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Should a pregnant wife inform her husband if she is having and abortion?

Should a pregnant wife inform her husband if she is having and abortion?

  • Yes, he has a right to know its his child too

    Votes: 24 80.0%
  • No, its her body not his

    Votes: 6 20.0%

  • Total voters
    30
Deegan said:
No it does not, I have a feeling you only read what you want to read.:confused:

Now why don't you take your own advice here sir?
The first option reads: Yes, he has a right to know its his child too

How does he have a RIGHT unless is is legislated? That is notthe same as saying that he "ought to." If it is a right, then she HAS to tell him.



SO what was the meaning with your tirade against me?
 
steen said:
Which means that she can just claim that she told him. After the fact, it becomes a "she said/he said" issue

Well, yea. That's what most things in life are. That's not a problem. If such a law were to pass, and the husband claimed he was never told, while the wife claimed he was told, (aside from the fact that a divorce would be in the works), one would have to testify to that account.

I think you'd see this a lot less than you think you would. The thought of being put under oath makes 99.9% of people suddenly "remember" the truth.
 
steen said:
And if he then refuse to sign, she can't have the abortion. yes, then it becomes a defacto permission slip.

And voila, the fundies have reached their goal of oppressing women, of having men control and opppress them in the best misogynistic theocratic fashion. It is pure and unbridled fascism, that's what it is, this push of Government control in people's private lives.

No, you're actually wrong. There is no permission slip. There is just notification. That's it.
 
steen said:
The first option reads: Yes, he has a right to know its his child too

How does he have a RIGHT unless is is legislated? That is notthe same as saying that he "ought to." If it is a right, then she HAS to tell him.



SO what was the meaning with your tirade against me?

Because while it may be worded incorrectly, Navy has said that it IS law, and knows it can not be challenged.

As I said, reading more carefully, the entire thread, may help more folks understand.

As you can see, the word "right" has many meanings......

That which is just, morally good, legal, proper, or fitting.

The direction or position on the right side.
The right side.
The right hand.
A turn in the direction of the right hand or side.
often Right
The people and groups who advocate the adoption of conservative or reactionary measures, especially in government and politics. Also called right wing.
The opinion of those advocating such measures.
Sports. A blow delivered by a boxer's right hand.
Baseball. Right field.

Something that is due to a person or governmental body by law, tradition, or nature.
Something, especially humane treatment, claimed to be due to animals by moral principle.
A just or legal claim or title.

A stockholder's privilege of buying additional stock in a corporation at a special price, usually at par or at a price below the current market value.
The negotiable certificate on which this privilege is indicated.
A privilege of subscribing for a particular stock or bond. Often used in the plural.

adv.
Toward or on the right.
In a straight line; directly: went right to school.
In the proper or desired manner; well: The jacket doesn't fit right.
Exactly; just: The accident happened right over there.
Immediately: called me right after dinner.
Completely; quite: The icy wind blew right through me.
According to law, morality, or justice.
Accurately; correctly: answered the question right.
Chiefly Southern U.S. Considerably; very: They have a right nice place.
Used as an intensive: kept right on going.
Used in titles: The Right Reverend Jane Smith.

v. right·ed, right·ing, rights
v. tr.
To put in or restore to an upright or proper position: They righted their boat.
To put in order or set right; correct: measures designed to right generations of unfair labor practices.
To make reparation or amends for; redress: right a wrong.

v. intr.
To regain an upright or proper position.

Idioms:
by rights
In a just or proper manner; justly.
in (one's) own right
Through the force of one's own skills or qualifications.
right and left
From all directions or on every side: criticism coming right and left; questions raised from right and left.
right away/off
Immediately; at once; without delay.
right on
Slang Used as an exclamation of encouragement, support, or enthusiastic agreement.
to rights
In a satisfactory or orderly condition: set the place to rights.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[Middle English, from Old English riht; see reg- in Indo-European Roots. N., sense 3, from the fact that conservatives sit on the right side of the legislative chamber in various assemblies.]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
righter n.
Synonyms: right, privilege, prerogative, perquisite, birthright
These nouns apply to something, such as a power or possession, to which one has an established claim. Right refers to a legally, morally, or traditionally just claim: “I'm a champion for the Rights of Woman” (Maria Edgeworth). “An unconditional right to say what one pleases about public affairs is what I consider to be the minimum guarantee of the First Amendment” (Hugo L. Black). Privilege usually suggests a right not enjoyed by everyone: Use of the company jet was a privilege reserved for the top executives. Prerogative denotes an exclusive right or privilege, as one based on custom, law, or office: It is my prerogative to change my mind. A perquisite is a privilege or advantage accorded to one by virtue of one's position or the needs of one's employment: “The wardrobe of her niece was the perquisite of her [maid]” (Tobias Smollett). A birthright is a right to which one is entitled by birth: Many view gainful employment as a birthright.
Our Living Language Speakers of Standard English mainly restrict the use of adverbial right to modify adverbs of space or time, as in She's right over there or Do it right now! No such restriction applies in Southern vernacular speech, where right can be used to intensify the meaning of many adjectives and adverbs, as in He's right nice or You talk right fast. This broader use of right is attested as far back as the 15th century and is found in the works of Shakespeare and other great writers. Thus, what appears to be neglect of Standard English rules is actually the retention of a once-proper historical usage. ·The use of right as an adverb indicating directness, completeness, or general intensity seems to be related to the use of right in a more concrete sense to refer to something that is perfectly straight or perpendicular to something else, as in right angle. A similar connection between concrete and metaphorical meaning lies behind the Southern adverbial usage of plumb, as in He fell plumb asleep as an indicator of completeness or totality. See note at smart.
 
