One of these days....

[GEIxBattleRifle]

Yep, because women are solely responsible for pregnancies.

They're but how they ''should'' handle it is where the disagreement is at.

Pro choicers allow women the option to continue carrying the human to term or not while pro lifers want to eliminate that option

 

[nota bene]

Yep, because women are solely responsible for pregnancies. Clearly you fall into the category willingly before artificial uteri of being anti-choice for misogynistic reasons.

I find your accusations that another woman is a misogynist very troubling.

 

[Summerwind]

I find your accusations that another woman is a misogynist very troubling.

Whereas I find it troubling that so many are misogynists. Seriously you think women can't want a misogynistic society? Uhm, who do think does the task of FGM to their daughters?

 

[nota bene]

Whereas I find it troubling that so many are misogynists. Seriously you think women can't want a misogynistic society? Uhm, who do think does the task of FGM to their daughters?

What does FGM mean?

I don't find many women to be misogynistic, period. The ones I have, lifelong, have been stand-by-your-man bubbleheads who have less respect for their own gender than they do for men (or for power), which I think is terribly sad.

As for your particular point, you seem to be suggesting that women who don't support your pro-choice views are by default misogynists. That's an indefensibly dumb point of view, IMO.

 

[Summerwind]

What does FGM mean?

I don't find many women to be misogynistic, period. The ones I have, lifelong, have been stand-by-your-man bubbleheads who have less respect for their own gender than they do for men (or for power), which I think is terribly sad.

As for your particular point, you seem to be suggesting that women who don't support your pro-choice views are by default misogynists. That's an indefensibly dumb point of view, IMO.

FGM - Female Genital Mutilation a practice in many sects in third world ME and African nations as well as some sects in other countries.

SO you do know misogynistic women.

I am suggesting it, yes. Depending on their answer. If they think under the theorized circumstances that they would not put their money and their lives as responsible for that embryo, then tell me the next reason the woman should be forced to, if it isn't just meant to be punitive to women who have had sex willingly or otherwise that ended up in a pregnancy.

 

[nota bene]

I never felt tasked with explaining female genital mutilation to my daughter. That's because we live in the United States and where it isn't at issue. I mean, really. What a bizarre, irrelevant question to ask.

Sure, I've met a few misogynistic women over the course of my lifetime and also a few misandrists. So? Relevance?

 

[JayDubya]

No, Summer, my wife is not a misogynist, my mom is not a misogynist, nota here is most certainly not a misogynist, and your "suggestion" is both ignorant and stupid.

 

[Summerwind]

I never felt tasked with explaining female genital mutilation to my daughter. That's because we live in the United States and where it isn't at issue. I mean, really. What a bizarre, irrelevant question to ask.

Sure, I've met a few misogynistic women over the course of my lifetime and also a few misandrists. So? Relevance?

Let's see you suggest women can't be misogynistic, then you say you know bubbleheads that are misogynistic. So you do know some.

You say I shouldn't call women misogynistic but you don't realize that FGM is performed by the women of the tribe upon the daughters of the tribe. The mothers use a piece of glass and cut their daughters' labia and clitoris off and slice the vaginal edges to expose two raw sides that can heal together and stitch their vaginas nearly shut. I wasn't asking if you discussed it with your daughters, I asked who do think performs such a misogynistic act, certainly not men.

Not a bizarre question, just not comprehended.

 

[Summerwind]

No, Summer, my wife is not a misogynist, my mom is not a misogynist, nota here is most certainly not a misogynist, and your "suggestion" is both ignorant and stupid.

Then if the life of the unborn can be offset to those that value embryos, and those folks don't step up and take them. What other reason is there to force a woman to bear an unwanted child, except to be punitive. Punitive measures against a woman whereas similar measures are not leveled against the man involved is misogynistic, regardless of whether a woman or a man support those measure.

 

[nota bene]

Let's see you suggest women can't be misogynistic, then you say you know bubbleheads that are misogynistic. So you do know some.

I have never suggested that women can't be woman-haters; obviously, Summerwind, women can behave in all sorts of strange ways. What I did say is that I have run across a few in the course of a lifetime. This isn't exactly news for most people and--stick with me here--what I was trying to suggest is that although unusual and rare, it's not impossible. :roll:

You say I shouldn't call women misogynistic but you don't realize that FGM is performed by the women of the tribe upon the daughters of the tribe. The mothers use a piece of glass and cut their daughters' labia and clitoris off and slice the vaginal edges to expose two raw sides that can heal together and stitch their vaginas nearly shut. I wasn't asking if you discussed it with your daughters, I asked who do think performs such a misogynistic act, certainly not men.

Sorry; you're just not going to gain any traction here talking about what women in far-distant countries with wildly different cultures than our own are doing/not doing. I'm embarrassed for you that you're actually trying to make some point when there is none to make.

Not a bizarre question, just not comprehended.

And now you insinuate that I'm not able to comprehend what you said. Trust, I do--it wasn't exactly deep or requiring of significant intellect, just enough to recognize a red herring when I saw it. Give up on the female mutilation thing if you want to discuss abortion in America please.

 

[Summerwind]

I have never suggested that women can't be woman-haters; obviously, Summerwind, women can behave in all sorts of strange ways. What I did say is that I have run across a few in the course of a lifetime. This isn't exactly news for most people and--stick with me here--what I was trying to suggest is that although unusual and rare, it's not impossible. :roll:



Sorry; you're just not going to gain any traction here talking about what women in far-distant countries with wildly different cultures than our own are doing/not doing. I'm embarrassed for you that you're actually trying to make some point when there is none to make.



And now you insinuate that I'm not able to comprehend what you said. Trust, I do--it wasn't exactly deep or requiring of significant intellect, just enough to recognize a red herring when I saw it. Give up on the female mutilation thing if you want to discuss abortion in America please.

Well that's all a very disagreeable way of recognizing that women can be woman-haters, ie misogynists. Thank you.

 

[JayDubya]

Then if the life of the unborn can be offset to those that value embryos, and those folks don't step up and take them.

What other reason is there to force a woman to bear an unwanted child, except to be punitive. Punitive measures against a woman whereas similar measures are not leveled against the man involved is misogynistic, regardless of whether a woman or a man support those measure.

Just because someone is misanthropic like you does not entitle them to abdicate responsibility for their actions.

On the contrary if it's your kid, YOU should pay for this scifi artificial gestation machine while you make arrangements for adoption. You seem to think the existence of this thing would change things much...

You also seem to have an unrealistic idea about abortion procedures and what happens to the kid. It isn't just simple detachment and then death from lack of oxygen. Often there is a bloody and violent death, cutting, stabbing, and shearing.

 

[nota bene]

Well that's all a very disagreeable way of recognizing that women can be woman-haters, ie misogynists. Thank you.

I'm going to leave you to your illogical silliness now because I'm not a pearl-casting enthusiast. :2wave:

 

[Summerwind]

Just because someone is misanthropic like you does not entitle them to abdicate responsibility for their actions.

On the contrary if it's your kid, YOU should pay for this scifi artificial gestation machine while you make arrangements for adoption. You seem to think the existence of this thing would change things much...

You also seem to have an unrealistic idea about abortion procedures and what happens to the kid. It isn't just simple detachment and then death from lack of oxygen. Often there is a bloody and violent death, cutting, stabbing, and shearing.

How come the man doesn't have the same responsibility?
Not unrealistic, but the same thing happens in plastic surgeries, life saving surgeries, and I don't see anyone saying that should be illegal cutting, stabbing, shearing, and sometimes death. That's what surgeons do.

 

[JayDubya]

How come the man doesn't have the same responsibility? .

A father should have equal responsibility to pay any costs of prenatal care and birth. I have never said otherwise.

Neither mother nor father should be legally permitted to hire a contract killer to kill their offspring.

 

[Summerwind]

A father should have equal responsibility to pay any costs of prenatal care and birth. I have never said otherwise.

Neither mother nor father should be legally permitted to hire a contract killer to kill their offspring.

Equal money, but not equal. Surely you see that. The woman looses work time and pay, if not her job at some point, she has all physical, emotional, and psychological effects of pregnancy, and that's if she sends it to adoption, if not, well.... Still very one sided.

 

[polgara]

Giving birth to every conception would bankrupt this country.

:agree: However, in early human history, a fertile woman was highly valued, both by her clan for the status she brought to the clan, and by men from other clans looking for a life partner.

Fast forward 100,000 years to the present, and we are now looking at seven billion of us on this planet, many of whom live in abject poverty. Ability to reproduce ourselves is no longer a problem...even China has adopted the one-child policy to check population growth...but now we have the worry of limited resources such as drinkable water and food for all those people. How much stress can this planet take?

Greetings, KevinKohler. :2wave:

 

[JayDubya]

Equal money, but not equal. Surely you see that. The woman looses work time and pay, if not her job at some point, she has all physical, emotional, and psychological effects of pregnancy, and that's if she sends it to adoption, if not, well.... Still very one sided.

I'm getting whiplash from watching this much goalpost moving...

First you say you expect me to demand responsibility be taken by the father. I did and I always have.

Now you're all "it's just not the same."

Well no, we are a species with gender and all. A loving partner will help alleviate the downsides of pregnancy the best they can, though.

 

[Scrabaholic]

Give up on the female mutilation thing if you want to discuss abortion in America please.

You think FGM doesn't happen in your country? You'd be wrong.

Thomson Reuters Foundation | News, Information and Connections for Action

And, in case someone doesn't like the source, a google search will bring up more.

 

[Scrabaholic]

I'm going to leave you to your illogical silliness now because I'm not a pearl-casting enthusiast. :2wave:

And you say you don't throw insults .......

 

[Summerwind]

I'm getting whiplash from watching this much goalpost moving...

First you say you expect me to demand responsibility be taken by the father. I did and I always have.

Now you're all "it's just not the same."

Well no, we are a species with gender and all. A loving partner will help alleviate the downsides of pregnancy the best they can, though.

You claimed an equality that doesn't exist if you're only considering monetary costs. It seemed you needed that pointed out, and apparently still do.

 

[Thrilla]

One of these days, probably not too far away, we're going to find out for sure that anti-choicers don't care for the zygote or fetus, not really, what they want is the continued forced disability that unwanted pregnancies and unwanted children cause women. So what's going to change, in my strange future world that will prove this?

Before too long I imagine, embryos will be able to be grown outside the body entirely. Basically I believe artificial wombs are probably not too far off into the future. So when that happens, the pro-lifers will be able to buy unwanted pregnancies and take up all the responsibiliities for that embryo through the remainder of it's gestation, birth, and life up to age 18. Any guesses how many won't be bought up? Any? Y'know I'm sure someone who hasn't been able to get pregnant, or a single woman, regardless of their position on abortion, and they will choose the one's that happened between the prom queen and football captain, not the single other of three. I bet there will NOT be a rush of the pro-lifers with no other motivation than pro-life that will step up and buy any of 'em.

They don't give a true crap about that zygote, they just need to keep women down.

so you are going to talk **** about people who won't take of a zygote that was not created by them, but stand up for women who do not take care of zygotes they actually created....

seem to me you should be celebrated folks who take those zygotes from these future artificial wombs, and throw them in the trash... at least that would be consistent with your position on the issue.


in any event , you need to reevaluate your claim that pro-lifers are misogynists... it's a pretty stupid claim to make

 

[Summerwind]

so you are going to talk **** about people who won't take of a zygote that was not created by them, but stand up for women who do not take care of zygotes they actually created....

seem to me you should be celebrated folks who take those zygotes from these future artificial wombs, and throw them in the trash... at least that would be consistent with your position on the issue.


in any event , you need to reevaluate your claim that pro-lifers are misogynists... it's a pretty stupid claim to make

Bless your heart.

 

[Thrilla]

Bless your heart.

:lol:

come on lady.. that was pretty lazy.:lol:

 

[Goshin]

One of these days, probably not too far away, we're going to find out for sure that anti-choicers don't care for the zygote or fetus, not really, what they want is the continued forced disability that unwanted pregnancies and unwanted children cause women. So what's going to change, in my strange future world that will prove this?

.

You seriously think that?

Really?



I mean... really really?


:wassat1: