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Oceangate Titan: analysis of an insultingly predictable failure

It will certainly be fought in court. Those pursuing the case will get discovery regarding the safety of the craft and any other dirt they can find. I'm sure they won't just demand a refund they'll want punitive damages which could be harder to prove. Or they might just discreetly settle.
 
Rexedgar said:
Understood, one never hears that the deceased was screaming, in ungodly pain and begging for their mama…….


Edit: according to reports, the Navy forwarded the information to the CG, but the results weren’t conclusive.
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They also see the resulting debris field. I don't know how much more evidence you need to believe it was instantaneous as possible. They would be making something up if they said otherwise.
 
Rexedgar said:
I’m disappointed in the pictures that I have seen of the well worn trail up Everest. What is wrong with the authorities that they don’t track what is taken up and make sure that an equal amount or the waste, comes down?
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They did start a bounty program for returning Oxygen bottles and other junk with mixed results.
 
I want to scream every time I see an interview with Stockton Rush where he states innovation is impossible without breaking the rules.

Thank God he didn't work for Boeing or Airbus.
 
Allan said:
I want to scream every time I see an interview with Stockton Rush where he states innovation is impossible without breaking the rules.

Thank God he didn't work for Boeing or Airbus.
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737 MAX ring a bell?

Those jets were in service to Ethiopian Airlines and Lion Air in Jakarta, not United or Delta……..
 
Allan said:
I want to scream every time I see an interview with Stockton Rush where he states innovation is impossible without breaking the rules.

Thank God he didn't work for Boeing or Airbus.
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Apparently a good imitation worked for Boeing only in their case it was greed not innovation.
 
Rexedgar said:
737 MAX ring a bell?

Those jets were in service to Ethiopian Airlines and Lion Air in Jakarta, not United or Delta……..
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Yes but that innovative was within a framework of testing and approval.
 

It will certainly be interesting, I think there’ll be communications that will be pretty damning, texts, emails, internal memos, WhatsApps probably all showing that he was fully aware and advised of the shortcomings of the craft, the danger it posed to the passengers and how he responded to that.

Time will tell, but given the little we know already at the damning reports and court documents show there was no way Stockton wasn’t aware of the concerns from the engineering team about the design.

I guess the legal question might come down to, were the passengers fully aware even with a death waiver of the shortcomings of the vessel.

If the leaked waiver is real clause 2 reads:

2. A portion of the operation will be conducted inside an experimental submersible vessel. The experimental submersible vessel has not been approved or certified by any regulatory body and may be constructed of materials that have not been widely used in human occupied submersibles.

Does that truly cover “we knew and were advised that the vessel contained potentially catastrophic flaws and we decided to use it anyway”.

Guess we’ll find out.

Edit: and just to make things extra spicy… if the leaked waiver document is real, the company is registered in the Bahamas. So that complicates any potential legal action. But I don’t know the intricacies of that.
 
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I resisted chiming in early. I hold your contributions to the board in high regard, but turning this into a skins and shirts issue is troublesome. Some of the generalities are valid, but overall this was a misfire, imo.
 
Rexedgar said:
Where was it tested?
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The system had been around for a while and was tested as to it's effectiveness in pulling out of stalls. What Boeing didn't do was test for the potential of a malfunctioning sensor.
 
Allan said:
The system had been around for a while and was tested as to it's effectiveness in pulling out of stalls. What Boeing didn't do was test for the potential of a malfunctioning sensor.
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I’m just ****ing with you, but you haven’t answered my question.
 
Rexedgar said:
I’m just ****ing with you, but you haven’t answered my question.
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Yes it was tested. No I don't have links. If I had links I wouldn't share them with you.

So there.

 
Allan said:
Yes it was tested. No I don't have links. If I had links I wouldn't share them with you.

So there.

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It was tested on the well tanned folks. I had no idea that Ethiopia had an airline.


 
Still, their goal and business model was to have safe successful repeatable voyages to the shipwreck and back. Personally I'd rather go see the Grand Canyon. A lot safer (though people die there too). But only when they use conservative guides who guide them into a bottomless pit.
 
ASHES said:
Coast Guard just released that they're bringing up the debris for their investigation.
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They're going to find microscopic stress fractures.
 
EdwinWillers said:
This tragedy had nothing to do with American conservatism or "poor Republicans" not learning some stupid lesson you imagine they need to learn.
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Right, it was used as an analogy. Do you understand what an analogy is?
 

It’s a good point and having read the replies from the usual suspects I’ll just say that they would at the same time vote into office politicians that champion deregulation while claiming no fault when a disaster happens for lack of regulation.

No personal responsibility just finger pointing and obstinate voting patterns despite consequences to the public and the planet. Republicanism is both a religion and a fantasy world. Where devotion to the GOP is paramount and reality is mix and match whatever makes them feel better about voting for politicians that actively harm the planet and the public
 
??? Um, What does that have to do with the price of anything anywhere?

Fact is, in this situation, that's precisely what happened. Death was instantaneous. So what's this nonsense about you feeling a need that I be "aware" of something?
 
ASHES said:
Coast Guard just released that they're bringing up the debris for their investigation.
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That's excellent. Thanks for sharing. We should eventually have definitive proof of what caused this tragedy.

My guess is what one of the previous engineers stated about carbon fiber stressing in this environment; that yes, the Titan's carbon fiber shell could take them to 4000 meters - once, maybe twice, but that the strength of the hull deteriorated significantly with each dive.
 
EdwinWillers said:
??? Um, What does that have to do with the price of anything anywhere?

Fact is, in this situation, that's precisely what happened. Death was instantaneous. So what's this nonsense about you feeling a need that I be "aware" of something?
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If you can’t connect the dot, I can’t help.
 
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