Sierra Leone
UN Fact Finding Mission on Myanmar
UN Fact Finding Mission on Sudan
UN Fact Finding Mission on Congo
UN Fact Finding Mission on Ossetia
UN Fact Finding Mission on Chechnya
UN Fact Finding Mission on Somalia
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I am clearly missing the point. Who has said anything about the UN doing a fact finding mission on these places though I very much suspect a lot of them will have been done. I am sure if you do searches you will be able to find this.
 
alexa said:
I am clearly missing the point. Who has said anything about the UN doing a fact finding mission on these places though I very much suspect a lot of them will have been done. I am sure if you do searches you will be able to find this.
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You had no trouble fetching one for Israel. The Gaza War was nothing compared to what I listed above. Strange how that works isn't it?
 
Tashah said:
You had no trouble fetching one for Israel. The Gaza War was nothing compared to what I listed above. Strange how that works isn't it?
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:confused: are we not discussing Israel? Were we not discussing Israel and war crimes? :confused:
 
alexa said:
I am unaware of us (UK) having committed war crimes. There have been a few trials for some soldiers but I am unaware of any 'war crimes' as such.....
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Well let's see...

UK should face court for crimes in Iraq, say jurists | UK news | The Guardian
Pinter demands war crimes trial for Blair | World news | guardian.co.uk
Call to investigate Britain for Iraq war crimes
http://www.irak.be/ned/missies/medi...t/War crimes ravage public health in Iraq.pdf
Uk War Crimes In Iraq — Blogs, Pictures, and more on WordPress
Three UK soldiers in Iraq charged with war crimes - : news, world | euronews
BBC NEWS | UK | British soldier admits war crime
Kidnap and torture: new claims of Army war crimes in Iraq - Crime, UK - The Independent
Iraq War Crimes

Hypocrisy is a fine word, don't you think?
 
alexa said:
:confused: are we not discussing Israel? Were we not discussing Israel and war crimes? :confused:
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I rub your nose in the double-standard and you still can't smell it

/sigh
 
Apocalypse said:
Well let's see...

UK should face court for crimes in Iraq, say jurists | UK news | The Guardian
Pinter demands war crimes trial for Blair | World news | guardian.co.uk
Call to investigate Britain for Iraq war crimes
http://www.irak.be/ned/missies/medi...t/War crimes ravage public health in Iraq.pdf
Uk War Crimes In Iraq — Blogs, Pictures, and more on WordPress
Three UK soldiers in Iraq charged with war crimes - : news, world | euronews
BBC NEWS | UK | British soldier admits war crime
Kidnap and torture: new claims of Army war crimes in Iraq - Crime, UK - The Independent
Iraq War Crimes

Hypocrisy is a fine word, don't you think?
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Yes, there have been individual soldiers and groups of soldiers who have been charged and there has been demands from this country itself for inquiries into it from the beginning. Something which we are now having and which people are concerned may be a white wash.

However unlike the US and Israel as far as I am aware there is nothing to stop the UN from bringing the UK to trial so a great deal of the furore against the UK in this instance comes from the UK itself. I think all your links for example are from the UK. This war did not have the support of most of the UK people.

Britain has signed up for treaties. There is no reason not to take the UK to court if there is a valid reason.

In the meantime it is the citizens of the UK who are trying to get some justice over this.
 
Tashah said:
I rub your nose in the double-standard and you still can't smell it

/sigh
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Oh, I certainly noticed what you were trying to do. I just decided to ignore a flame.

There is no rubbing of noses, there is just someone being silly.
 
alexa said:
Britain has signed up for treaties. There is no reason not to take the UK to court if there is a valid reason.
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I agree, so why aren't anyone bringing justice upon the UK?
Why are there no charges?
What is so special about the UK?
The answer is, agenda.
 
alexa said:
Oh, I certainly noticed what you were trying to do. I just decided to ignore a flame.

There is no rubbing of noses, there is just someone being silly.
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And that someone's nickname has 2 A's one E and one L, and he's not Apocalypse. :2razz:
 
Apocalypse said:
I agree, so why aren't anyone bringing justice upon the UK?
Why are there no charges?
What is so special about the UK?
The answer is, agenda.
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I doubt it.

If you take the first link you will see

t also said Britain was complicit in the actions of the US military, including the killing of international journalists.
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UK should face court for crimes in Iraq, say jurists | UK news | The Guardian

It has crossed my mind that it could have to do with not being able to bring the US to trial.

We have though thankfully now banned cluster bombs.
 
Apocalypse said:
You didn't answer my question.
Who investigates the Afghanistan or Iraq wars?
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Not the International Criminal Court since the USA decided not be held responsible for their war crimes (like China, Russia or Saudi Arabia), but it should be this court.

It is the same for Israel.
 
Tashah said:
Where are these UN calls for submissions alexa?

UN Fact Finding Mission on Iraq War
UN Fact Finding Mission on War In Afghanistan
UN Fact Finding Mission on Sierra Leone
UN Fact Finding Mission on Myanmar
UN Fact Finding Mission on Sudan
UN Fact Finding Mission on Congo
UN Fact Finding Mission on Ossetia
UN Fact Finding Mission on Chechnya
UN Fact Finding Mission on Somalia
Click to expand...

You're right, the UN is not unbiased. Look at the countries who have veto rights, these are the ones who produce most of the bias IMO.

Since Russia got the veto right, you won't find any resolution about Chechnya or Ossetia.

But the bias is not only against Israel, the USA have vetoed several UN resolutions against Israel.

Still, an international court like the ICC, with judges coming from all over the world, is likely to be less biased than judges who have the same nationality than the accused war criminals.
 
bub said:
Still, an international court like the ICC, with judges coming from all over the world, is likely to be less biased than judges who have the same nationality than the accused war criminals.
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When everyone is equally liable for the war crimes dock, then so be it. But until that day, I see no sustainable reason why Israel should be the only Westernized nation to be investigated and hounded. No able-nation would have shown the restraint of Israel and waited years to respond to daily rocket attacks on her citizens.

Indeed, if the wonderful UN had put even half the energy of its post-war Gaza investigation into pre-war castigation and condemnation of the Hamas rocket attacks, no Israeli invasion would have transpired. What you have here is a United Nations that is investigating events that would not have occured sans the failures of the United Nations itself.

The United Nations fails on both ends. On the prologue end it fails to arbitrate disputes honestly and thus prevent warfare. On the epilogue end it fails to hold all nations equally accountable for the warfare it failed to prevent on the prologue end. An abysmal failure from one end to the other.
 
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