Rudy Giuliani on Michael Cohen's prison term, Flynn memos

[Crosscheck]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

He also marketed himself whenever possible,

”I was at ground zero as often, if not more, than most of the workers. I was there working with them. I was there guiding things. I was there bringing people there. But I was exposed to exactly the same things they were exposed to. So in that sense, I'm one of them.”
While campaigning in Cincinnati, as quoted in The New York Times (11 August 2007)

Hell , he led the firemen up the stairwells of the first tower. Luckily when he jumped from the 62nd floor he landed on his ego.

 

[JustHanging]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

I agree that Mayor Giuliani is not a really effective attorney for the President.

The mayor is still trading on his reputation made on 9/11.

What the President needs is some top-notch, highly competent, and smooth-talking attorneys. Of course, he cannot find any, for attorneys of that caliber know that (sadly) the President is toast, so they do not want to alienate the liberal bigwigs who will soon be taking over the White House.

I believe Trump has a long history of not paying his lawyers. Do you think, maybe just this once, we could hold Trump responsible for his incompetence instead of blaming everyone else?


Dozens of lawsuits accuse Trump of not paying his bills, reports claim
The USA Today report cited one case involving a 1990 project at the Trump Taj Mahal in Atlantic City, during which New Jersey regulators found that Trump had failed to pay at least 253 subcontractors in full or on time.

Joe Scarborough explains Trump's lawyer woes: "He doesn't pay his bills"


Trump is nothing more than a common flimflam man who realized that roughly 1/3 of America is really really gullible. For that, I give him credit.

 

[ElChupacabra]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

I agree that Mayor Giuliani is not a really effective attorney for the President.

The mayor is still trading on his reputation made on 9/11.

What the President needs is some top-notch, highly competent, and smooth-talking attorneys. Of course, he cannot find any, for attorneys of that caliber know that (sadly) the President is toast, so they do not want to alienate the liberal bigwigs who will soon be taking over the White House.

The other part of it is keeping your client on message, and with Trump that's always a wild card. You're only one tweet away from some big PR mess to sort out.

 

[haymarket]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

Hell , he led the firemen up the stairwells of the first tower. Luckily when he jumped from the 62nd floor he landed on his ego.

Fortunately, Trump had already jumped from the roof and was there to catch Rudy before he splattered.

 

[iguanaman]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

Wow, so many bad [former] comics on late night... you here trying to be funny, auditioning for a late night spot... or merely trying to be as serious as a lost lefty can muster?

I bet you were one of those that thought there was going to be a 20 to 40 year realignment of the parties in the Democrats favor with the election of slenderfella in 2008, huh? Too too funny... but egregiously sad at the very same time.

No, this is not like 2008 Trump has inspired true change against anyone remotely like him ever gaining power again. And it has exposed the spineless vapidness of the party that supports him. For that we are truly thankful. Merry Christmas.

 

[MTAtech]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

https://www.foxnews.com/transcript/rudy-giuliani-on-michael-cohens-prison-term-flynn-memos

This guy is unbelievable. Chris Wallace is completely befuddled as Giuliani tries to dance around his questions.

WALLACE: -- they discussed the payment to Karen McDougal.

GIULIANI: We're talking about something that doesn't matter. I mean, whether - whether it happened or didn't happen, it's not illegal.

(CROSSTALK)

WALLACE: You're moving shells around on me. Either it happened or it didn't happen.

GIULIANI: But that's what lawyers do all the time. You argue in the alternative. I'm telling it --

WALLACE: But I'm asking you for the truth, sir.

GIULIANI: I'm telling you definitively -- well, I -- I want the truth too. And the truth is, yes, the tape-recorded conversation did take place. It exonerates the president. The president tells Cohen, do it by check.

Giuliani says Trump didn't know about the payments, as Trump clearly stated on AF1. And Giuliani also says Trump told Cohen to pay the reimbursement "by check." So Trump doesn't know about the payments, AND he is OK with the reimbursements. Of course, Cohen knows if there is a check, there is a paper trail. Trump is so informed, and he is also OK with cash payments.

So, according to Giuliani, the truth is "Yes and No."

Even Trump must be shaking his head after that interview.

I think Rudy is getting dementia.

 

[trixare4kids]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

I believe Trump has a long history of not paying his lawyers. Do you think, maybe just this once, we could hold Trump responsible for his incompetence instead of blaming everyone else?


Dozens of lawsuits accuse Trump of not paying his bills, reports claim
The USA Today report cited one case involving a 1990 project at the Trump Taj Mahal in Atlantic City, during which New Jersey regulators found that Trump had failed to pay at least 253 subcontractors in full or on time.

Joe Scarborough explains Trump's lawyer woes: "He doesn't pay his bills"


Trump is nothing more than a common flimflam man who realized that roughly 1/3 of America is really really gullible. For that, I give him credit.

