NPR Takes Condescending Tone to Hate On Texas

[code1211]

The windmills are not the problem, there are windmills in Antarctica for example. The problem is that ERCOT did not mandate that power generation capabilties be able to operate in this sort of cold weather.

I should think that while the windmills are not THE problem, they are a part of the problem.

How much is spent on a thing that may not happen or will only happen quite rarely was probably the consideration that led to this.

Sometimes horribly large effects that seem obvious in retrospect rise from causes that were minuscule at the time they initiated. The Butterfly Effect.

Benjamin Franklin > Quotes > Quotable Quote

“For the want of a nail the shoe was lost,
For the want of a shoe the horse was lost,
For the want of a horse the rider was lost,
For the want of a rider the battle was lost,
For the want of a battle the kingdom was lost,
And all for the want of a horseshoe-nail.”

― Benjamin Franklin

 

[code1211]

Bullshit

Well...

I hope you didn't labor over this treatise for very long.

It seems to have taxed every fiber of your being.

 

[Hamish Howl]

Bull shit! Biden is rejoining America to the elite European class as we speak. Soros, Gates, Bezos, Buffet, Bloomberg, and K Street super pacs outspend conservative donors by far. Further, liberals have captured the media and academia as well to fill out their chorus of screeching.

This post makes it sound like you guys are losers.

 

[code1211]

The moisture in natural gas freezes at 32 degrees just like any other water. When it freezes, valves no longer work.. why do you keep doubling on the windmill LIE?

From your post to which I responded:

"Can you prove that it was the windmills that failed first and caused the rest of it rather than the instruments that froze and the natural gas that was too cold to flow through the uninsulated piipe lines?

When YOU say:

"natural gas that was too cold to flow through the uninsulated piipe lines"

I assumed YOU were saying:

"natural gas that was too cold to flow through the uninsulated piipe lines"

What did I miss?

 

[BlueTex]

From your post to which I responded:

"Can you prove that it was the windmills that failed first and caused the rest of it rather than the instruments that froze and the natural gas that was too cold to flow through the uninsulated piipe lines?

When YOU say:

"natural gas that was too cold to flow through the uninsulated piipe lines"

I assumed YOU were saying:

"natural gas that was too cold to flow through the uninsulated piipe lines"

What did I miss?

The freezing of moisture in natural gas at low temperatures is VERY well known. Show me where I said "natural gas that was too cold to flow through the uninsulated piipe lines". I can find no post of mine with these words.

 

[code1211]

How often does this need to happen before you think they should do something about it?



Not like we had in 2019. I work with farmers that have been on the same land for 3 generations and they had never seen anything like it.



ZERO because it is totally private. There is no profit motive to winterize, as the people making those decisions are not the ones suffering.

What i think has nothing to do with anything regarding their course of action.

I don't work with framers and have no memory of the flooding in 2019. What were the dates of the flooding and where did it occur?

If the power generation is a public private partnership, that's interesting. Around here, Central Indiana, we have at least three companies generating power and/or maintaining the lines.

Maybe Texas needs to expand its local power providers. Competition rarely seems to hurt effectiveness.

 

[GolfingChef]

I don't work with framers and have no memory of the flooding in 2019. What were the dates of the flooding and where did it occur?

Are you serious? You do not recall entire fields flooded out? Farmers could not plant corn or soy beans due to the flooding. How the hell did you miss this living in Indiana?

