Parental notification

[FISHX]

If you think that kids are just kids that make kid choices, I have to ask my original question again; Do you think that a kid should have to get her parents permission before she is allowed to carry a pregnancy to term? Do you think that her parents should get to decide weather or not she keeps her new born baby?
Because I don't think that you can have it both ways. You can't say; "Kids just aren't mature enough to choose an abortion but they are mature enough to choose to carry the baby to term." If you say that then it just seems like you don't want the 'kid' to choose abortion. Which may be true and that's fine, but you don't get to make that choice.

No one is going on about permission we are talking notification not consent

 

[goligoth]

It seems to me that there are 2 arguments:

On the medical level yes, parents should be told if nothing else. The kid isn't going to tell anyone if she is sick, she didn't tell her parents in the first place because she didn't want to get in trouble. The parents have the right to at least be kept in the loop even if they have no say in the operation.

The teenager is still a child and I think should have a parent to sign for it just like anything else but then you enfringe on her right to choose:lol: That's funny.

 

[jfuh]

This parental notification is just another step of chipping away at the constitutional right of women to obtain an abortion. This is a right, not a privlage. If minors at 16 are allowed the privalage of driving, why then are they not getting thier constitutional right to an abortion.
Some of you have stated that minors do not make healthy decisions. Obviously they did not make a healthy decision when they opted out of birth control or absence. But come on, realistically, we've all been through teenage years and the sudden phisological horomonal changes occuring in our bodies is very difficult to contain especially when society shuns any mention of sex in a healthy and open methodology.

I don't understand why there are so many people trying to limit the access of women to thier constitutional right of abortion (Alito). I think everyone should see this documentary on Frontline

Parental notification, sure, but the child herself, not by the physician who should always respect doctor patient confidentiality.

 

[Stace]

I would have to say that I am for parental notification. There isn't much a minor can do these days without it, anyway...and abortion is a major medical procedure. If I had a pregnant 16 year old daughter that wanted an abortion, I would want to know about it. Too many parents these days are relegating the responsibilities of parenting onto others too often as it is...if more parents were more actively involved in their children's lives, teen abortions might not be necessary....but as things stand, they are sadly all too common, and requiring parental notification just might be a huge eye opener.

 

[Navy Pride]

Isn't it ironic that a child has to get permission for a tatoo or a body piercing but in most states do not need permission to have and abortion?

 

[jfuh]

Isn't it ironic that a child has to get permission for a tatoo or a body piercing but in most states do not need permission to have and abortion?

Not really, considering that abortion is a gaurenteed constitutional right to women, I don't see why it is that any girl that wants an abortion should be required to obtain permission from her parents.
Should the girls be required to ask permission from their parents to have sex? What would be the consequence if they do not?

 

[FISHX]

Isn't it ironic that a child has to get permission for a tatoo or a body piercing but in most states do not need permission to have and abortion?

Couldn,t agree more i mean when all said and done there is still the risk of sceptacimia and every parent has the right to look out for their children to the best of their ability.

Without parent NOTIFICATION the most common cold symptoms could be deadly The symptoms of sceptacimia are very consistant with the common cold although deadly.

If a parent knows nothing of the termination how can they monitor/protect their child ?
How will they know that it may not be a common cold?
How will they know that their childs life is in danger without treatment?

Come on in all honesty how many parents on this board would assume that the shivery achy feeling and high temp was a cold and put them to bed with a paracetamol I mean without NOTIFICATION how are parents supposed to know that their child has had a termination?

How many parents will it take finding their child dead of sceptacimia before pro choicers will see that NOTIFICATION is a step forward for both sides?

 

[FISHX]

Not really, considering that abortion is a gaurenteed constitutional right to women, I don't see why it is that any girl that wants an abortion should be required to obtain permission from her parents.
Should the girls be required to ask permission from their parents to have sex? What would be the consequence if they do not?

Not permission NOTIFICATION.

 

[Stace]

Not really, considering that abortion is a gaurenteed constitutional right to women, I don't see why it is that any girl that wants an abortion should be required to obtain permission from her parents.
Should the girls be required to ask permission from their parents to have sex? What would be the consequence if they do not?

As someone already stated, it's not about permission, it's about notification.

My husband and I were discussing this yesterday. We agree that while we won't be able to stop our children from having sex if that's what they want to do (short of locking them up until they're 20 :2razz: ), we would prefer that they be open and honest with us about it, so that we can let them know what sorts of options are out there...condoms, the Pill, etc. If they're going to have sex, they should be mature and responsible about it.

How many parents will it take finding their child dead of sceptacimia before pro choicers will see that NOTIFICATION is a step forward for both sides?

