Peaceful Occupy protests degenerate into chaos

[Mycroft]

I agree with the majority of what you say. I disagree with the idea they wouldn't of worked. Violence typically begets violence and treating a group of people like a random violent mob generally causes tension. I think it would of made a huge difference if the mayor treated them with respect, told them the ground rules and worked with them instead of against them. I think a lot of people can self police themsleves (point out to police and call out inappropiate behavior). In fact they tend to. I think it's less likely that would happen if the police already are treating them as a mob.

Ummm...

I hate to burst your bubble, but they ARE a mob.

Mob - Definition and More from the Free Merriam-Webster Dictionary

 

[Aunt Spiker]

OWS is beginning to remind me of Fight Club

It's getting exciting now, two and one-half. Think of everything we've accomplished, man. Out these windows, we will view the collapse of financial history. One step closer to economic equilibrium.

God damn it, an entire generation pumping gas, waiting tables; slaves with white collars. Advertising has us chasing cars and clothes, working jobs we hate so we can buy **** we don't need. We're the middle children of history, man. No purpose or place. We have no Great War. No Great Depression. Our Great War's a spiritual war... our Great Depression is our lives. We've all been raised on television to believe that one day we'd all be millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars. But we won't. And we're slowly learning that fact. And we're very, very pissed off.

 

[nota bene]

I think that maybe this is a spiritual war, one for the soul of our country (and other countries' too).

Whose personal choice is this? "Advertising has us chasing cars and clothes, working jobs we hate so we can buy **** we don't need." Waaaa.

"We've all been raised on television to believe that one day we'd all be millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars. But we won't. And we're slowly learning that fact. And we're very, very pissed off." Waaaa. Grow up.

 

[poweRob]

Really right wing? You are this desperate to protect wall street? This is an actual email being spammed to Tea Party folk who've signed up with tea party nation.

OWS RAPE CAMPS! End the Occupation! "Read them the Riot Act" and shut them down!

Rape camps? Glenn Beck said this would happen over a year ago?


The smell of desperation stinks on you guys something fierce.

 

[Cephus]

The government may learn who's really in charge. Perhaps the tree of liberty will be refreshed.

By vandalism?

 

[conservativeguy]

Really right wing? You are this desperate to protect wall street? This is an actual email being spammed to Tea Party folk who've signed up with tea party nation.

OWS RAPE CAMPS! End the Occupation! "Read them the Riot Act" and shut them down!

Rape camps? Glenn Beck said this would happen over a year ago?


The smell of desperation stinks on you guys something fierce.

I hate to break this to you but Tea Party Nation speaks for itself, not the tens of millions that share Tea Party principles which call for fiscal sanity, smaller government and individual liberty.

 

[Cephus]

I think that maybe this is a spiritual war, one for the soul of our country (and other countries' too).

Whose personal choice is this? "Advertising has us chasing cars and clothes, working jobs we hate so we can buy **** we don't need." Waaaa.

"We've all been raised on television to believe that one day we'd all be millionaires, and movie gods, and rock stars. But we won't. And we're slowly learning that fact. And we're very, very pissed off." Waaaa. Grow up.

Yeah, I see it as a bunch of weak-minded sheep doing whatever someone tells them to do, then whining about how unfair it is that they can't think for themselves. :roll:

 

[What if...?]

It's not a "moment" of weakness. The Banksters broke capitalism, and we need to replace it with something better, that works for everyone. Capitalism in its current form privatises gain and socialises loss.

Careful now. Cognitive dissonance can be painful.

You JUST described "crony capitalism", which is a tea party right meme.

It is NOT FAIR to point out common ground between the right and left.

Its election season, and there's as many as two Supreme Court seats riding on this. Locking up the SC is THE most important thing in the world to the right. Its the only way they'll ever get their conservative paradise. Where the tyranny of the majority will be codified in law forever.

The future of the nation rides on the next election. Stop trying to confuse people with your common ground nonsense, they've got an election to win.

 

[What if...?]

that whole shutting down the port, etc.

There was actually a general strike in Oakland in 1946 that began in response to the police acting on the behalf of businesses involved in a strike situation. They cleared the streets of protesters and actually brought in the "scabs".

The entire city shut down in solidarity with the strikers.

We Called it a Work Holiday: The 1946 Oakland General Strike -- Exhibitions -- Oakland Museum of California

Lasted two days.

Wasn't violent though, and that's where they are ****ing up.

For instance, Mens Warehouse closed its doors in support of the strike, but was one of the businesses that was vandalized.

Anecdotally, I spent some time around "protest anarchists" and while they readily admjtted to acts of vandalism, none of them knew the punks who started the vandalism at WTO in Seattle. They were butting heads and throwing **** at the cops, but denied the vandalism that followed. Their opinion was that it was locals or idiots who came just to **** **** up.

 

[What if...?]

This is why the Mayor SHOULD have tried to set up a conference or "discussion" or what have you with the group and let it be known that they need to keep it clean, allow police in to investigate reports of criminal activity, make sure the cooking and fires and such are in accordance with safety, and ensure that the public health of the community is being taken into effect.

That would be a much better way to handle it then to just let them stagnate, or kick them out and then decide to let them back in when she is viewed unfavorably.

This is one of the things I'm having a hard time figuring out. I've done LE liason work for the Rainbow Family at their annual Gatherings.

OWS has a huge Rainbow presence, its being run almost exactly like a Gathering is. They normally go out of their way to work WITH LE to ameliorate negative **** at their events. Its pure PR, as the Feds HATE them for doing as they please, and the ONLY way theyve been able to avoid being shut down is self policing.

So I'm not sure if they are being overwhelmed by numbers or what. The amount of provocateur activity being seen is distressing, as well as the onslaught of questionable or outright dishonest reporting I'm seeing.

 

[What if...?]

Not necessarily.

A leader (mayor) can talk to a leaderless group (the mass of OccuOakland) and ensure that these demands be met. Going to the group as a whole and letting them know what the city's problems are, and what they need to address in order to remain can work without them having a direct leader (mayor) to leader (elected protest group representative) discussion.

And, even if it didn't work (which I doubt it would have) at least she has shown compassion for their cause prior to showing the strength to get rid of them, and not let them back.

In my experience it WOULD be helpful, as it provides "leverage" for those who are trying to keep things peaceful over troublemakers.

"They said do this, this and this and we're cool. So knock that other **** off. You're ****ing it all up with your bull****."

It would actually be empowering for those trying to do it the "right" way.

 

[What if...?]

I hate to break this to you but Tea Party Nation speaks for itself, not the tens of millions that share Tea Party principles which call for fiscal sanity, smaller government and individual liberty.

That's fine and correct.

Just don't let me catch you painting OWS with a brush dipped in the can of some fringe left group or this post will come back to haunt you.

 

[Aunt Spiker]

That's fine and correct.

Just don't let me catch you painting OWS with a brush dipped in the can of some fringe left group or this post will come back to haunt you.

His posts have hardly been blackmail material :shrug:

 

[conservativeguy]

That's fine and correct.

Just don't let me catch you painting OWS with a brush dipped in the can of some fringe left group or this post will come back to haunt you.

Fair enough. I will admit I have done the same to rattle the opposition that does the same thing to the TP movement. Now that you have my number I better watch my back.

 

[What if...?]

Fair enough. I will admit I have done the same to rattle the opposition that does the same thing to the TP movement. Now that you have my number I better watch my back.

Its all good!:2razz: