Right-Wing "Patriots"

[disneydude]

I am sooooo tired of the right-wing hypocrites that claim to be "patriotic" and "supportive of the troops".

True....they are supportive and quick to send off others to shed their blood fighting their presidents war, but probably not so quick to do it themselves.

There was a time in this country when the saying went:
"Give me liberty or give me death"

Now the right-wingers saying seems to be "Take my liberty, just don't kill me!".

I fail to understand how you can claim to be supportive of the troops when you support efforts by the administration to take away freedoms and liberties.

People who support this administration's ill guided "patriot" act, domestic spying, activist court officer's seeking to take away reproductive freedoms, putting less liberty in the hands of the people and more in the hands of the government, supporting big business at the expense of the workers, etc etc etc, spit on the grave of the many who died fighting for our freedom and is a slap in the face to our military today.

During this month of July in recognition of our Independence and Freedom I think its important that we recognize what a great country this has been, but also what the right-wing and the current administration is trying to do to this country.

Patriotism is not a concept in name only. It doesn't mean passing laws to protect a piece of fabric. It means standing up and supporting the principles and the freedoms that this country is built on, not cowardly feigning your "support" for the troops while gladly handing over your liberty.

 

[jennyb]

ayyyyymen! :mrgreen:

 

[Billo_Really]

"Right-wing Patriot" is an oxy-moron!

 

[jennyb]

Billo your site? the site you sited is extremely anti-semetic. that site doesnt like anyone who is it for?

 

[Geekybrunette]

You aren't a patriot unless you do everything possible to stop the terrorists and the war on terror (which has no true objective). This includes stripping America of everything it was supposed to be founded on.

The 4th amendment prohibits against illegal search and seizure, but if you've got nothing to hide, why worry? We might catch some terrorists!

 

[jennyb]

geeky WOW did you really write that??? you should go live in north korea...man, you are wild girl!!!! and i dont mean in a good way. im saying people like you we dont need in this country.....no rights??? your kidding... right?

 

[Geekybrunette]

geeky WOW did you really write that??? you should go live in north korea...man, you are wild girl!!!! and i dont mean in a good way. im saying people like you we dont need in this country.....no rights??? your kidding... right?

Sarcasm :rofl:

 

[jennyb]

ohhhhhhhh...okay wow...you had me there....

 

[mpg]

"I am sooooo tired of the right-wing hypocrites that claim to be "patriotic" and "supportive of the troops".

True....they are supportive and quick to send off others to shed their blood fighting their presidents war, but probably not so quick to do it themselves.

There was a time in this country when the saying went:
"Give me liberty or give me death"

Now the right-wingers saying seems to be "Take my liberty, just don't kill me!"."

Are you joking? I don't know the exact #s, but conservatives are obviously far more willing to sacrifice their lives in the defense of freedom than liberals are. Do you think that the military is a bunch of liberals? Liberals "loathe" the military.

W is far from being a libertarian, but he's a lot closer than his opponents give him credit for. The monitoring of bank transactions is legal. Some of the other things he's been doing aren't new, and while many people say that the Patriot Act took away our rights, they never said which rights we lost.

 

[mpg]

Sarcasm :rofl:

It was obvious.

 

[Geekybrunette]

Now the right-wingers saying seems to be "Take my liberty, just don't kill me!"."

Are you joking? I don't know the exact #s, but conservatives are obviously far more willing to sacrifice their lives in the defense of freedom than liberals are. Do you think that the military is a bunch of liberals? Liberals "loathe" the military.

Maybe because those liberals view the military as fighting for a cause they consider unjust. If the military fought towards far more liberal ideals, would there be more conservatives or more liberals willing to fight?

The military by definition is a conservative institution. "Don't ask don't tell" policy, there are jobs that women are not allowed to engage in (even if she's a six foot tall amazon just as strong and tough as the guys), and conformity is the order of the day.

I support what the troops do. Essentially, they are just following orders. I just don't agree with those giving the orders.