I agree. I'm all about women having the right to choose whether or not to have an abortion, as long as they're not using it as a means of birth control. There are enough unwanted children in the world as it is....but honestly, if you have one abortion, that should make you stop and think, and you should equip yourself to not be in that situation again.

Anyway, if my daughter was thinking of having an abortion, I'd at least want to know. And not just so I could watch for signs of infections or serious complications....but to also be able to help her deal with the mental and emotional retributions she might face. No one should have to go through something like that alone.

 

[steen]

As someone already stated, it's not about permission, it's about notification.

My husband and I were discussing this yesterday. We agree that while we won't be able to stop our children from having sex if that's what they want to do (short of locking them up until they're 20 :2razz: ), we would prefer that they be open and honest with us about it, so that we can let them know what sorts of options are out there...condoms, the Pill, etc. If they're going to have sex, they should be mature and responsible about it.

tell me honestly what you would do if she "notified" you that she was going to have an abortion tomorrow?

I agree. I'm all about women having the right to choose whether or not to have an abortion, as long as they're not using it as a means of birth control.

Why is that really any of your business/ Why should you have a say in your life and impose your morals on her? Does she get to do the same to you? If she says that it is OK to eat as long as it is only vegan and no animal products, does she get to impose that on you, f.ex.? THAT is the kind of intrusion you are talking about here, the imposing of one person' values on another person against their will. THAT is what prolifers are supporting here.

Anyway, if my daughter was thinking of having an abortion, I'd at least want to know. And not just so I could watch for signs of infections or serious complications....but to also be able to help her deal with the mental and emotional retributions she might face. No one should have to go through something like that alone.

And to be able to stop her from getting the abortion, right? After all, if she is not 18, you essentially control her life. That is why the silly claim of "it is only notification" is crap. It is all about controling one's daughter.

 

[jfuh]

As someone already stated, it's not about permission, it's about notification.

My husband and I were discussing this yesterday. We agree that while we won't be able to stop our children from having sex if that's what they want to do (short of locking them up until they're 20 :2razz: ), we would prefer that they be open and honest with us about it, so that we can let them know what sorts of options are out there...condoms, the Pill, etc. If they're going to have sex, they should be mature and responsible about it.

Not all situations involve parents that are as open. In particular, what of the situations of incest or rape? Should the parents in that case be notified as well? It's just not a justifiable law in too many instances.
Let's face it, this law of parental notification is just another attempt by the religious fanatics to chip away at the fundamental right of women to get an abortion. It's just rediculous.

 

[FISHX]

Not all situations involve parents that are as open. In particular, what of the situations of incest or rape? Should the parents in that case be notified as well? It's just not a justifiable law in too many instances.
Let's face it, this law of parental notification is just another attempt by the religious fanatics to chip away at the fundamental right of women to get an abortion. It's just rediculous.

Not if the parents are notified after the termination but before discharge.

 

[jfuh]

Not if the parents are notified after the termination but before discharge.

I'm certain that you would see the complication in the case of incest in this case.
Look abortion is a constitutional right. For doctor patient confidentiality all constitutional rights are to be exactly that, confidential between the doctor and the patient. If I were a parent, of course I would want to know what's wrong with my daughter, and of course I would want to be notified. But if my daughter can not confide in her own parents about something such as this than that would be our failure as parents. It is still her right to get an abortion and keep it confidential.

 

[FISHX]

I'm certain that you would see the complication in the case of incest in this case.
Look abortion is a constitutional right. For doctor patient confidentiality all constitutional rights are to be exactly that, confidential between the doctor and the patient. If I were a parent, of course I would want to know what's wrong with my daughter, and of course I would want to be notified. But if my daughter can not confide in her own parents about something such as this than that would be our failure as parents. It is still her right to get an abortion and keep it confidential.

In the case of incest do you not think it would be better to notify the mother and social services i really cannot see a clinic/hospital sending a minor home to ve abused by her father and if they did then they should not be allowed to practise medicine of any sort.

The mother has a right and a duty to look after her child after any medical procedure or would you rather the minor died from complications that could be resolved had the parents known of the *simple procedure*?

I am not disputing that it may be a constitutinal right but it is the god given duty to protect a minor at all costs be it from possible complications from a medical procedure or from the peadophile father/brother/uncle/grandad or even family friend.

 

[Stace]

Not all situations involve parents that are as open. In particular, what of the situations of incest or rape? Should the parents in that case be notified as well? It's just not a justifiable law in too many instances.

In the case of incest or rape, I would most certainly want to know! I was a 16 year old girl not all that long ago....and I've seen friends struggle through similar situations. I myself was nearly raped when I was 14 (saved only by the timing of a good friend), and it still eats me up that I was never able to talk to my mom about it.

Parents these days need to be more involved so their children aren't put in these situations to begin with. They need to stop putting the responsibility of raising their child into the hands of others.

Let's face it, this law of parental notification is just another attempt by the religious fanatics to chip away at the fundamental right of women to get an abortion. It's just rediculous.

I'm certainly far from being a religious fanatic......I'm agnostic, actually. Notification and permission are two different things...besides, if my 16 year old daughter can't even see the doctor about a common cold without me knowing, why should she be able to get an abortion, which could have serious side effects and complications, without my knowledge?

 

[jfuh]

In the case of incest do you not think it would be better to notify the mother and social services i really cannot see a clinic/hospital sending a minor home to ve abused by her father and if they did then they should not be allowed to practise medicine of any sort.

If you've worked in a hospital in recent years you would know how unwilling the hospital would be in terms of going against common sense when it is questionable under the law. People sue of the most minor of technicalities. So yes I do think the hospital/clinic would have no choice but to send the child back. Especially these days when clinics for abortion are unwilling to draw any more light then neccesary.

The mother has a right and a duty to look after her child after any medical procedure or would you rather the minor died from complications that could be resolved had the parents known of the *simple procedure*?

It's not a matter of what I would rather. It's a matter of what the patients rights are. Then again, I don't see how parental notification would ever change the outcome of death that is destined by simple proceedure.

I am not disputing that it may be a constitutinal right but it is the god given duty to protect a minor at all costs be it from possible complications from a medical procedure or from the peadophile father/brother/uncle/grandad or even family friend.

I don't see how it is god's given duty to protect from medical proceedures. Especially in the case of seperation of church and state god has nothing to do with the rights of a woman seeking an abortion.

 

[Stace]

Oh, almost forgot....

tell me honestly what you would do if she "notified" you that she was going to have an abortion tomorrow?
Why is that really any of your business/ Why should you have a say in your life and impose your morals on her? Does she get to do the same to you? If she says that it is OK to eat as long as it is only vegan and no animal products, does she get to impose that on you, f.ex.? THAT is the kind of intrusion you are talking about here, the imposing of one person' values on another person against their will. THAT is what prolifers are supporting here.
And to be able to stop her from getting the abortion, right? After all, if she is not 18, you essentially control her life. That is why the silly claim of "it is only notification" is crap. It is all about controling one's daughter.

First of all, I'm sure I'd be getting a call from the clinic, not my daughter specifically. Secondly, I would support her, because that is HER choice to make. She's the one that has to live with the decision for the rest of her life, and I'd far rather her have an abortion that have a child and neglect it, or have the child and waste her own opportunities because she has to drop out of school to provide for it.

Why is it any of my business? Are you serious? That just proves my point even more.....parents are nowhere NEAR as involved with their children these days as they should be. Something that major, damn right I want to know about it if it concerns my child!! How else would I be able to help her deal with the mental and emotional consequences? You can't help your children if you don't know what's going on with them!

No, my child wouldn't have a say in what I do.....but as long as I'm the one that gave birth to them, and they're living under my roof, yes, my children will have to obey me. It's called I'm the adult, they're the minor....But what does that have to do with anything? Again, the issue is NOTIFICATION.....that does NOT give me the power to stop my daughter from having an abortion if that's what she wants, but it does give me the power to help her through it.

And as far as imposing my values on anyone? HELLO, we're talking about MY child here (well, if I had one, anyway). It would be my JOB to instill values in them.....and whether or not they agree with those values is up to them. I don't plan to force anything upon my children....they will be free to explore whatever sets of morals and values they choose...but it is my job to help them along the way.

 

[FISHX]

If you've worked in a hospital in recent years you would know how unwilling the hospital would be in terms of going against common sense when it is questionable under the law. People sue of the most minor of technicalities. So yes I do think the hospital/clinic would have no choice but to send the child back. Especially these days when clinics for abortion are unwilling to draw any more light then neccesary.

It's not a matter of what I would rather. It's a matter of what the patients rights are. Then again, I don't see how parental notification would ever change the outcome of death that is destined by simple proceedure.



I don't see how it is god's given duty to protect from medical proceedures. Especially in the case of seperation of church and state god has nothing to do with the rights of a woman seeking an abortion.

Did you actually read what i typed?

1, if a minor is in moral or physical danger then it is the duty of the doctors to notify social services.

2, Parental notification plays a part in the saftey of the minor whether you want it to or not if my child had a termination and i didn,t know and she suddenly became achy feverish and shivery i and many other parents would asume the common cold wake up next morning to find our child dead of scepticimia.