Where did you come up with the 1/3 figure when the population of the country is roughly 329 million, and Trump rcvd. roughly 63 million votes?
More like less than 1/5 of America voted for Trump.

This said, there were two choices for president in 2016. Many saw them both as choosing between a rock and a hard place, so there's also that.
Clinton won the popular vote, another fifth of the country, so your math is more than a bit off. :mrgreen:

Roughly, three fifths of the country didn't vote, and that's the real tragedy.

 

[justabubba]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

I think Rudy is getting dementia.

is that the 'skill set' tRump needs in his replacement press secretary

 

[uptower]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

Clear his name of what? Mueller has been unable to identify any collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia. He has not charged guys like PapaD or Flynn with a crime for having met Russians. What exactly is Trump supposed to know about collusion that guys like these dont know ?

There is plenty of evidence that the Trump campaign conspired with Russia to affect the outcome of the election. There has been for a while, which is what sparked the investigation to begin with.

The only 'question' remaining is whether it was directed by Trump himself or all just a happy accident, as his surrogates claim. That's worth continuing the investigation until they get some answers. Many legal experts think Mueller already has those answers and is putting together a case thorough enough to send back to the DOJ.

 

[Conaeolos]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

You guys are so funny; he's right on point. There is a misleading narrative at play, Giuliani rightfully sees that narrative is a trap and fights getting into stupid details that give creedence to its misleading nature. One should focus on context not distracting content.

There is a lot of bad lawyering, but Giuliani, in a very tough job, seems to be doing well, understanding this is not your typical case and must be dealt with accordingly.

 

[MTAtech]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

You guys are so funny; he's right on point. There is a misleading narrative at play, Giuliani rightfully sees that narrative is a trap and fights getting into stupid details that give creedence to its misleading nature. One should focus on context not distracting content.

There is a lot of bad lawyering, but Giuliani, in a very tough job, seems to be doing well, understanding this is not your typical case and must be dealt with accordingly.

The only trap in allowing Swampy to testify is that he’s incapable of telling the truth, and Rudy knows it.

 

[Conaeolos]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

There is plenty of evidence that the Trump campaign conspired with Russia to affect the outcome of the election.

:doh Then why such a diffcult time making the case outside the accusation?

But let's go through this one cited list:

Two separate hacks of Democratic Party emails

Servers/records having never been turned over and investigated outside a insider DNC paid firm. There is no unbaised information what so ever as to who or the circumstances of the successful hacks. We have the DNC word. What we do know is hacks of this nature are common by many differnt parties and attempts were to both parties. Not Proof.

These emails were not immediately released

For publicity reasons. See wikileaks themselves. Who have emphatically insistent these were leaks not from Russian sources.

Wikileaks has a strong record and no one questions the authenticity of the leaks. The intellignece community, who by nature is dimetrically opposed to Wikileaks whisleblower mission claims russian frount with no proof or case. The one case cited [no well] doesn't even releate to wikileaks release themselves but another around the same time. Not Proof.

Trump and his campaign, at the time, believed these emails were a big deal and cited them frequently.

And negative trump media wasn't used against him or forming of the Hillary campaign? Not Proof.

he also explicitly called on the Russian government to hack and release Hillary Clinton’s emails.

She had an unsecured personal server and there were missing emails deleted to avoid investigation. Not Proof.

Trump also spent the 2016 campaign running an overtly pro-Russian campaign message, praising Vladimir Putin’s leadership, defending him from allegations of murdering his political opponents, and calling for a realignment of US strategy in Syria and Ukraine.

Neither Trump nor Hillary ran a pro-Rusisan campaign. Literaly last cycle Hillary herself would be in the opposite camp to what you are saying.Not proof.

 

[Conaeolos]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

The only trap in allowing Swampy to testify is that he’s incapable of telling the truth, and Rudy knows it.

You got to love people not in favour of a fair defence. Real believers in justice. What do they need that's not a possible via written response with a clear possibility of a perjury trap?

Trump isn't exactly famous for his precision of phrasing a very valued thing in law.

 

[tres borrachos]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

Fortunately, Trump had already jumped from the roof and was there to catch Rudy before he splattered.

Trump jumped into the arms of 3 of the 10,000 Muslims he saw cheering on 9/11?

 

[uptower]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

:doh Then why such a difficult time making the case outside the accusation?

I think it's rather subjective to call it a 'difficult time'. It's certainly a 'long' time, as was the watergate investigation, as is any other methodical investigation into organized crime.

And while it might be a 'difficult' sell the story so far to staunch supporters of the president (it was in Nixon's case as well), that does not mean the mountains of evidence collected so far have provided 'difficulties' for the special prosecutors, Trump's detractors or indeed anyone without a dog in the fight such as various international news outlets.