 

[Spartacus FPV]

Maybe because those liberals view the military as fighting for a cause they consider unjust. If the military fought towards far more liberal ideals, would there be more conservatives or more liberals willing to fight?

You cant fight for pacifism, and a war based on health care seems counter productive. Liberals arent a war-like people. They make America look human when we're war mongering.

But we also need the war-like conservatives when its time to put up or shut up. Sometimes we cant be seen as soft. Sometimes we have to be seen as soft even when we have a gun at your head. Libs and cons are yins and yangs.

Each side may consider the other un-patriotic or foolish, but when both sides agree on something the American patriots can be a mighty force.

 

[Billo_Really]

Originally posted by jennyb
Billo your site? the site you sited is extremely anti-semetic. that site doesnt like anyone who is it for?

And which site are you claiming is "my site?" Furthermore, I could careless what is semetic or anti-semetic. It's not my dance. I'm not going to condemn Israel as a nation, nor am I going to defend them either. They are just as guilty as any terrorist when you look at some of their acts of aggression. Just because they suffered atrocities in WWII does not give them a blank check to do the same to other cultures.

What they had to endure in WWII must never be repeated. But their not helping the situation by the way they are treating the Palestinians. And the Palestinians need to realize the best thing they can do to improve relations with Israel, is to shut down on terrorists within their borders.

Here's a thought:

Maybe Israeli citizens and Palestinian citizens ought to inter-mingle, marry each other, and start a new race of people that is a combination of both cultures. We could call them............. "Muslews!"

 

[Joby]

uhhhhh...

Ok libs, why don't you start the revolution? Claim it's for freedom?

You'll never have the balls to do this, so don't criticize the other side for supporting the troops but not even willing to go over there. Please. Conservative areas, especially Texas, give the backbone of military recruits year in and year out. If you don't believe me, look up the numbers yourself.

Americans have decided what's the greater threat. Terrorists who would Blow up Tunnels if not for government anti-terror programs

 

[jennyb]

to say there are no liberals fighting in iraq is just rediculous...just the sheer numbers of men and women in the armed services makes the odds better than not that there ARE of course liberals in the army....

israel does not do what it does because of world war two.... they do what they do to stop the continuous lobbing of rockets coming into the country. also for the kiddnapping of an idf officer...these are reasons to fight.
you dont think canada would do nothing if we consistantly flew rockets into their territory??? c'mon:roll:
what do you want the israelis to do nothing the way they sat while scuds reigned down in the first gulf war because bush asked them not to respond and so they did not.....how many countries would stand for that.

 

[Stinger]

I am sooooo tired of the right-wing hypocrites that claim to be "patriotic" and "supportive of the troops".

True....they are supportive and quick to send off others to shed their blood fighting their presidents war, but probably not so quick to do it themselves.

So let;s just let the military, those who have to do the fighting, decide? And since the overwhemling majority of the military support what we are doing they in fact seem pretty quick to "do it".

There was a time in this country when the saying went:
"Give me liberty or give me death"

Now the right-wingers saying seems to be "Take my liberty, just don't kill me!".

What liberty has been taken away from you?

I fail to understand how you can claim to be supportive of the troops when you support efforts by the administration to take away freedoms and liberties.

What freedom and liberty has been personally taken away from you. How has your life been effected by this loss of liberty?

to take away reproductive freedoms,

What on earth does that have to do with your topic and who is preventing you from reproducing?

putting less liberty in the hands of the people and more in the hands of the government,

What liberty has been transferred from the people to the government?

During this month of July in recognition of our Independence and Freedom I think its important that we recognize what a great country this has been, but also what the right-wing and the current administration is trying to do to this country.

Yes, keep it great, keep it free and ensure your liberty which it radical Isamist want to take from you.

Patriotism is not a concept in name only. It doesn't mean passing laws to protect a piece of fabric. It means standing up and supporting the principles and the freedoms that this country is built on, not cowardly feigning your "support" for the troops while gladly handing over your liberty.

Yes it means once we decide to go to war you support our efforts until our enemy is defeated or surrenders.

 

[Ivan The Terrible]

This thread is silly.