3, sorry that should have read the mothers god given duty to protect their child from sexual predetors you would deny the mother the right to protect and the child the right to be protected?

4 i said the right to protect from possible complications from a medical procedure not protect from medical procedures.

 

[steen]

I agree. I'm all about women having the right to choose whether or not to have an abortion, as long as they're not using it as a means of birth control.

Why is it any of my business? Are you serious? That just proves my point even more.....parents are nowhere NEAR as involved with their children these days as they should be.

This was about prolife intrusion in womens' lives in general, not just girls.

 

[jamesrage]

Not really, considering that abortion is a gaurenteed constitutional right to women, I don't see why it is that any girl that wants an abortion should be required to obtain permission from her parents.
Should the girls be required to ask permission from their parents to have sex? What would be the consequence if they do not?

Really?CAn you show us exactly where in the constitution that is shows that murdering a innnocent unborn child is guaranteed right?I do not recall George Washinton or any of our forfathers in history class saying "hey women should be inconsiderate selfish ****s who do not care about anyone else but thenselve and be allowed to murder their unborn child".Do have any quotes by the writers of the consitution reguarding a woman being able to murder her innocent unborn child?

 

[jfuh]

Did you actually read what i typed?
1, if a minor is in moral or physical danger then it is the duty of the doctors to notify social services.

regarding the abortion? or regarding the possibility of incest?

2, Parental notification plays a part in the saftey of the minor whether you want it to or not if my child had a termination and i didn,t know and she suddenly became achy feverish and shivery i and many other parents would asume the common cold wake up next morning to find our child dead of scepticimia.

That would really only occur if the child was fearful of the parents outlook on matters in the first place. Which is a greater problem that has to do with the open and outspokeness of the parent with the child.
As for septicemia, this is really the case only when the individuals getting an abortion have no ability of getting one in an actual hospital environment from an unlicensed physician. There are so many limits on abortion that few physicians are willing to perform abortions. The more limits put on abortion the less safe it will be for the woman recieving it. It's easier to get a heart transplant than it would be to get an abortion in some states.

3, sorry that should have read the mothers god given duty to protect their child from sexual predetors you would deny the mother the right to protect and the child the right to be protected?

I don't think I was in anyway indicative or suggestive of that.

4 i said the right to protect from possible complications from a medical procedure not protect from medical procedures.

I fail to see how notification would prevent complications from a medical procedure. It is obvious thus far that you support the girl getting an abortion and simply want to be notified of it. Well I don't see how notification would in anyway prevent or protect from a complication.

 

[Stace]

I fail to see how notification would prevent complications from a medical procedure. It is obvious thus far that you support the girl getting an abortion and simply want to be notified of it. Well I don't see how notification would in anyway prevent or protect from a complication.

Notification may not prevent complications, but it would better equip parents/guardians to be on the lookout for signs of complications, so that the girl could receive timely medical treatment.

 

[jfuh]

Notification may not prevent complications, but it would better equip parents/guardians to be on the lookout for signs of complications, so that the girl could receive timely medical treatment.

If the notification were after, possibly. But realistically, just the essence of there being a notification could put many girls at risk.
It's like going throwing a party at the house when the parents were out on the weekend. She may do it because she knows that they wouldn't know, but if she knew they would find out, she wouldn't throw the party. Same with an abortion, she will try so desperatly to conceal the fact she got knocked up that she may not get an abortion and delay till it's much later, or she may go to back alley abortions, putting herself at much greater risk. You can't stop kids from making stupid mistakes, that's life, but you can help to make it so that they have a healthy mindset of confronting and dealing with such issues.

 

[steen]

Really?CAn you show us exactly where in the constitution that is shows that murdering a innnocent unborn child is guaranteed right?

There is no such thing anymore than there are undead corpses. And as abortion doesn't fit the definition of 'murder," all you are doing is spewing silly, revisionist linguistic hyperbole completely void of fact. Almost as if you believe that moral fervor is a substitute for actual knowledge and facts?

 

[jamesrage]

There is no such thing anymore than there are undead corpses.

A child was denied the right to be born by a selfish **** therefore it is unborn child/baby.

And as abortion doesn't fit the definition of 'murder,"

Seems to fit the definition

murder
Function: verb
Inflected Form(s): mur·dered; mur·der·ing /'m&r-d(&-)ri[ng]/
transitive senses
1 : to kill (a human being) unlawfully and with premeditated malice
2 : to slaughter wantonly : SLAY
3 a : to put an end to b : TEASE, TORMENT c : MUTILATE, MANGLE <murders French> d : to defeat badly
intransitive senses : to commit murd