On the contrary it has been relatively 'easy', albeit time-consuming to flip the crooks Trump surrounds himself with, once they themselves have been caught with their hands in the cookie jar. Dominoes have been falling like flies lately and puzzle pieces fitting quite neatly into place: Don Jr's false testimony, Butina & the NRA, Cohen, Pecker, Flynn: to those of us who've always suspected Trump was crooked and were waiting for real answers, it feels like timely relief.

Though I stress the caveat that in a case this loaded with emotion, even a so-called 'smoking gun' might be open to subjective interpretation, and if the DOJ is unable to prosecute as some legal scholars posit, then it's up to congress to impeach. With a majority in the senate the president's party may choose not to do so, especially if they can find any gaps in the evidence big enough to wriggle through.

NB: I use quotation marks not to be facetious but because this part of my argument rests on what I see as the subjective nature of the word 'difficult'.

 

[Phys251]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

I can’t for the life of me understand why Trump is using him.

Because tRump is simply not a very intelligent human. Give him fealty, regardless of who you are, and he's like a toddler who's just been given away a treat. But once that treat's gone, he requires more treats, or he will suffer a meltdown.

 

[Gaugingcatenate]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

No, this is not like 2008 Trump has inspired true change against anyone remotely like him ever gaining power again. And it has exposed the spineless vapidness of the party that supports him. For that we are truly thankful. Merry Christmas.

Thats EXACTLY what slenderman did for us in 8 years.

Holding much [our side], far more than merely most of the government power now, ten years later, maybe your side will learn from its prior mistakes following the false messiah...

Nah, y'all are quadrupling down, going full monty socialist and/or anarchists with your blackshirts/hoods in the streets already. Can't get er done in the ballot box, now we've fixed it so you can't do it in the courts so you have little choice but to take it violent and so to those streets.

You have made the fatal mistake, prodded the sleeping giant, we are awake, onto you now.

Yes, Happy New Year ahead, knock on wood.

 

[iguanaman]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

Thats EXACTLY what slenderman did for us in 8 years.

Holding much [our side], far more than merely most of the government power now, ten years later, maybe your side will learn from its prior mistakes following the false messiah...

Nah, y'all are quadrupling down, going full monty socialist and/or anarchists with your blackshirts/hoods in the streets already. Can't get er done in the ballot box, now we've fixed it so you can't do it in the courts so you have little choice but to take it violent and so to those streets.

You have made the fatal mistake, prodded the sleeping giant, we are awake, onto you now.

Yes, Happy New Year ahead, knock on wood.

Your mistake was voting in a President that made Obama look even better. You might as well go back to sleep, there will be no more wins for you.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

https://www.foxnews.com/transcript/rudy-giuliani-on-michael-cohens-prison-term-flynn-memos

This guy is unbelievable. Chris Wallace is completely befuddled as Giuliani tries to dance around his questions.



Giuliani says Trump didn't know about the payments, as Trump clearly stated on AF1. And Giuliani also says Trump told Cohen to pay the reimbursement "by check." So Trump doesn't know about the payments, AND he is OK with the reimbursements. Of course, Cohen knows if there is a check, there is a paper trail. Trump is so informed, and he is also OK with cash payments.

So, according to Giuliani, the truth is "Yes and No."

Even Trump must be shaking his head after that interview.

You have missed the whole point of Mr. Giuliani's position.

Mr. Trump did nothing wrong because he never authorized anyone to give any money to anyone - all Mr. Trump did was to authorize the writing of a cheque and if some bank gave someone money for that cheque - well, that wasn't any of Mr. Trump's doing was it?

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

I can’t for the life of me understand why Trump is using him.

Quick, instinctive, reaction answer - "Because Mr. Trump wants to establish that he was "only acting on counsel's advice" and the fact that his lawyer gave him bad/improper/illegal advice simply isn't his fault.".

More profound answer - "Because, wekk, Duhh!".

 

[Gaugingcatenate]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

Your mistake was voting in a President that made Obama look even better. You might as well go back to sleep, there will be no more wins for you.

Slenderfella's big government overstep foot didn't near fit the long lost shoe of American leadership.

Your overweening confidence in a broken party with its failed agenda served by its busted, exposed media arm, its hollowed out Hollywood with its own long-lost never truly existing charm, the left's now uncovered radical and overpriced academia... is vapidly misplaced.

It's a supremely failed party, nobody but the lost and/or rabid still remain.


Sorry, we are fully awakened as a nation to your side's subversions. The unluckily yet duly elected night mayor/nightmare, Mayor slenderfella, came true and was real, but we are all awake now and can take the steps necessary to avoid you folks in the future.