 

[Sir_Alec]

I don't care if people join the military to be a patriot. I just get pissed off when people who could join the military and support the war 100% act like it's impossible to fight for their cause, as opposed to letting some poor kid who joined the army to support his family do it. Take a look at Flint, Michigan about 30 miles from my house. The highest reason for recruitment there is to make money and this is because the town is sooooo freakinnnnnn poooorrrrrrr after the car plants shut down and the factory owners took work elsewhere.

If everyone out there who supported the war as passionatly as some of you guys do they should all join the military if they can, and get these guys who don't want to sacrafice themselves for a cause they don't support out. Don't give me that crap about not fighting. If you support the war and you can fight you have no excuse for not going over and serving with the people you say you're willing to let die.

The only way you could get me to join the service is if it was 1942 (ETO please). And if you can set back time for me could you also take away this damn thyroid problem which prevents my ability to do a lot of things in the military?

 

[jennyb]

ewwww alec, excellent come back......:mrgreen: i agree....
if anyone is that passionate about the war they absolutely should be there... there are guys and gals who also go military for education money ... stinger..."once we decide to go to war, YOU support our effort until win or surrender"""" wow , gad you arent the head of this country,, and also glad you werent ny dad......scary stuff. is there an 'or else' at the end of that statement? sounds like there is. and if so, what is the or else?

 

[Stinger]

ewwww alec, excellent come back......:mrgreen: i agree....
if anyone is that passionate about the war they absolutely should be there... there are guys and gals who also go military for education money ... stinger..."once we decide to go to war, YOU support our effort until win or surrender"""" wow , gad you arent the head of this country,, and also glad you werent ny dad......scary stuff. is there an 'or else' at the end of that statement? sounds like there is. and if so, what is the or else?

Did you support Clinton's venture into Kosovo? Did you volunteer to go? And yes supporting your country means supporting your country once it has decided to go to war and doing whatever you can, even if only a small thing, to help us in that task, that is called supporting the troops. Of course if we can arraign to have the terrorist kill those who do not support the war instead of those who do would that be OK with you? I mean if you aren't going to fight them then why should you be protected?

 

[Gardener]

I would say that a person is patriotic if A) -- they support the ideals upon which this country was built, and B) -- wish to ensure we live up to such ideals.

Seems to me that there are folks of various stripes who fail to meet these standards, as many on the far right come up short when it comes to the second assumption and many on the far left the first. When those on the far right indulge in rhetorec where America is always right no matter what we do, they do not qualify as patriots in my book and when the far left indulges in rhetorec where we are wrong no matter what we do, likewise. When those on the far right white wash the Prison abuse scandals, they fail to stand up for American values, and when those on the left act as apologists for Islamism, they are equally guilty.

Fortunately, here are still a great many people in the middle who neither march in lock step with this current administration nor dig in their heels and act as knee jerk reactionaries against it. Seems these numbers are diminishing due to the polarizing effects of this "you're either with us or against us" sort of Manichean world view, but I still hold out hope that people can get beyond the reactionary polemics and start evaluating the world according to consistant sets of values -- values that begin from the framework that we supoprt the ideals upon which this country was built and seek to ensure we are living up to them. There is a great deal of political territory between the Gospel of Hannity and the Gospel of Counterpunch, and if people would start thinking a little more and start reacting a little less, perhaps they might see that. Dogmatism is at odds with patriotism since dogmatism requires a closed mind and patriotism an open.

There -- that should piss off just about everybody who likes to play the "hooray for my side, boo hiss on yours" game.

 

[Stinger]

I don't care if people join the military to be a patriot. I just get pissed off when people who could join the military and support the war 100% act like it's impossible to fight for their cause, as opposed to letting some poor kid who joined the army to support his family do it.

How about those who could support their familty but still decide to protect you and the country from those who would kill you?

Take a look at Flint, Michigan about 30 miles from my house. The highest reason for recruitment there is to make money and this is because the town is sooooo freakinnnnnn poooorrrrrrr after the car plants shut down and the factory owners took work elsewhere.