RightatNYU said:
While you might have a good argument, the addition of the word fascist doesn't really add much, and makes your posts seem much more alarmist.
Fascism was about Government control over people's private lives, the idea that thr String Government knowns what should happen with your life.

And this idea certainly is a strong push in that direction away from personal liberty and individual rights. So where am I wrong in seeing this as a fascist policy?

(Now, what was your point about the rest of my post? "a good argument"? Which were not good?)
 
steen said:
The first option reads: Yes, he has a right to know its his child too

How does he have a RIGHT unless is is legislated? That is notthe same as saying that he "ought to." If it is a right, then she HAS to tell him.



SO what was the meaning with your tirade against me?

Listen, just because you interpret something one way does not mean that that is the only way.

I believe that he has a right to know. I do not believe he has a legal right to be told. The right to know is a moral right, one of trust implicit in a marriage. Doesn't mean the gov should legislate it, but it's a right nonetheless.
 
Deegan said:
I can really only concern myself with my own, close inner circle, this is all I can do, and I am more then satisfied with that reality.;)


That is not true....If your anti murder in the womb speak up......I think there are more people out there pro life then the pro abortions think there are.....

I just hope before I kick the bucket that Roe V Wade is exposed for the flawed law it is............
 
RightatNYU said:
It doesn't matter. It's not a consent issue, its a notification issue. If she tells him, then she's free to do what she pleases (If this were proposed and passed as a law).

Exactly, sadly the father has no say in the matter........
 
steen said:
Fascism was about Government control over people's private lives, the idea that thr String Government knowns what should happen with your life.

And this idea certainly is a strong push in that direction away from personal liberty and individual rights. So where am I wrong in seeing this as a fascist policy?

(Now, what was your point about the rest of my post? "a good argument"? Which were not good?)

It's simply inflammatory statements. Terms like "Fascism" and "Communism" are thrown around so easily by people who have no idea what they mean. If you think something is signalling a shift toward government control, that makes it more conservative. If something is pushing toward less control, that makes it more liberal. (Using classic definitions)

Labelling something fascist because you don't like it cheapens the word, is intellectually dishonest, and makes you seem less reasonable than your argument would merit.
 
Navy Pride said:
That is not true....If your anti murder in the womb speak up......I think there are more people out there pro life then the pro abortions think there are.....

I just hope before I kick the bucket that Roe V Wade is exposed for the flawed law it is............

Well, I agree with you half way...while I think the results of Roe are in the end, for the best, the way it was reached and the constitutional precedent behind the case were ridiculous and should be overturned.
 
RightatNYU said:
No, you're actually wrong. There is no permission slip. There is just notification. That's it.
You don't get it. How would you prove notification, then? How wouold the clinic know he was notified and then go ahead with the medical procedure?
 
steen said:
You don't get it. How would you prove notification, then? How wouold the clinic know he was notified and then go ahead with the medical procedure?

This exactly the conclusion I came to, if you had bothered to read the entire thread, and not attacked me as a "facist":roll:
 
Deegan said:
As you can see, the word "right" has many meanings......
yeah, more sophistry. Yes, I am sure Navy meant a baseball "right field" when talking about the husband having a "right" to know. Could you please show the courtesy of taking other people's posts serious instead of such irrelevant stuff?
 
steen said:
yeah, more sophistry. Yes, I am sure Navy meant a baseball "right field" when talking about the husband having a "right" to know. Could you please show the courtesy of taking other people's posts serious instead of such irrelevant stuff?