You can turn off the lights there now, we are in process of fighting the leftist boogiemen. We are booging down right now. :lamoeace:2wave:

 

[Tanngrisnir]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

Slenderfella's big government overstep foot didn't near fit the long lost shoe of American leadership.

Your overweening confidence in a broken party with its failed agenda served by its busted, exposed media arm, its hollowed out Hollywood with its own long-lost never truly existing charm, the left's now uncovered radical and overpriced academia... is vapidly misplaced.

It's a supremely failed party, nobody but the lost and/or rabid still remain.


Sorry, we are fully awakened as a nation to your side's subversions. The unluckily yet duly elected night mayor/nightmare, Mayor slenderfella, came true and was real, but we are all awake now and can take the steps necessary to avoid you folks in the future.

You can turn off the lights there now, we are in process of fighting the leftist boogiemen. We are booging down right now. :lamoeace:2wave:

LOL! The last midterm elections called for you. Declined to leave any message. Didn't want to trigger you.

 

[Athanasius68]

There is plenty of evidence that the Trump campaign conspired with Russia to affect the outcome of the election. There has been for a while, which is what sparked the investigation to begin with.

The only 'question' remaining is whether it was directed by Trump himself or all just a happy accident, as his surrogates claim. That's worth continuing the investigation until they get some answers. Many legal experts think Mueller already has those answers and is putting together a case thorough enough to send back to the DOJ.

Mueller has charged nobody with even meeting with Russians (PapaD, Flynn) never mind charging with any sort of collusion.
There is no there there.

 

[Conaeolos]

I think it's rather subjective to call it a 'difficult time'. It's certainly a 'long' time, as was the watergate investigation, as is any other methodical investigation into organized crime.

I meant as to those in public arguing the point. No public person has made a credible case. Muller could have access to classified information which changes that equation. His investigation started based on a claim by US intelligence of a credible threat of Russian interference for Trump. Sessions being honest unlike Holder, was wise to appoint him [considering his knowledge at the time].

The problems emerged lately as it becomes more and more evident muller is off that mandate[plea deals nothing to do with Russian - even one of the Russians[no one expect to do anying] just pled back not guilty]; in many cases it is worse as the pleas/crimes are caused by the investigation itself]. This biggest problem yet though is that the original charge that started it all was based on DNC oppo weaponize via politicalize actors[strzok, brennon…]. Not Good.

And while it might be a 'difficult' sell the story so far to staunch supporters of the president (it was in Nixon's case as well), that does not mean the mountains of evidence collected so far have provided 'difficulties' for the special prosecutors

If 'watergate' style corruption concerns you. You're focusing on the wrong investigation[muller: Russian interference].

During the campaign there was spying being done on trump campaign under the mandate of anti-terrorism. This info very likely was fed to Hillary campaign.And the NSA | FISA requests are not just showing FBI / intelligence actors but security contractors. Not Good.

flip the crooks Trump surrounds himself with

Really?!? Not from my perspective, I see selective prosecution and more Trump being surprisingly ethical is not paying their legal defences which mean all these people are having a very tough time getting a good defence.

Cohen, who might be doing best on that frount is using a Clinton connected Lawyer. I don't blame him, it's a great firm, but what we are seeing is most certianly not following the pattern of a mob like organization people make it out to be.

Though I stress the caveat that in a case this loaded with emotion, even a so-called 'smoking gun' might be open to subjective interpretation, and if the DOJ is unable to prosecute as some legal scholars posit, then it's up to congress to impeach. With a majority in the senate the president's party may choose not to do so, especially if they can find any gaps in the evidence big enough to wriggle through.

NB: I use quotation marks not to be facetious but because this part of my argument rests on what I see as the subjective nature of the word 'difficult'.

I fully acknowledge that if it is true the persecution should take time to make the strongest case possible. I have no problem with justice.

The other possibility however is this is a weaponization of judicial privilege for political purposes. Let say day 1 the chance were 80/20 Muller would find something even if not beyond damning. Today based on leaks and pleas: it's 99/1 its political and the burden to connect Russia essential to having even an ounce of credibility.

 

[Mr Person]

Re: Giuliani, the worst spokesman/lawyer Trump could find.

Giuliani insists he wouldn't let Trump have an interview with Mueller.

Can any great legal minds tells us - or even not so great, it doesn't matter much - why if Trump is innocent he shouldn't relish the possibility of an interview with the authorities to clear his name.

I've never known a suspect to do themselves a favor by talking to the police.

They're allowed to lie, trick, and cheat. Any statement that can be twisted will be twisted. It's also entirely possible that the recording equipment will later be found to have "malfunctioned", and suddenly the police are testifying to a version of the interview that is not at all how the suspect remembers it (read between the lines).

Now, I think that's a lot less likely with Trump & Mueller than with a run of the mill suspect and an ordinary cop. But still... you pretty much never do yourself a favor talking to the police.