They can move just as easily as join the military.

If everyone out there who supported the war as passionatly as some of you guys do they should all join the military if they can, and get these guys who don't want to sacrafice themselves for a cause they don't support out.

And everyone who doesn't should voluteer to become hostages and victems of those who want to kill us. When do you leave?

Don't give me that crap about not fighting. If you support the war and you can fight you have no excuse for not going over and serving with the people you say you're willing to let die.

And if you can't?

So again let's just let the mil9itary decide when and where we fight, using your logic.

 

[Sir_Alec]

How about those who could support their familty but still decide to protect you and the country from those who would kill you?

That's fine by me.

They can move just as easily as join the military.

Wow, that is the most uninformed sentence I've ever read. Do you think a person who can barely feed his family can just pack up all his belongings and buy a brand new house?

And everyone who doesn't should voluteer to become hostages and victems of those who want to kill us. When do you leave?

You sick bastard. You are really starting to show a darker side here and it's very unpleasant.

So again let's just let the mil9itary decide when and where we fight, using your logic.

The main reason I would never join the military is because of our leadership. I'm not the one who is choosing which conflicts to go into. That's the governments job. THe main reason I don't join up is because I don't support this conflict 100%. Maybe I would if we showed a little more compassion for the people living there by maybe developing an exit plan before going into a war! Also, it's hard to understand the clear motive of our goverment on the war. If were so just in spreading democracy why have we continually screwed over countless nations in the past 200 years?

 

[jamesrage]

I am sooooo tired of the right-wing hypocrites that claim to be "patriotic" and "supportive of the troops".

True....they are supportive and quick to send off others to shed their blood fighting their presidents war, but probably not so quick to do it themselves.

There was a time in this country when the saying went:
"Give me liberty or give me death"

Now the right-wingers saying seems to be "Take my liberty, just don't kill me!".

I fail to understand how you can claim to be supportive of the troops when you support efforts by the administration to take away freedoms and liberties.

People who support this administration's ill guided "patriot" act, domestic spying, activist court officer's seeking to take away reproductive freedoms, putting less liberty in the hands of the people and more in the hands of the government, supporting big business at the expense of the workers, etc etc etc, spit on the grave of the many who died fighting for our freedom and is a slap in the face to our military today.

During this month of July in recognition of our Independence and Freedom I think its important that we recognize what a great country this has been, but also what the right-wing and the current administration is trying to do to this country.

Patriotism is not a concept in name only. It doesn't mean passing laws to protect a piece of fabric. It means standing up and supporting the principles and the freedoms that this country is built on, not cowardly feigning your "support" for the troops while gladly handing over your liberty.

What freedoms have you lost?Are you a drug dealer,terrorist or child molester?I know the goverment has made it harder for them,but what freedoms that you enjoy on a regular basis that have you yourself have lost?

What are your thoughts on this subject?
http://www.debatepolitics.com/polls/7362-what-extent-you-support-1st-2nd-amendment.html

 

[Calm2Chaos]

You cant fight for pacifism, and a war based on health care seems counter productive. Liberals arent a war-like people. They make America look human when we're war mongering.

But we also need the war-like conservatives when its time to put up or shut up. Sometimes we cant be seen as soft. Sometimes we have to be seen as soft even when we have a gun at your head. Libs and cons are yins and yangs.

Each side may consider the other un-patriotic or foolish, but when both sides agree on something the American patriots can be a mighty force.

That may have been true in the past..(WWI - WWII). BUt now you have a large group of professional protesters that will agree with nothing and are willing to fight for nothing. Sacrafice is fine if someone else is doing it. And while they are it's there "patriotic Duty" to complain as much as possible about the manner in which it is done.

Years ago there were different sides to the coin. The difference was they also had 1 common thread they could always grasp on to together.......this country. I think that 1 common thread is a little freyed anymore to really cling to. So it's a power thing. Whomever is in power makes the decsions and whomever isn't falls back into a critisize mode and pisses on everything thats done until they get a chance to grab the power back