Read the post above yours, and I'll see what I can do.;)
 
RightatNYU said:
It's simply inflammatory statements. Terms like "Fascism" and "Communism" are thrown around so easily by people who have no idea what they mean.
I don't concern myself with what other people do. It has nothing to do with being inflammatory, it has to do with being factual (obviously you don't know me, or you would know that I will go over 100s of posts arguing factuality).
If you think something is signalling a shift toward government control, that makes it more conservative. If something is pushing toward less control, that makes it more liberal. (Using classic definitions)
No, using lame, ignorant American definitions that don't fit. There is a difference between conservatism and Fascism. When the push goes towards the strong, central Government controlling its citizens' private lives, then it is fascism. Perhaps you should look up what fascism actually is before accusing me of catering to platitudes.
Labelling something fascist because you don't like it cheapens the word, is intellectually dishonest, and makes you seem less reasonable than your argument would merit.
See my pm to you about that claim (I decided to not post it here for the chance of a peaceful resolution)
 
steen said:
You don't get it. How would you prove notification, then? How wouold the clinic know he was notified and then go ahead with the medical procedure?

No, YOU don't get it. The clinic doesn't have to prove anything. The only time the statue would come into play would be if the woman had the procedure, and THEN the husband claimed he was never informed. In that case, if both parties still stuck to their guns, they would have to testify under oath. This is all under the assumption that the gov would choose to follow the case, which they most likely wouldn't.
 
RightatNYU said:
Well, I agree with you half way...while I think the results of Roe are in the end, for the best, the way it was reached and the constitutional precedent behind the case were ridiculous and should be overturned.


Abortion should be a states rights issue plain and simple.........The federal government should have no say in it...........

What is really ironic is the woman that was talked into filing the lawsuit by the feminist movement that made Roe V Wade is totally pro life now and has said that it was the biggest mistake she has made in her life...........
 
Deegan said:
This exactly the conclusion I came to, if you had bothered to read the entire thread, and not attacked me as a "facist":roll:
I didn't. I see the idea of notification as fascist. I didn't call you fascist.

And my remark was to RightatNYU, not to you. So why are you taking it personal?
 
Deegan said:
Read the post above yours, and I'll see what I can do.;)
I did. Are you here to fight and insult me? Rest assured that I can give back as well as you dish out if THAT is what you are trying for with your unwarranted accusations.
 
RightatNYU said:
No, YOU don't get it. The clinic doesn't have to prove anything. The only time the statue would come into play would be if the woman had the procedure, and THEN the husband claimed he was never informed. In that case, if both parties still stuck to their guns, they would have to testify under oath. This is all under the assumption that the gov would choose to follow the case, which they most likely wouldn't.
If there is a right by statute for him to be notified, then the clinic would not have the right to do the procedure without being sure that the law is being followed or THEY get sued. So yes, they will need proofo of notification, which means that the refusal of signing the slip means that he blocks her medical procedure. hence, it is a permission slip.
 
steen said:
I didn't. I see the idea of notification as fascist. I didn't call you fascist.

And my remark was to RightatNYU, not to you. So why are you taking it personal?

Read again where you quoted me, and explain yourself. You used words that were not fitting my reponses in this thread.
 
Navy Pride said:
Abortion should be a states rights issue plain and simple.........The federal government should have no say in it...........

What is really ironic is the woman that was talked into filing the lawsuit by the feminist movement that made Roe V Wade is totally pro life now and has said that it was the biggest mistake she has made in her life...........
How ironic that you now are trying to steer the tread away form the specific issue. It must not have gone the way you wanted it to.
 
Deegan said:
Read again where you quoted me, and explain yourself. You used words that were not fitting my reponses in this thread.
What I replied to was a post from rightatNYU, and you quote it as an attack on you. That simply is not true.
 
steen said:
I don't concern myself with what other people do. It has nothing to do with being inflammatory, it has to do with being factual (obviously you don't know me, or you would know that I will go over 100s of posts arguing factuality).
No, using lame, ignorant American definitions that don't fit. There is a difference between conservatism and Fascism. When the push goes towards the strong, central Government controlling its citizens' private lives, then it is fascism. Perhaps you should look up what fascism actually is before accusing me of catering to platitudes.
See my pm to you about that claim (I decided to not post it here for the chance of a peaceful resolution)

You're right, there is a difference between conservatism and Fascism. What you and I disagree on is what the line is. I, and the majority of the country, would not see the proposing of a law requiring spousal notification before getting an abortion as "Fascist."

I might not agree with the law, but I think mislabelling it because of your own personal biases is a bit unfair, and I stated such.
 
steen said:
How ironic that you now are trying to steer the tread away form the specific issue. It must not have gone the way you wanted it to.

Ahhhh i started the thread Steen.........I was just responding to someones elses comments.........

I am sure that is not the first time that has happened in this forum........

As far as going my way acording to the vote it is going quite well in my way and not in yours........:roll:
 
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