No End in Sight for Record Midwest Flood Crisis

High waters continue to swamp towns and agricultural fields throughout the Mississippi basin

www.scientificamerican.com

2019 Catastrophic River Flooding - Center for Disaster Philanthropy

In 2019, there were 14 billion-dollar weather and climate change disasters. Three of them were floods along the Mississippi, Missouri and Arkansas rivers. Approximately 14 million people were impacted by flooding this year, while 200 million were at risk.

disasterphilanthropy.org

Midwest Floods of 2019—The Latest Disaster to Learn From

The flooding in the Midwest is the latest in a long line of catastrophic disasters that have climate change’s fingerprints all over them.

www.nrdc.org

 

[code1211]

Texas leaders failed to heed warnings that left the state's power grid vulnerable to winter extremes, experts say

Texas officials knew winter storms could leave the state’s power grid vulnerable, but they left the choice to prepare for harsh weather up to the power companies — many of which opted against the costly upgrades. That, plus a deregulated energy market largely isolated from the rest of the...

www.texastribune.org

I'll even suggest some good search terms... "recommendations 2011 freeze texas"

From the article, it sounds like the disaster level freeze events have all happened since 2011. That's interesting. Global Warming getting worse, but Freeze Events occurring more often.

Also that there are various providers within the state all contributing to the overall power produced. Reports on this seemed to point to one authority that ran it all.

It sounds like there IS one general organization overseeing the interconnectivity of the various providers in the Texas Grid.

RECOMMENDATIONS from the 2011 event seem to be the guiding lights in this. Maybe 2018 wasn't as bad? Recommendations and mandates are different things.

From a weather point of view, temperatures, I read in one source, have not been this cold and this prolonged in Texas for about 30 years.

Where I grew up in Minnesota, alternate heat generation capability at the local residence level was mandatory. Safeguards against freezing on EVERYTHING were common.

Below freezing temperatures in northern Minnesota are pretty common. The cost for warmth in Minnesota is a very justifiable expense.

Apparently, in Texas, the answer to this question is less obvious.

I was considering a move to Houston in the later 1970's. The description of the weather in Houston said there were two types: "Hot and muggy and Muggy and hot". Apparently, things have changed.

 

[BlueTex]

From the article, it sounds like the disaster level freeze events have all happened since 2011. That's interesting. Global Warming getting worse, but Freeze Events occurring more often.

Also that there are various providers within the state all contributing to the overall power produced. Reports on this seemed to point to one authority that ran it all.

It sounds like there IS one general organization overseeing the interconnectivity of the various providers in the Texas Grid.

RECOMMENDATIONS from the 2011 event seem to be the guiding lights in this. Maybe 2018 wasn't as bad? Recommendations and mandates are different things.

From a weather point of view, temperatures, I read in one source, have not been this cold and this prolonged in Texas for about 30 years.

Where I grew up in Minnesota, alternate heat generation capability at the local residence level was mandatory. Safeguards against freezing on EVERYTHING were common.

Below freezing temperatures in northern Minnesota are pretty common. The cost for warmth in Minnesota is a very justifiable expense.

Apparently, in Texas, the answer to this question is less obvious.

I was considering a move to Houston in the later 1970's. The description of the weather in Houston said there were two types: "Hot and muggy and Muggy and hot". Apparently, things have changed.

Do natural gas valves and regulators freeze in Minnesota? If not, why not?

 

[Slartibartfast]

I should think that while the windmills are not THE problem, they are a part of the problem.

How much is spent on a thing that may not happen or will only happen quite rarely was probably the consideration that led to this.

Sometimes horribly large effects that seem obvious in retrospect rise from causes that were minuscule at the time they initiated. The Butterfly Effect.

Benjamin Franklin > Quotes > Quotable Quote

“For the want of a nail the shoe was lost,
For the want of a shoe the horse was lost,
For the want of a horse the rider was lost,
For the want of a rider the battle was lost,
For the want of a battle the kingdom was lost,
And all for the want of a horseshoe-nail.”

― Benjamin Franklin

Windmills are just a way to generate power, they just need to be set up properly for a given environment.

I can see where Texas regulatory agencies would be biased towards hot weather and where this is an oversight. This is especially true given that it is well known how to winterize various types of power generation, making it a political versus engineering question.

It is up to Texas is they want to have their power plants be prepared for the next event, whether that is in one year, ten years, one hundred years, etc. If they determine the benefits outweigh the costs (benefits and costs being financial, political, ideological, etc)

 

[Closer]

Occasional loss of power in small areas is usually just an inconvenience. I would say you probably knew the difference, but clearly not.

I would say you are wrong, just making excuses for the fact that California's Bay area has the same problem maintaining its grid with no weather at all causing it to black out so frequently I kept a car battery on my patio so I could at least have light to read by for the many hours it remained off. I lose power around here for a couple of hours every 10 years or so when a transformer blows once in a while during a thunder storm. The BAy Areas loses it several time a year for no reason other its mismanagement.

 

[Closer]

Windmills are just a way to generate power, they just need to be set up properly for a given environment.

I can see where Texas regulatory agencies would be biased towards hot weather and where this is an oversight. This is especially true given that it is well known how to winterize various types of power generation, making it a political versus engineering question.

It is up to Texas is they want to have their power plants be prepared for the next event, whether that is in one year, ten years, one hundred years, etc. If they determine the benefits outweigh the costs (benefits and costs being financial, political, ideological, etc)

AS I said previously there is no economic incentive for them to expend money on the system. The govt. will pay for any upgrading, and the power comp anies will raise their prices anyway even though they got it for free.

 

[Closer]

Gov. Abbott's statement was a lie. The bulk of the reduction in power production in Texas was with natural gas powered plants. So instead of getting mad at a governor lying to the state he was elected to serve, you are angry with NPR for reporting the truth?

Ars does an excellent breakdown of what happened in Texas here: https://arstechnica.com/science/2021/02/even-power-disasters-are-bigger-in-texas-heres-why/

If you take reality as condescension, then God help you. Seriously.

Which part of 'the Green New Deal' do you think actually works? All I see are some subsisidies for a few wealthy people to install solar systems that take decades to recoup their up front costs and a few windmills the 'environmentalists' want to shut down because some bird species are too stupid to dodge the propeller blades. None of them are going to get anywhere matching the capacity of natural gas or nuclear, or even the wood and wood products renewables category. I mean besides the typical left wing and right wing solutions to all problems social and economic, mass murders of all inconvenient people.

 

[Slartibartfast]

AS I said previously there is no economic incentive for them to expend money on the system. The govt. will pay for any upgrading, and the power comp anies will raise their prices anyway even though they got it for free.

That seems to be how utilities work, with the mentioned graft.

 

[Closer]

That seems to be how utilities work, with the mentioned graft.

Yes, it's endemic in the U.S., where industry lobbyists get to write the legislation and contracts governing them at all levels and politicians never read any of the bills they sign.

 

[Closer]

From the article, it sounds like the disaster level freeze events have all happened since 2011. That's interesting. Global Warming getting worse, but Freeze Events occurring more often.

Also that there are various providers within the state all contributing to the overall power produced. Reports on this seemed to point to one authority that ran it all.

It sounds like there IS one general organization overseeing the interconnectivity of the various providers in the Texas Grid.

RECOMMENDATIONS from the 2011 event seem to be the guiding lights in this. Maybe 2018 wasn't as bad? Recommendations and mandates are different things.

From a weather point of view, temperatures, I read in one source, have not been this cold and this prolonged in Texas for about 30 years.

Where I grew up in Minnesota, alternate heat generation capability at the local residence level was mandatory. Safeguards against freezing on EVERYTHING were common.

Below freezing temperatures in northern Minnesota are pretty common. The cost for warmth in Minnesota is a very justifiable expense.

Apparently, in Texas, the answer to this question is less obvious.

I was considering a move to Houston in the later 1970's. The description of the weather in Houston said there were two types: "Hot and muggy and Muggy and hot". Apparently, things have changed.

It was once in a lifetime freak storm. The problem shouldn't have been as severe as they were, though, especially for the water systems.

Re Minnesota it has a bout a quarter of the population Texas does, and is growing bigger by the year, and that doesn't include millions of criminal illegal aliens already here and of course another 20 million on the way the Democrats are bringing in.

 

[Slartibartfast]

Yes, it's endemic in the U.S., where industry lobbyists get to write the legislation and contracts governing them at all levels and politicians never read any of the bills they sign.

Unfortunately the way we look at the first amendment allows for this form of legalized bribery.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

Which part of 'the Green New Deal' do you think actually works? All I see are some subsisidies for a few wealthy people to install solar systems that take decades to recoup their up front costs and a few windmills the 'environmentalists' want to shut down because some bird species are too stupid to dodge the propeller blades. None of them are going to get anywhere matching the capacity of natural gas or nuclear, or even the wood and wood products renewables category. I mean besides the typical left wing and right wing solutions to all problems social and economic, mass murders of all inconvenient people.

Whether the Green New Deal is a workable idea or not (I have been critical of it myself), is irrelevant because it has nothing at all to do with why Texas endured widespread power outages.

Texas endured massive power outages during last weeks cold spell down there because Texas is primarily a natural gas state in regards to the electrical generation and it did not mandate power suppliers implement weatherization measures on their natural gas power plants that states that most states require. Thus lines froze, power supplies constrained, and millions were left without power in near record breaking cold. Moreover, the state's grid is isolated from the federal grids, thus they could not draw upon supply from other states.

The problem was not wind or natural gas. There are wind farms all over the upper midwest where it gets much colder than Texas. There are natural gas power plants all over the upper midwest where it gets much colder than Texas.

 

[rocket88]

I would say you are wrong, just making excuses for the fact that California's Bay area has the same problem maintaining its grid with no weather at all causing it to black out so frequently I kept a car battery on my patio so I could at least have light to read by for the many hours it remained off. I lose power around here for a couple of hours every 10 years or so when a transformer blows once in a while during a thunder storm. The BAy Areas loses it several time a year for no reason other its mismanagement.

I think it's possible that both are mismanaged.

 

[Phys251]

Who gives a s*** when people are freezing to death? Can't we wait until the bodies are buried before we tear into each other? Grandstanding in the name of ?humanity is serving whom or what exactly?

"Hey folks, I know that y'all are suffering, but please remain calm until we've buried everyone and forgotten about you again."

That's basically what you just said. Texans have the right to demand answers, right now.

 

[Phys251]

You didn't just move tho goalposts, you literally transported them into another ZIP code altogether.

What in the name of **** does Cuomo have to do with Texas' power grid? Who has more responsibility to the people of Texas? Cuomo or Cruz?

You're not even making a cogent argument here..

What do 3rd world tech graveyards have to do with the power grid if Texas collapsing under the weight of the temperature going below 40?

And by the way, what is the genius Republucan plan for the tech graveyards? Moving technology back 200 years?

You are talking to someone who does not care that nearly 500,000 Americans are dead. What does he care if a few million Texans get to experience life in a third-world country?

 

[Aunt Antifa]

I read it. I've read several articles that all say the same thing. Where's the condescending part?

The reality. I think Republicans get very offended when they hear reality.

 

[Aunt Antifa]

Bull shit! Biden is rejoining America to the elite European class as we speak. Soros, Gates, Bezos, Buffet, Bloomberg, and K Street super pacs outspend conservative donors by far. Further, liberals have captured the media and academia as well to fill out their chorus of screeching.

Since when are these creatures all owned and operated by Democrats? Shelly Adelson, Mike Lindell, Peter Theil, etc, etc.

 

[Ikari]

No, The Blackouts In Texas Weren't Caused By Renewables. Here's What Really Happened



Important Info: NPR'S Corporate Sponsors reads like a list of Who's Who in the liberal activists community.

It's organized propaganda.

lol, it's not "organized propaganda". That would be places like OAN and The Blaze.
lol

 

[Lovebug]

"Hey folks, I know that y'all are suffering, but please remain calm until we've buried everyone and forgotten about you again."

That's basically what you just said. Texans have the right to demand answers, right now.

Screeching from behind the screen doesn't help anyone.